well, not neccessarily. first of all, semites are all the sons of shem, and that include arabs.
Exactly, but try explaining that to a peoples who just discredit the Bible. You point to Genesis 10 and they have no idea what its talking about. But you and I both know that its customary that Semites in modern terms it refers to Jews. But yes, Arabs come from the line of Shem as well.
and being hebrew-friendly doesn't require supporting every crazed zionist rant -- especially the ones that go off on the neighbours of zion.
Yes, very true. And I'm fully aware that Israel has its fair share of nutbags too. And I don't support them in any way. Half of the time I don't agree with any of Israels political idealogies. They are a nation just as polarized on the issues as America. But really, don't you think this coddling of only Palestine is incredibly unfair? I mean, the media has succesfully painted this picture that Israelis tromp through the streets like a bunch of Stormtroopers bent on destruction. It looks an awful lot like to me that they are are, you know, trying to exist. And certain special interest groups feel that they are unfit to exist. That's bs.
i'm all in support of a solid and peaceful state of israel. but that doesn't mean that i can't think israel should stay out palestine or lebanon.
At what point should Israel fight back? They aren't randomly attacking civilians. Is there going to be collateral damage? Yes. There was collateral damage in Iraq too, even despite precision weapons. I couldn't count on my fingers or toes how many times Israel has been attacked and has done nothing except sit on their hands. And the only reason they do so is because the US and UK implore them too. Because we all know what's going to happen. Now its happening.
i have a very deep respect for judaism in general, but that doesn't mean i have to support every extremist religious idea than any jewish person comes up with. are you going to call me an anti-semite too, for not supporting the modern zionist movement? i was quite amused when faith accused me of antisemitism -- lots of cognitive dissonance on that one. here i am signing all my posts in hebrew, and consistently arguing a jewish point of view on scripture, and i'm a jew-hater?
I don't know you well enough to call you an anti-semite. You don't give me that impression. You seem like a reasonable man/woman, unlike some of the other counterparts who are more of the malicious, ad hom'ish type who seem incapable of being reasoned with. And no, I don't expect you to swallow some radical Zionist notion. But we forget so quickly that these arguments are just a spin-off of Nazi propaganda. Its the same thing, different era. We're just waiting for the next Kristalnacht.
you can be anti-zionist without being anti-zion, or anti-israel, or anti-jew, or anti-semitic. i just happen to see the same kind of hate mongering in the zionist camps as i do in the fundamentalist islamic camps in palestine.
Well, I guess I would generally agree if only everyone was able to establish what "Zionism" actually means. Here is Dictionary.com's version. I happen to believe this is what Zionism really means and agree with it.
"A Jewish movement that arose in the late 19th century in response to growing anti-Semitism and sought to reestablish a Jewish homeland in Palestine. Modern Zionism is concerned with the support and development of the state of Israel"
somehow, that statistic does not suprise me.
Actually, I digress. I was born and raised in Miami which has a very large Jewish population. I think it used to be the highest population of Jews in the world. But I think that figure has changed. Israel is now the highest, 2nd to New York, and 3rd is South Florida. But then again, South Florida is a very large population, so I wouldn't know how to quantify that.
but yes, right now it is madness that anyone wants to move to anywhere in the middle east. but the particular point that i think brenna was highlighting is that most jews here are not israeli -- it's not their homeland; it's their holyland. they feel the connection to land not because they come from there, but because it is sacred to their faith.
The Jews are the only people to ever retain their entire, or nearly their entire, heritage, culture, religion, speech, etc afterbeing dispersed. And they haven't suffered one dispersion, they've suffered three major ones! Jews and their faith are practically homologous. For instance, a good friend I grew up with is a liberal Jew. There are many of them. He's in that limbo between God or no God, but for the most part he is secular. I asked him if he observes Jewish traditions. He conceded that he does. To which I replied, "But surely you are aware that Jewish tradition and the Torah go hand in hand. What meaning does Passover have apart from its religious symbolism?" He understood what I meant.
The point I'm trying to make is, Jews are a very unique peoples. They just are, right or wrong. There is no one earth like, right or wrong. And to be a Jew in their repatriated homeland must be very exciting for them. Instead of scoffing and mocking them, why aren't people celebrating that?
The reason is the Palestinians? What of the Palestinians? They've always been there! Actually, no, they haven't. After the Diaspora, Israel was scortched. It wasn't fertile land that it once or that is coming back today. And several missionary trips throughout many different ages revealed that it was little more than a Bedouin squat. Yes, the Crusaders captured the land. And yes, Moslems recaptureed it. But it never became the flourishing country that it was during the times the Jews inhabited it. Eventually, Israel was enveloped by the Ottoman Empire and when they collapsed, it was handed over to England. During that time, the Holocost ended, and thousands of surving Jews were displaced with nowhere to go. The timing couldn't have been more perfect, almost as if it were designed as such. (hint, hint, wink, wink). So the Balfort Declaration was signed. Immediately the Jews were met by resistance, even though the land was giving to them by the League of Nation (united nations). And they met resistence for one reason only.... the Dome of the Rock; the 3rd most holy site in Islam. Ever since then its been escalating into the disaster that it is today.
“Always be ready to give a defense to
everyone who asks you a reason for the
hope that is in you.” -1st Peter 3:15
™ Version 4.2
