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Author Topic:   Trimming down the bulk - Proposed topics to be deleted
Percy
Member
Posts: 19042
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 16 of 24 (30122)
01-24-2003 10:58 AM
Reply to: Message 15 by John
01-24-2003 10:02 AM


Total usage is currently 260 MB.

Forum software is UBB 5.47c from InfoPop, though I've rewritten about 3/4 of it, and it does not use MySQL. Messages are stored as simple text files. I have nothing against MySQL, but one disadvantage is that many webhosting companies charge additional for it. For example, our current webhost charges $15/month for MySQL.

I'll soon be releasing a new revision that reduces disk usage, possibly by as much as 40%, but we'll have to wait and see the final result.

I plan to look into compression options next. There's an Apache module called mod_gunzip that I plan to investigate (but I think I'd have to persuade my webhost to install it), and if you know of any other viable options I'd appreciate knowing about them.

Another option is to simply not store static HTML files but instead build them dynamically upon request. This would place a greater demand upon the webhost, but hey, maybe it would encourage them to make disk space cheaper.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by John, posted 01-24-2003 10:02 AM John has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 18 by John, posted 01-25-2003 9:07 AM Percy has responded

  
Adminnemooseus
Director
Posts: 3910
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 17 of 24 (30137)
01-24-2003 4:42 PM


Quick comments.

I wouldn't think that the "reply quote" icon thing should make a difference. As I understand it, the support graphics are not stored with the individual pages, rather are imported when the page file is downloaded.

As per TC's idea, I've been doing some trials with zipping files. I downloaded and saved the 31 pages of part 1 of William Scott's flood topic (and if we're going to make a dent in the storage demands, at least some of those big topics are going to have to take a hit - the 1 Scott topic is much larger than the total of the 90 on my proposed list).

Anyhow, the 31 pages, without any of the support graphics, totaled to 3,572,152 bytes. Zipped, they totaled to 712,191 bytes, which is 20% of the bigger number.

I don't think the support graphics are really that important in an archived version. All the text information is there, the page just doesn't look as pretty. The one catch is that any graphics imbedded withing the individual messages will also be lost. Or I can include the graphics in the zipped files, but that would probably about double the files sizes. There may, however, be a problem getting things to link up correctly. ps: Those various graphic, that you have stored for import into the messages are probably a significant storage sum in themselves - for example, the diatom photos in the William Scott topics.

I think what we'll need to do, is to use the archive facility of the UBB, but instead of archiving the pages, archive a topic title with a link to the zipped file. I will post a copy of the zipped file, at my personal web site, and start a "Short Term Topic" with a link, but it will be a while yet. Maybe later tonight.

Adminnemooseus

------------------
{mnmoose@lakenet.com}


Replies to this message:
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John
Inactive Member


Message 18 of 24 (30167)
01-25-2003 9:07 AM
Reply to: Message 16 by Percy
01-24-2003 10:58 AM


Interesting, my web-host includes MySQL and PHP support with the most basic package. I didn't realize it was an 'extra.'

I'll let you know if I think of anything that might help. InfoPop is PERL, yes?

------------------
www.hells-handmaiden.com


This message is a reply to:
 Message 16 by Percy, posted 01-24-2003 10:58 AM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by Percy, posted 01-25-2003 3:04 PM John has not yet responded

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 19042
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 19 of 24 (30181)
01-25-2003 3:04 PM
Reply to: Message 18 by John
01-25-2003 9:07 AM


Yes, InfoPop is Perl.

--Percy


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 Message 18 by John, posted 01-25-2003 9:07 AM John has not yet responded

  
Admin
Director
Posts: 12653
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 20 of 24 (30188)
01-25-2003 3:50 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by Adminnemooseus
01-24-2003 4:42 PM


Adminnemooseus writes:

I wouldn't think that the "reply quote" icon thing should make a difference. As I understand it, the support graphics are not stored with the individual pages, rather are imported when the page file is downloaded.

You're right, the icon gif file itself takes up no space in the HTML file, but the reference to it, and even worse, the link with which the icon is associated, takes up a lot of space. Here's an example of the text for the reply-quote icon that was associated with each and every message (linefeeds were added by me to keep the line from being too long):

<A HREF="cgi-bin/postings.cgi?action=reply&forum=Geology+
and+the+Great+Flood&number=7&topic=53&TopicSubject=Solving+t
he+Mystery+of+the+Biblical+Flood+II&replyto=105&replyquote=Y
ES"><IMG SRC="ubb/quote.gif BORDER=0 ALT="Reply w/Quot
e"></A>

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by Adminnemooseus, posted 01-24-2003 4:42 PM Adminnemooseus has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 21 by Adminnemooseus, posted 01-25-2003 4:17 PM Admin has responded

  
Adminnemooseus
Director
Posts: 3910
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 21 of 24 (30189)
01-25-2003 4:17 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by Admin
01-25-2003 3:50 PM


Maybe we should disable all the reply buttons?

Adminnemooseus

"Programing shouldn't interfere with good equipment maintenance" - A radio engineering friend of mine


This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by Admin, posted 01-25-2003 3:50 PM Admin has responded

Replies to this message:
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Admin
Director
Posts: 12653
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 22 of 24 (30207)
01-25-2003 7:26 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by Adminnemooseus
01-25-2003 4:17 PM


Adminnemooseus writes:

Maybe we should disable all the reply buttons?

Smile when you say that, son, you're scaring me!

------------------

--EvC Forum Administrator


This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by Adminnemooseus, posted 01-25-2003 4:17 PM Adminnemooseus has not yet responded

  
Adminnemooseus
Director
Posts: 3910
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 23 of 24 (30798)
01-31-2003 12:58 AM


The previously proposed deletion list was based on the idea that those topics were destined for on-line oblivion (any archiving being off-line only). With the advancement of the idea of an on-line zipped archive, that has all changed.

Now, I am proposing that the topic database be filtered as follows, to select the topics destined for zipped on-line archiving (and deletion from the standard list of available topics):

1) All topics which have not been active since before 9/1/02.

2) All currently closed topics, regardless of recent activity.

3) All topics with 200 or more messages, regardless of existing status.

4) All the topics that are on my previous list of proposed topics, plus some that just missed make the list of "the doomed 90".

Running this filter on the database results in:

516 (of 994) topics proposed for archiving.
15,695 (of 30,475) messages proposed for archiving.

In a trial of zipping the first William Scott flood topic, I found that the zipped version of the 31 pages were of a file size 20 percent of the sum of the unzipped pages. Therefore, I am estimating that the new message space created would be - 15,695 x 80% = 12,556 messages.

So far this year, new messages are being posted at a rate of about 80 per day, or 2400 per 30 day month.

The bottom line is, I have calculated that the proposed archiving should make room for about 5 to 6 months worth of new messages, before we're up to the same as current amount of server storage space requirements.

As a footnote, I add that there could be other advantages:

1) The zipped file format would enable the easy downloading of a lot of material. Although the choice of preferred zipped file size is still to be determined - the William Scott example, by itself, was 696 kB. I would certainly accept suggestions for a general file size target. I anticipate that most of the zipped files would contain quite a few topics.

2) I am thinking of grouping topics into ones of like nature. This would include filing the "Great Debate" topics into more appropriate forums, and also filing other topics into more appropriate forums. There may well be sub-areas within the larger areas (i.e. "Geology and the Great Flood - TB's crackpot ideas", "Evolution - SLPx's cranky themes", and "Misc. - Brad McFall's topics" - Guess which one(s) of these I'm seriously considering, if not as titled). I will need to have an index page, to tell where to find a specific topic.

The following are links to:

1) Topics proposed for archiving - http://www.lakenet.com/~mnmoose/archive.htm

2) Topics not to be archived - to remain as is - http://www.lakenet.com/~mnmoose/not_arch.htm

Future editions of list 1 will (hopefully) include proposed topics groupings.

Suggestions can be made, for topics that should cross over from one list to the other. Also, there are several active topics that are flagged for strong consideration for closing (and thus for archiving).

Enough for now,

Adminnemooseus

------------------
{mnmoose@lakenet.com}

[This message has been edited by Adminnemooseus, 01-31-2003]


Replies to this message:
 Message 24 by Brad McFall, posted 01-31-2003 12:36 PM Adminnemooseus has not yet responded

  
Brad McFall
Member (Idle past 3367 days)
Posts: 3428
From: Ithaca,NY, USA
Joined: 12-20-2001


Message 24 of 24 (30857)
01-31-2003 12:36 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by Adminnemooseus
01-31-2003 12:58 AM


sounds good to me

This message is a reply to:
 Message 23 by Adminnemooseus, posted 01-31-2003 12:58 AM Adminnemooseus has not yet responded

  
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