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Author Topic:   What Does the Second Coming Entail?
RickJB
Member (Idle past 4990 days)
Posts: 917
From: London, UK
Joined: 04-14-2006


Message 76 of 238 (317664)
06-04-2006 4:48 PM
Reply to: Message 66 by CK
06-04-2006 11:44 AM


Re: Our first EvC conversion?
That link is first class!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 66 by CK, posted 06-04-2006 11:44 AM CK has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 77 of 238 (317709)
06-04-2006 6:52 PM
Reply to: Message 75 by Phat
06-04-2006 4:41 PM


Phat writes:
jhuger writes:
Please reconcile these two statements: "With God, nothing is impossible", "You can't be saved unless you accept Jesus as your savior."
Its obvious. with God, nothing is impossible. Without God, lots of things are impossible.
Huger's point would be: if nothing is impossible with God, then He could save us with or without our cooperation. Zap! You're saved!
Saying that He can't do it unless we accept Him diminishes His power.

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This message is a reply to:
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ramoss
Member (Idle past 612 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 08-11-2004


Message 78 of 238 (317726)
06-04-2006 8:52 PM
Reply to: Message 75 by Phat
06-04-2006 4:41 PM


Re: Our first EvC conversion?
Its obvious. with God, nothing is impossible. Without God, lots of things are impossible. We coould even start a spinoff thread on Huger, but I gotta go to work
That claim does not address the contradiction.
And, the story of 'Hank's ass'.. although a bit crude, in my opinion very accurately satires the behavior of many of the evangalists.

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Legend
Member (Idle past 5006 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 79 of 238 (318007)
06-05-2006 4:17 PM


*bump* for iano
Legend writes:
let's recap:
* Bob wants me to come to his club and he's paid the price.
* Bob says I have the right to be in his club.
* Bob says I can come in the club anytime I like, no catches.
so, can I come in Bob's club or can't I ?!

"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."

  
iano
Member (Idle past 1940 days)
Posts: 6165
From: Co. Wicklow, Ireland.
Joined: 07-27-2005


Message 80 of 238 (318021)
06-05-2006 4:52 PM
Reply to: Message 60 by Legend
06-04-2006 5:09 AM


Re: Our first EvC conversion?
iano writes:
that Bob has a nightclub up there at the top floor (which you have never seen)
Legend writes:
FAS, I'm prepared to believe that.
I'm not sure what 'FAS' means, but my question is: why are you prepared to believe this? And what has preparedness to do with it?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 60 by Legend, posted 06-04-2006 5:09 AM Legend has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 81 by Legend, posted 06-05-2006 5:57 PM iano has not replied

  
Legend
Member (Idle past 5006 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 81 of 238 (318056)
06-05-2006 5:57 PM
Reply to: Message 80 by iano
06-05-2006 4:52 PM


Re: Our first EvC conversion?
iano writes:
I'm not sure what 'FAS' means, but my question is: why are you prepared to believe this? And what has preparedness to do with it?
FAS = For Argument's Sake.
I'm prepared to believe, for the sake of this discussion, the things you've asserted:
* Bob wants me to come to his club and he's paid the price.
* Bob says I have the right to be in his club.
* Bob says I can come in the club anytime I like, no catches.
* Even if I spill some beer, Bob still forgives me.
I won't let the fact that neither of us has ever met Bob or know of anyone who's been to his club dissuade me from being prepared to believe that the above is true.
Now the next stage:
given the above, I assume it's ok for me to come in the club, right ?

"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 80 by iano, posted 06-05-2006 4:52 PM iano has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 82 by Phat, posted 06-06-2006 11:22 AM Legend has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 82 of 238 (318283)
06-06-2006 11:22 AM
Reply to: Message 81 by Legend
06-05-2006 5:57 PM


Re: Our first EvC conversion?
Im sure Ian would assert that he talks with Bob on a daily basis.
I've met Bob, IMHO and IMHB, and will say that there are no other clubs quite like His and no other owners quite like Him.
Legend writes:
I assume it's ok for me to come in the club, right?
You will know when you are to go to check out the club, but Bob usually likes to meet His guests beforehand. You will be receiving a personal call from Bob very soon. I'll leave it up to you two to arrange a meeting....let me know if I can help clear anything up.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 81 by Legend, posted 06-05-2006 5:57 PM Legend has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 83 by Legend, posted 06-06-2006 11:45 AM Phat has replied
 Message 84 by ramoss, posted 06-06-2006 2:14 PM Phat has not replied
 Message 87 by ringo, posted 06-06-2006 4:51 PM Phat has not replied

  
Legend
Member (Idle past 5006 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 83 of 238 (318293)
06-06-2006 11:45 AM
Reply to: Message 82 by Phat
06-06-2006 11:22 AM


Re: Our first EvC conversion?
Phat writes:
You will be receiving a personal call from Bob very soon. I'll leave it up to you two to arrange a meeting....
is that some sort of threat ?! LOL
are you and iano playing good cop / bad cop ?!

"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 82 by Phat, posted 06-06-2006 11:22 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 86 by Phat, posted 06-06-2006 4:26 PM Legend has not replied

  
ramoss
Member (Idle past 612 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 08-11-2004


Message 84 of 238 (318362)
06-06-2006 2:14 PM
Reply to: Message 82 by Phat
06-06-2006 11:22 AM


Re: Our first EvC conversion?
You will know when you are to go to check out the club, but Bob usually likes to meet His guests beforehand. You will be receiving a personal call from Bob very soon. I'll leave it up to you two to arrange a meeting....let me know if I can help clear anything up.
Well, I haven't seen or talked to anybody who has actually BEEN a guest at Bob's house. A lot of people say that they had a personal call from him, but they have never been able to give me their cell phone so I could hear this bob for myself.
Now, when I go to live someplace, I want to get some personal feedback. Can you arrainge for me to talk to someoen who has actually spent a few months at Bob's house, and let me interview them to see if it is all that it is claimed to be?
Not over the cell phone either.. Just a nice face to face talk.
Oh.. in addition.. I tried to call the number that was provided to me to reach bob, and all I got was 'This number is not in service, or temporiarly disconnected, no further information'.
Edited by ramoss, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 82 by Phat, posted 06-06-2006 11:22 AM Phat has not replied

  
Brian
Member (Idle past 4959 days)
Posts: 4659
From: Scotland
Joined: 10-22-2002


Message 85 of 238 (318378)
06-06-2006 3:47 PM
Reply to: Message 63 by Phat
06-04-2006 5:48 AM


He's gone, time to move on
Theoretically, your first impressions of Bob would not be tainted by second hand accounts of His eternal behavior
I don't have second hand accounts, I have the text that Bob told people to write down. it is in the same book that tells me how wonderful Bob is, so should I reject all of it or just the parts that doesn't make Bob look so good?
Seriously, you bring up a good point. Just WHO is this God, anyway?
Most likely, He was one of the Canaanite pantheon that the Israelites began to worship.
Do you really think that people will be judged at this 2nd Coming based on how they respond to the God described in the Bible and His 1st appearance?
Nope. Jesus is dead and gone, no second coming.
What of the ones who never heard the story? Will they be given more slack or will they be cruelly and massively deported to fiery torment?
Do you think it is impossible that your God would employ incidental players for His plan?
Brian.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 63 by Phat, posted 06-04-2006 5:48 AM Phat has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 86 of 238 (318388)
06-06-2006 4:26 PM
Reply to: Message 83 by Legend
06-06-2006 11:45 AM


Re: Our first EvC conversion?
Legend writes:
are you and iano playing good cop / bad cop ?!
Maybe.....(but it was unintentional on my part!)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 83 by Legend, posted 06-06-2006 11:45 AM Legend has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 87 of 238 (318394)
06-06-2006 4:51 PM
Reply to: Message 82 by Phat
06-06-2006 11:22 AM


Bob's first-tier guests
Phat writes:
I've met Bob, IMHO and IMHB, and will say that there are no other clubs quite like His and no other owners quite like Him.
Have you ever been to Bob's place up at the lake? Much nicer than that dive. Much nicer class of people. I like to watch the ducks.
By the way, I bet iano didn't think of the imagery of a "smokin' hot-spot" when he thought up that analogy. ("Free brimstone for the ladies during Happy Hour.")

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
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Larni
Member (Idle past 163 days)
Posts: 4000
From: Liverpool
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 88 of 238 (318610)
06-07-2006 7:09 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by Legend
05-27-2006 8:17 PM


Re: the whys whens and hows
Legend writes:
You see, God has a bit of a quirk: he is bound by his own rules.
Is this true?
Could you point to the chapter and verse?
If it is true it would really clear up several problems I have with my perception of the xian god.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Legend, posted 05-27-2006 8:17 PM Legend has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 90 by Legend, posted 06-07-2006 8:32 AM Larni has not replied
 Message 93 by iano, posted 06-07-2006 8:59 AM Larni has not replied

  
Larni
Member (Idle past 163 days)
Posts: 4000
From: Liverpool
Joined: 09-16-2005


Message 89 of 238 (318611)
06-07-2006 7:16 AM
Reply to: Message 14 by Legend
05-29-2006 6:26 AM


Re: My hangups
Are you saying that the xian god is a mean old bastard?
If you are I totally agree.
It could have left us in paradise.
But it has to play some manipulative petty rule rigged game.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by Legend, posted 05-29-2006 6:26 AM Legend has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 92 by Legend, posted 06-07-2006 8:41 AM Larni has replied

  
Legend
Member (Idle past 5006 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 90 of 238 (318635)
06-07-2006 8:32 AM
Reply to: Message 88 by Larni
06-07-2006 7:09 AM


God's quirk
there's not one single verse that sums it up but throughout the scriptures dozens of chapters point to one direction only, I think important verses are:
"For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh...." (1Pet 3:18)
"For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)
also reflected in Rom. 8:3-4, 2 Cor. 5:21 and many other passages in Paul's letters.
Note that is doesn't say "For God so loved the world that he forgave us all and invited us all back in" oh no, God had to see some blood on the floor, even if it was his own Son's!
Also note that Christ had to suffer for sins so that he can bring us to God. God likes to see someone suffer before he'll even think about forgiveness.
Throughout the bible you can see that when God gets miffed someone has to suffer. There are no two ways about it. 2Pet 2:4-9 sums up what God did in the good old days and also what he threatens to do in the future unless you accept that he had to make his son suffer instead of us directly (though we do still suffer in out daily lives....I know....don't ask)
You see, it's pretty clear that God isn't like you and I whereas we can forgive, forget and move on, oh no, God wants to see some blood on the matt and only then he'll begin to think about forgiveness (with terms & conditions ofcourse).

"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 88 by Larni, posted 06-07-2006 7:09 AM Larni has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 91 by iano, posted 06-07-2006 8:40 AM Legend has replied
 Message 97 by Phat, posted 06-07-2006 11:04 AM Legend has not replied

  
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