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Author Topic:   The definition of science: What should it be?
Rob 
Suspended Member (Idle past 4139 days)
Posts: 2297
Joined: 06-01-2006


Message 91 of 100 (327453)
06-29-2006 10:21 AM
Reply to: Message 87 by rgb
06-29-2006 4:02 AM


Re: AHH NOT AGAIN
See 90

This message is a reply to:
 Message 87 by rgb, posted 06-29-2006 4:02 AM rgb has not yet responded

    
Rob 
Suspended Member (Idle past 4139 days)
Posts: 2297
Joined: 06-01-2006


Message 92 of 100 (327454)
06-29-2006 10:23 AM
Reply to: Message 89 by PurpleYouko
06-29-2006 9:51 AM


Re: AHH NOT AGAIN
My comment was directed twoard purple dawn/ admindPD... Not you...

see 90


This message is a reply to:
 Message 89 by PurpleYouko, posted 06-29-2006 9:51 AM PurpleYouko has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 93 by PurpleYouko, posted 06-29-2006 10:46 AM Rob has responded
 Message 94 by AdminPD, posted 06-29-2006 11:27 AM Rob has not yet responded

    
PurpleYouko
Member
Posts: 713
From: Columbia Missouri
Joined: 11-11-2004


Message 93 of 100 (327461)
06-29-2006 10:46 AM
Reply to: Message 92 by Rob
06-29-2006 10:23 AM


Re: AHH NOT AGAIN
My comment was directed twoard purple dawn/ admindPD... Not you...

Funny you should say that since my answer was to RGB and not YOU.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 92 by Rob, posted 06-29-2006 10:23 AM Rob has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 97 by Rob, posted 06-29-2006 8:08 PM PurpleYouko has not yet responded

  
AdminPD
Inactive Administrator


Message 94 of 100 (327476)
06-29-2006 11:27 AM
Reply to: Message 92 by Rob
06-29-2006 10:23 AM


Warning - Rob
Rob,

If you have a comment concerning a moderator action, please take it to the appropriate thread.

PurpleDawn is not a particpant in this thread, so posting an inane message for PurpleDawn in this thread is a wasteful post and does not further this discussion, which is against forum guidelines.

If you are unable to keep your thread on track, then I will close it down.

All other participants, please refrain from useless one-liners.


Usually, in a well-conducted debate, speakers are either emotionally uncommitted or can preserve sufficient detachment to maintain a coolly academic approach.-- Encylopedia Brittanica, on debate

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  • This message is a reply to:
     Message 92 by Rob, posted 06-29-2006 10:23 AM Rob has not yet responded

      
    rgb
    Inactive Member


    Message 95 of 100 (327491)
    06-29-2006 12:56 PM
    Reply to: Message 90 by Rob
    06-29-2006 10:20 AM


    Re: Empiricism versus Revelation
    Rob writes
    quote:
    All of you are completely misunderstanding what I say...

    Rob, most of us aren't English proficient enough to correctly comprehend fortune cookie language or to read people's minds.

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 90 by Rob, posted 06-29-2006 10:20 AM Rob has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 98 by Rob, posted 06-29-2006 8:43 PM rgb has not yet responded

      
    Percy
    Member
    Posts: 18878
    From: New Hampshire
    Joined: 12-23-2000
    Member Rating: 2.5


    Message 96 of 100 (327502)
    06-29-2006 1:43 PM
    Reply to: Message 90 by Rob
    06-29-2006 10:20 AM


    Re: Empiricism versus Revelation
    So in other words, when you said:

    Rob writes:

    True science is not (in my opinion) material impericism, but metaphysical revelation.

    What you really meant was that the important questions aren't the mere mechanical ones regarding how the universe works, but ones dealing with issues like meaning and ultimate origins.

    Agreed.

    Metaphysics is a search for why the machine is here...

    Metaphysics is much broader than this. Theology is just one branch of metaphysics. It might be more accurate to say that religion is the search for meaning.

    Science is wonderful, but for too many people (perhaps, not you), it serves a purpose it cannot; to answer or deny the bigger existential questions...

    I'm sure you can find people who do this, but so what? This thread is about the proper definition of science, not about misapplication of scientific principles.

    --Percy


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 90 by Rob, posted 06-29-2006 10:20 AM Rob has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 99 by Rob, posted 06-29-2006 8:46 PM Percy has responded

        
    Rob 
    Suspended Member (Idle past 4139 days)
    Posts: 2297
    Joined: 06-01-2006


    Message 97 of 100 (327583)
    06-29-2006 8:08 PM
    Reply to: Message 93 by PurpleYouko
    06-29-2006 10:46 AM


    Re: AHH NOT AGAIN
    Funny you should say that since my answer was to RGB and not YOU.

    Yes, that is funny... :laugh:


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 93 by PurpleYouko, posted 06-29-2006 10:46 AM PurpleYouko has not yet responded

        
    Rob 
    Suspended Member (Idle past 4139 days)
    Posts: 2297
    Joined: 06-01-2006


    Message 98 of 100 (327599)
    06-29-2006 8:43 PM
    Reply to: Message 95 by rgb
    06-29-2006 12:56 PM


    Re: Empiricism versus Revelation
    Rob, most of us aren't English proficient enough to correctly comprehend fortune cookie language or to read people's minds.

    Sorry rgb. I have a tendancy to speak things that are spiritually discerned. As C.S. Lewis has mentioned somewhere, 'it is great fun', to be able to say things so exclusively understood. Such wonderful things, and in such a tempo as are the writing of the Apostle Paul.

    Even so, and assuming such insight is real and true, it does not help to play games with, or abuse such ability while conversing with non-believers.

    As you said, it is not you're fault that you cannot read my mind, and that is why I apologized for any confusion.

    It sounds like you understand my meaning now, and that is good. I think it is an important point as regards the differences between varying assumptions of the limitations and definitions of science.

    Any attempt to see clearly, the meaning or factual relevance of anything that exists, will not be fullfilled unless one can assume first, the bias for the existence of all things. The facts themselves can be interpreted through any number of assumed biases...

    What I find particularly useful is simply recognizing that since all things exist, then all things have a bias for existing. The only question answered that can ever truely show the proper way to view the facts, or any set of them is the question, 'what is the truth?'

    To answer that question in general, one needs to abandon any incoherent truth assumptions within the varying disciplines. If one's coherent naturalist assumptions about the universe, do not in turn cohere with one's coherent philosophical assumptions, then the whole system is broken. Either the philosophcal assumptions are incorrect, or the naturalist assumptions are incorrect, or both are incorrect.

    I believe this is why [the discipline of] morality was the method our Lord used to open the eye's of the blind (blind in the spiritual sense). We all are forced to accept a moral doctrine of some kind. As Ravi Zacharius so simply states, 'without a moral law, life is simply unlivable.' In a naturalistic framework, morality is utterly invented by man and is therefore not coherent.

    Morality is either exists, or it doesn't. If it does not, then the problem with man may well be his attempt to be something other than natural...

    Many will say that the definition of science has nothing to do with these arguments. Personallyt, I think everything has something to do with everything.

    You may wish to read the Great Debate between Sidelined and myself, for more to come on this particular angle (something) of the defintion of science (another something) as it pertains to everything.

    Rob


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 95 by rgb, posted 06-29-2006 12:56 PM rgb has not yet responded

        
    Rob 
    Suspended Member (Idle past 4139 days)
    Posts: 2297
    Joined: 06-01-2006


    Message 99 of 100 (327601)
    06-29-2006 8:46 PM
    Reply to: Message 96 by Percy
    06-29-2006 1:43 PM


    Re: Empiricism versus Revelation
    This thread is about the proper definition of science, not about misapplication of scientific principles.

    As I have showed in message 98, the definition of science if misapplied can cloud the vision of more important matters...

    However we define it, we must not restrict the single line from the rest of the disciplines...


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 96 by Percy, posted 06-29-2006 1:43 PM Percy has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 100 by Percy, posted 06-29-2006 9:27 PM Rob has not yet responded

        
    Percy
    Member
    Posts: 18878
    From: New Hampshire
    Joined: 12-23-2000
    Member Rating: 2.5


    Message 100 of 100 (327612)
    06-29-2006 9:27 PM
    Reply to: Message 99 by Rob
    06-29-2006 8:46 PM


    Re: Empiricism versus Revelation
    Rob writes:

    As I have showed in message 98, the definition of science if misapplied can cloud the vision of more important matters...

    And I repeat, this thread is about the definition of science. I won't help you draw the thread off-topic. If you'd like to discuss the misapplication of science and scientific principles to non-scientific realms then you might consider proposing a new thread.

    --Percy


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 99 by Rob, posted 06-29-2006 8:46 PM Rob has not yet responded

        
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