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Author Topic:   NEPHILIM mYsteries
LudoRephaim
Member (Idle past 3246 days)
Posts: 651
From: Jareth's labyrinth
Joined: 03-12-2006


Message 31 of 134 (309039)
05-04-2006 12:51 PM


Neanderthal...
squared cube law is getting me to thinking...

6 feet tall, 200 pound man who can lift 100 pounds above his head.

doulbe height, multiply weight 8 fold, strength four fold (squared cube law)

12 feet tall, 1600 pounds, can lift only 400 pounds above his head.

Now Neanderthals where far stronger than humans. They could be 3 times stronger than a human (probably stronger)Now:

Neanderthal man: 5 feet 5 inch tall, 200 pounds. Since 200 pound human could lift 200 pounds, 200 pound Neanderthal (3 times the strength)could lift 300 pounds above head.

Double height, multiply weight 8 fold, increase strength by four:

10 feet 10 inches tall, 1600 pounds. Can now lift 1200 pounds! That would be in relative terms 1 1/2 times stronger than 200 pound modern human! If a few biological adaptions are made (especially lungs, as one website I posted in last post will show), this kind of giant could work. And if the muscles are adapted, so that this Giant would have greater strength to muscle ratio, he could lift far more than 1200 pounds.

Just a thought. Interesting though.


"The Nephilim where in the Earth in those days..." Genesis 6:4
  
LudoRephaim
Member (Idle past 3246 days)
Posts: 651
From: Jareth's labyrinth
Joined: 03-12-2006


Message 32 of 134 (309041)
05-04-2006 1:03 PM


This sqaured cube law is interesting in that nature seems to beat it. Consider Ursus (Bears): They come in massive sizes (Kodiaks have been known to be in the 1600-1760 pound range, one polar Bear was recorded to have weighed around a tonne (over 2000 lbs)!)and the ice age ones would make them dwarfs (Giant short faced Bear ( Arctodus Simus: 2205 lbs, 5 feet tall at the shoulder, could stand 11 feet tall when on hind legs, 1650 lbs Agriotherium, 1540 lbs European Cave Bear Ursus Spelaeus)Yet all the giant bears of today and the past came from Ursavus a "Dawn Bear" that was around the size of a fox or raccoon (possibly 30 lbs)From 30 pounds to 2205 pounds is far, far, FAR greater increase in size than an eight fold weight increase ie the squared cube law, yet this succeeded over time and numerous generations without the animals collapsing into a gooish heap. If this size difference can happen in animals like this (and dogs) then it should be quite possibl for humans to grow to a "giant" mass of 7 feet tall and 400 pounds on average, maybe up to 9 feet tall and 800 pounds, though anything 10 feet and above would probably have to change biologically to adapt to vast sizes like that to where a new species of human is born.


"The Nephilim where in the Earth in those days..." Genesis 6:4
  
LudoRephaim
Member (Idle past 3246 days)
Posts: 651
From: Jareth's labyrinth
Joined: 03-12-2006


Message 33 of 134 (309046)
05-04-2006 1:14 PM


"The IVP Bible Background Commentary: old Testament" mentions an ancient egyptian letter describing warriors that where 7-9 feet tall that where in Canaan. It also mentions two female skeletons dug up in the Transjordan region that where both around 7 feet tall.

I have not heared as of yet a finding of 9 feet tall human remains in Israel or anywhere else that is authentic, though it would be facinating to find. And 7 feet tall is quite impressive, especially to the Israelites, who where around 5 feet 7 inches tall on average. I be back and tell you the source to this info.

This message has been edited by LudoRephaim, 05-04-2006 01:31 PM

This message has been edited by LudoRephaim, 05-04-2006 01:32 PM


"The Nephilim where in the Earth in those days..." Genesis 6:4
  
LudoRephaim
Member (Idle past 3246 days)
Posts: 651
From: Jareth's labyrinth
Joined: 03-12-2006


Message 34 of 134 (309052)
05-04-2006 1:31 PM


This is the source for the average height of the ancient Israelites (Illustrated manners and custooms of the Bible, by J.I. Packer and M.C. Tenney, pages 450-451. It seems to show that not only was the average height of the hebrews 5'3-5'7, but that the average cananite was also of average height (though the Anakites where not average Canaanites, but legendary giants (see Alter)

A race of 6 foot tall humans could be seen as quite huge to the small israelites. 7-9 feet tall...


"The Nephilim where in the Earth in those days..." Genesis 6:4
  
LudoRephaim
Member (Idle past 3246 days)
Posts: 651
From: Jareth's labyrinth
Joined: 03-12-2006


Message 35 of 134 (309053)
05-04-2006 1:39 PM


It seems odd that many people dont realize that there was a Jewish Giant in the Bible: King Saul.

He is described as "head and shoulders" taller than any other Jew at the time (1 Sam 10:23)Now if the average height for Jews at the time where 5'3 to 5'7, and since a really large Jew could have been around 6 feet tall, it is estimated that King Saul may have ben 6 feet 6 inches tall to 7 feet tall ("The Victor Journey through the Bible" By V. Gilbert Veers, page 109.)

Strangely, this is around the same height of the Philistine Giant Goliath given By The Dead Sea Scrolls and the Septuagint (4 cubits and a span: 6 feet 6 to 6 feet 9!) If the older height of Goliath is taken to account, Saul seems to have been around the same size (possibly taller)yet even he was frightened at the sight of Goliath (1st Sam 17:11)and King Saul was no pushover: David described him as swifter than eagles and stronger than lions (2nd Sam 1:23)Yet he didn't seem to want to fight Goliath.

It is possible that the measure of Goliath's height in the Septuagint and the Dead sea scrolls was based on the greek cubit, which was 21:6 inches. Thus Goliath could have been 7 feet 8 to 7 feet 11 inches tall. Seems to be more frightening to Saul if he was this massive.

This message has been edited by LudoRephaim, 05-04-2006 01:46 PM

This message has been edited by LudoRephaim, 05-04-2006 01:54 PM


"The Nephilim where in the Earth in those days..." Genesis 6:4
  
LudoRephaim
Member (Idle past 3246 days)
Posts: 651
From: Jareth's labyrinth
Joined: 03-12-2006


Message 36 of 134 (309057)
05-04-2006 1:53 PM


There was a dude who came foward with a theory that Goliath reached such great height (Masoretic text: 9 feet 9) due to acromegaly, which can cause gigantism (Robert Wadlow, WWF legend Andre the Giant)If so, he stated that Goliath had tunnel vision, making him easy prey for David. Another dude said the same thing, and made the claim that Goliath, due to the disease, would have been abnormally weak and sweaty. I'll post a link, but you should google "Goliath+Acromegaly" to find it.

The idea that Goliath would be abnormally weak seems faulty though, considering that Goliath is described in the Bible as a warrior from his youth, as well as the fact that several people with Gigantism have displayed enormous strength (Paul Wight (aka wrestlers: Andre the Giant, Paul wight aka Big Show, and the Great Khali, each of which are around the 7 foot 400-500 lbs range)


"The Nephilim where in the Earth in those days..." Genesis 6:4
  
LudoRephaim
Member (Idle past 3246 days)
Posts: 651
From: Jareth's labyrinth
Joined: 03-12-2006


Message 37 of 134 (309059)
05-04-2006 1:59 PM


GIGANTO ape
And of course species of great ape have been known to have been gigantic: Gigantopithecus an ape believed by some (such as the late anthropologist Grover Krantz) to have been the legendary Bigfoot, was possibly 10 feet tall and weighed 600-1200 lbs, depeding on the source you read.

There is still a debate on whether Gigantopithecus walked upright like a man or knuckle walked like a modern ape (Gorilla)though either way that's one big'ol boy LOL.

If it walked upright (supposidly the jaws of Gigantopithecus are built more for a human like body posture than a knuckle walking Gorilla) it could give evidence that upright primates (ie humans) could one day become...Gigantic. Though if we would still be human or another species of human is another guess.


"The Nephilim where in the Earth in those days..." Genesis 6:4
  
LudoRephaim
Member (Idle past 3246 days)
Posts: 651
From: Jareth's labyrinth
Joined: 03-12-2006


Message 38 of 134 (309061)
05-04-2006 2:07 PM


BTW: When discussing if Giant humans races could be sceintifically possible, I will not invoke the supernatural. You could with the Nephilim (half angel after all) but when discussing the biological and physical possiblility of giant human species or races, I will use and only use scientific arguments.

Discussing giant humans scientifically is very interesting, and fun :)


"The Nephilim where in the Earth in those days..." Genesis 6:4
Replies to this message:
 Message 45 by macaroniandcheese, posted 05-04-2006 5:02 PM LudoRephaim has responded

  
LudoRephaim
Member (Idle past 3246 days)
Posts: 651
From: Jareth's labyrinth
Joined: 03-12-2006


Message 39 of 134 (309063)
05-04-2006 2:11 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by AdminJar
04-29-2006 4:24 PM


Re: Okay, moving
Amidjar? I would like this forum to be open to just a few more people. Could it be opened to other forum members? Tow heads are better than one, but multiple heads rule :) If possible, i would invite Nosyned, Jar, Faith, and another creo if possible.

This message has been edited by LudoRephaim, 05-04-2006 02:12 PM

This message has been edited by LudoRephaim, 05-04-2006 02:14 PM


"The Nephilim where in the Earth in those days..." Genesis 6:4
This message is a reply to:
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LudoRephaim
Member (Idle past 3246 days)
Posts: 651
From: Jareth's labyrinth
Joined: 03-12-2006


Message 40 of 134 (309066)
05-04-2006 2:16 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by AdminJar
04-29-2006 4:24 PM


Re: Okay, moving
Chiropetra and Buzzsaw would be good to.


"The Nephilim where in the Earth in those days..." Genesis 6:4
This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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AdminJar
Inactive Member


Message 41 of 134 (309069)
05-04-2006 2:37 PM
Reply to: Message 40 by LudoRephaim
05-04-2006 2:16 PM


Re: Okay, moving
There is nothing stoping anyone from posting in this thread but custom and lack of interest. Right now four or five of the posts were administrative, and twenty-nine are from (drum roll please) LudoRephaim. That works out to 80% of the time LudoRephaim is talking to LudoRephaim.

Maybe that well tell you something.


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  • This message is a reply to:
     Message 40 by LudoRephaim, posted 05-04-2006 2:16 PM LudoRephaim has responded

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    LudoRephaim
    Member (Idle past 3246 days)
    Posts: 651
    From: Jareth's labyrinth
    Joined: 03-12-2006


    Message 42 of 134 (309070)
    05-04-2006 2:39 PM


    Meganthro?
    Now there was a species of Homo Erectus, called Homo Erectus Meganthropus that was believed to have been a race of giant proto humans. A wikipedia article made their height and weight gigantic (9 feet tall and 750-1000 lbs!) though that article was artlered, and seemed to show that Meganthropus was not a giant, but super robust (built like a sherman tank LOL)One fossil skull I believe of Meganthropus seemed to hint at a incredible size, though it may just have been that one individual. I'll get the source.


    "The Nephilim where in the Earth in those days..." Genesis 6:4
    Replies to this message:
     Message 44 by LudoRephaim, posted 05-04-2006 2:49 PM LudoRephaim has not yet responded

      
    LudoRephaim
    Member (Idle past 3246 days)
    Posts: 651
    From: Jareth's labyrinth
    Joined: 03-12-2006


    Message 43 of 134 (309071)
    05-04-2006 2:40 PM
    Reply to: Message 41 by AdminJar
    05-04-2006 2:37 PM


    Re: Okay, moving
    Oh, okay. Fun while it lasted though :)

    I'll keep posting for fun's sake.


    "The Nephilim where in the Earth in those days..." Genesis 6:4
    This message is a reply to:
     Message 41 by AdminJar, posted 05-04-2006 2:37 PM AdminJar has not yet responded

      
    LudoRephaim
    Member (Idle past 3246 days)
    Posts: 651
    From: Jareth's labyrinth
    Joined: 03-12-2006


    Message 44 of 134 (309073)
    05-04-2006 2:49 PM
    Reply to: Message 42 by LudoRephaim
    05-04-2006 2:39 PM


    Re: Meganthro?
    Here's da source/link:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meganthropus

    The largest specimen was possibly 8 feet tall, and there was one slightly smaller, but the rest seem to be "in normal range" of Homo Erectus (meaning same species or same size range as Erectus I cant decipher at this time. I'll check later.)


    "The Nephilim where in the Earth in those days..." Genesis 6:4
    This message is a reply to:
     Message 42 by LudoRephaim, posted 05-04-2006 2:39 PM LudoRephaim has not yet responded

      
    macaroniandcheese 
    Suspended Member (Idle past 2090 days)
    Posts: 4258
    Joined: 05-24-2004


    Message 45 of 134 (309125)
    05-04-2006 5:02 PM
    Reply to: Message 38 by LudoRephaim
    05-04-2006 2:07 PM


    i think it's entirely possible that the references to giants or very strong people or whatever is just as likely a retelling of a very, very old story about some kind of humanoid creature that could communicate and perhaps pass as part man. so maybe these are examples of retellings of retellings of experiences with neanderthal or such. people have a long history of attributing divinity to things they don't understand.
    This message is a reply to:
     Message 38 by LudoRephaim, posted 05-04-2006 2:07 PM LudoRephaim has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 46 by LudoRephaim, posted 05-04-2006 5:11 PM macaroniandcheese has responded

      
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