The Apocalyptic Beheaders

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You're missing my point that with the emergence of Islam as a threat to world peace..

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I take real exception with this idea for various historical reasons. Firstly, Islam is said to have emerged in around 632 and so has been with us for almost 1400 years. It certainly isn't a sudden occurance, and it's power as a culture can be said, if anything, to have waned from an early peak in the first centuries of the last millenium.Secondly, your post appears to make the assumption that Islam is naturally violent whilst Christianity is naturally non-violent. The truth is that as much violence has been done in the name of Jesus as has been done in any religion, nost notably the Crusades.Thirdly, I detect an inferrence that Islam is/has always been unenlightened. Again, this is not true. During the early centuries of the last millenenium is was Islamic culture that both lead and influenced the Christian world, produced notable strides forward in Mathematics and Astromony and preserved many classical Greek and Latin texts that have, since the Renaissance, become cornerstones of Western Christian culture.It is true that in recent years parts of the Muslim world have slid towards extremism, but this is a classic response to the position of economic and social powerlessness that many Muslims currently find themselves, which itself can be attributed to the failure of their societies to counter the rise of capitalist power and influence from the West.I agree with Jar here. The real enemy, if we have to produce one, is religious fundamentalism of ANY stripe.

Buzz and Brenn,Christianity in Britain had just about nothing to do with the establishment of Israel - if anything Britain eventually had to be pushed to accept it.The post war goverment in the UK was formed by the Social Democratic Labout party, who, amongst other things introduced nationalized healthcare and encouraged partially-nationalized industry. Amonst the top ranks of Labour at this time were many Socialist/Humanist atheists.The establishment of Israel was pushed by a combination of huge amounts of immigration by Jews to Palestine before and during WWII backed by a strong Zionist movement. Britain still had a great deal colonial power in the area (having been given a League Of Nations mandate to prepare Palestine for independence) and had made promises to the Zionist movement with regard to a new Jewish homeland within Palestine. However, at the same time they attempted to limit Jewish immigration to avoid an Arab uprising. In short, they were stuck in the middle. The emerging facts of the Holocaust, a low-level conflict with Jewish immigrants and pressure from the US eventually forced Britain to accept Israel's establishment at the expense of a greater Palestine and many Palestinians.This message has been edited by rjb, 04-18-2006 07:22 AM

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I think that generally when people talk about the role of Britain in the establishment of Israel they mean the Balfour declaration of 1917.....

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Agreed. But I think it's often forgotten that Britain, after the extent of the immigration that ensued became evident, had very real concerns as to the long term implications. It also must be remembered, given the context of this discussion, that British society itself (and the attitudes of its governments) underwent a sea change over those years.

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...not sanctioned by the fundamentals of the New Testament..

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This is disingenuous since it is common knowledge that fundamantalist Christianity draws copiously from the OT. New Testament or Old Testament, sanctioned by the Papacy or otherwise my point stands. The whole point about fundamentalism it that is uses whatever scripture is available to it as justification for extreme positions.With regard to the ultimate nature of Fundamentalism, I see little difference between Christian and Islamic versions. I would, however, argue that the current wave of violence by Islamic fundamentalists is given an extra boost by war, poverty and ignorance. Were the social conditions right, one would see the same types of behavior from hardline Christians.If, in some parallel universe, America was invaded and occupied by an Islamic power, how long do you think it would take for a Christian militia to arise somewhere?This message has been edited by rjb, 04-19-2006 12:54 PM