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Author Topic:   Critique of Ann Coulter's The Church of Liberalism: Godless
Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 136 of 298 (333073)
07-18-2006 8:00 PM
Reply to: Message 134 by crashfrog
07-18-2006 7:38 PM


Re: Let's try this again
Why? Conservatives won't check her references, because they agree with her;
She has a team of editors that scour the NexusLexus database to ensure that what sh'e saying is verified empirically.
liberals won't read her books in the first place. Exactly what do you think she has to lose in a lie?
You don't get to have a New York Times bestseller without liberals reading it too. That's just the thing. When Al Franken writes a book, no cares. Conservatives, however, love reading Ann. And many liberals feel inexpicably compelled to read it. Its like waiting for a pregnancy test. Most of them just can't wait.
But thanks for tacitly admitting that you didn't read it.

“Always be ready to give a defense to
everyone who asks you a reason for the
hope that is in you.”
-1st Peter 3:15

This message is a reply to:
 Message 134 by crashfrog, posted 07-18-2006 7:38 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 139 by Omnivorous, posted 07-18-2006 8:12 PM Hyroglyphx has not replied
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Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 137 of 298 (333074)
07-18-2006 8:03 PM
Reply to: Message 133 by crashfrog
07-18-2006 7:37 PM


Re: Let's try this again
Don't you get it? She's totally serious. How do I know? Because when people ask her if she's totally serious when she says things like that, she replies that she's totally serious, and she means every word.
Okay, I've seen numerous interviews, and 1. I've never seen anyone even ask that question to her. 2. She's giggling the whole way through her interviews. Its satire... (though I'd be concerned if it wasn't)

“Always be ready to give a defense to
everyone who asks you a reason for the
hope that is in you.”
-1st Peter 3:15

This message is a reply to:
 Message 133 by crashfrog, posted 07-18-2006 7:37 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 145 by crashfrog, posted 07-18-2006 10:24 PM Hyroglyphx has replied
 Message 153 by ReverendDG, posted 07-19-2006 2:23 AM Hyroglyphx has not replied

Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 138 of 298 (333077)
07-18-2006 8:04 PM
Reply to: Message 135 by macaroniandcheese
07-18-2006 7:45 PM


Re: Let's try this again
arach specifically referenced lots of things... twice. you failed to bother to look
Where did he mention it? I'd genuinely like to see it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 135 by macaroniandcheese, posted 07-18-2006 7:45 PM macaroniandcheese has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 140 by macaroniandcheese, posted 07-18-2006 8:16 PM Hyroglyphx has replied

Omnivorous
Member
Posts: 3978
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005
Member Rating: 7.3


Message 139 of 298 (333078)
07-18-2006 8:12 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by Hyroglyphx
07-18-2006 8:00 PM


Re: Let's try this again
You don't get to have a New York Times bestseller without liberals reading it too. That's just the thing. When Al Franken writes a book, no cares[sic].
Your facts are like Ann's. You do understand that Al Franken writes bestsellers?

God gave us the earth. We have dominion over the plants, the animals, the trees. God said, ”Earth is yours. Take it. Rape it. It’s yours.’
--Ann Coulter, Fox-TV: Hannity & Colmes, 20 Jun 01
Save lives! Click here!
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC!
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This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-18-2006 8:00 PM Hyroglyphx has not replied

macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 140 of 298 (333079)
07-18-2006 8:16 PM
Reply to: Message 138 by Hyroglyphx
07-18-2006 8:04 PM


Re: Let's try this again
message 59
message 100
in case that's too hard, here's a quote. you'll have to go to the site for the links.
7/8/2006
All Coulter Plagiarism Allegations in One Post (Bumped Up For Your Weekend Reading Pleasure):
Update: The biggest problem with nearly all of the denials of the plagiarism charges against Coulter is that those doing the denying (including Crown Publishing) are basing their assessments on the examples from the New York Post article alone. It's actually a great deal more than what John Barrie's software disovered. To wit:
From the Rude Pundit:
July 1, 2005 - on Coulter plagiarizing descriptions of NEA-funded art.
June 9, 2006 - on Coulter plagiarizing in the first chapter of Godless.
June 13, 2006 - on Coulter plagiarizing part of a 60 Minutes transcript.
June 14, 2006 - on Coulter plagiarizing while discussing the Willie Horton case.
June 14, 2006 - on Coulter plagiarizing on page 37 of Godless.
From Raw Story:
July 20, 2005 - Following up on NEA-funded art description plagiarism.
June 14, 2006 - on Coulter plagiarizing a list of adult stem cell treatments.
From the New York Post:
July 2, 2006 - Reporter Philip Recchia gets John Barrie to run Coulter's book through Barrie's plagiarism identifying software, confirming some of the Rude Pundit's findings and discovering more examples.
From Media Matters:
July 6, 2006 - follows up on the Post article and the Rude Pundit's work.
That's where we stand. Is it enough to get Coulter's book recalled and her column cancelled? We shall see.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 138 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-18-2006 8:04 PM Hyroglyphx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 142 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-18-2006 10:09 PM macaroniandcheese has replied

SuperNintendo Chalmers
Member (Idle past 5834 days)
Posts: 772
From: Bartlett, IL, USA
Joined: 12-27-2005


Message 141 of 298 (333111)
07-18-2006 9:38 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by Hyroglyphx
07-18-2006 8:00 PM


Re: Let's try this again
You don't get to have a New York Times bestseller without liberals reading it too. That's just the thing. When Al Franken writes a book, no cares. Conservatives, however, love reading Ann. And many liberals feel inexpicably compelled to read it. Its like waiting for a pregnancy test. Most of them just can't wait.
That's because many liberals don't need anyone to tell them what to think.
Liberals generally aren't into the "echo chambers" and "parroting" that makes up much of the political discourse in this country.
Think about it.... if the right is so correct why do they have to continually reinforce this all the time and make sure they are continually telling people how to think.
Seriously, you should really think about this... and study similar episodes in history. (hint, read some of the stuff written by hitler's propaganda minister for a start)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-18-2006 8:00 PM Hyroglyphx has not replied

Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 142 of 298 (333123)
07-18-2006 10:09 PM
Reply to: Message 140 by macaroniandcheese
07-18-2006 8:16 PM


Re: Let's try this again
Thanks for presenting something Brenna. Just looking at these from our vantage point, they are baseless allegations. These are claims that she plagiarized, but why hasn't anyone transcribed her literature from the alleged material that she plagiarized from?
From the Rude Pundit:
July 1, 2005 - on Coulter plagiarizing descriptions of NEA-funded art.
In other words, show her words in comparison to the words of the article(s) that she allegedly plagiarized from.
June 9, 2006 - on Coulter plagiarizing in the first chapter of Godless.
The first chapter is 22 pages long. That's a lot of paragraphs, sentences, and words to narrow down. What, on the first chapter of Godless, did she plagiarize from?
June 13, 2006 - on Coulter plagiarizing part of a 60 Minutes transcript.
Which 60 Minutes transcript? 60 Minutes has been airing for over 30 years. That's miles of potential transcripts. Where are the specifics?
June 14, 2006 - on Coulter plagiarizing while discussing the Willie Horton case.
What did she plagiarize from? Court documents? Another book on Willie Horton by another author?
June 14, 2006 - on Coulter plagiarizing on page 37 of Godless.
What on pg. 37 did plagiarize and whom did she commit the alleged plagiary against?
July 20, 2005 - Following up on NEA-funded art description plagiarism.
What did she plagiarize and to whom she commit it against?
June 14, 2006 - on Coulter plagiarizing a list of adult stem cell treatments.
Where was the source of the original list that she plagiarized, and which book or article of hers is the alleged act contained?
That's where we stand. Is it enough to get Coulter's book recalled and her column cancelled? We shall see
These are baseless assertions at this point without a lick of specifics. I mean, if it was so clear to Barrie that she plagiarized, why hasn't anyone posted that information? Why couldn't anyone at least give the sources of plagiarized material so we could compare and contrast ourselves? Like I said, baseless.
In any case, I appreciate yoo providing something more than hearsay.

“Always be ready to give a defense to
everyone who asks you a reason for the
hope that is in you.”
-1st Peter 3:15

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by macaroniandcheese, posted 07-18-2006 8:16 PM macaroniandcheese has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 144 by macaroniandcheese, posted 07-18-2006 10:20 PM Hyroglyphx has replied
 Message 148 by arachnophilia, posted 07-18-2006 10:50 PM Hyroglyphx has not replied

Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 143 of 298 (333124)
07-18-2006 10:15 PM
Reply to: Message 116 by MangyTiger
07-18-2006 2:55 PM


Re: Is ignorance bliss?
I'm half tempted to try and read up some of her stuff to see if she's as great as NJ says or as bad as most of the rest of you say.
Even if you don't agree with her political flavor, its a good read. Besides, she's funny. Al Franken is funny, even though I think he's an idiot. Its kind of like "The Family Guy." The writers are very liberal and I obviously pick up on the satire against conservatives... but its still the funniest show on the planet.
I say you buy it cheap on eBAY.

“Always be ready to give a defense to
everyone who asks you a reason for the
hope that is in you.”
-1st Peter 3:15

This message is a reply to:
 Message 116 by MangyTiger, posted 07-18-2006 2:55 PM MangyTiger has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 155 by nator, posted 07-19-2006 7:09 AM Hyroglyphx has replied

macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 144 of 298 (333127)
07-18-2006 10:20 PM
Reply to: Message 142 by Hyroglyphx
07-18-2006 10:09 PM


Re: Let's try this again
but why hasn't anyone transcribed her literature from the alleged material that she plagiarized from?p
don't you read?
i told you i quoted from the website. THIS ONE THAT YOU SHOULD CLICK CAUSE I'M TIRED OF DOING YOUR LEGWORK FOR YOU
In other words, show her words in comparison to the words of the article(s) that she allegedly plagiarized from.
um. if you go to the website and click the links under the dates, you can read the original sources and her plagarized text.
These are baseless assertions at this point without a lick of specifics.
only because you're too lazy to go read the website WITH THE SPECIFIC ON IT.
Why couldn't anyone at least give the sources of plagiarized material so we could compare and contrast ourselves?
what is it with you people. i'm not going to spoon feed it to you like a preacher. jesus. do some work yourself before you go off staring blankly into a room and quickly dashing around with your eyes and saying "i don't see anything in here, you're crazy".
fuckballs.
I appreciate yoo providing something more than hearsay.
i didn't provide it. i simply repeated it. AGAIN. and you still have refused to look at it. go click the damn links and after you've actually bothered to do some legwork yourself, then you can tell me about how baseless these claims are.
Edited by brennakimi, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 142 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-18-2006 10:09 PM Hyroglyphx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 149 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-19-2006 12:03 AM macaroniandcheese has not replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1467 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 145 of 298 (333130)
07-18-2006 10:24 PM
Reply to: Message 137 by Hyroglyphx
07-18-2006 8:03 PM


Re: Let's try this again
She has a team of editors that scour the NexusLexus database to ensure that what sh'e saying is verified empirically.
Team of editors, huh? Scouring a legal database for empirical verification? Must be why they didn't catch Ann's years of plagarism. Nonetheless a number of media-watchdog websites chronicle her swath of twisted facts.
Okay, I've seen numerous interviews, and 1. I've never seen anyone even ask that question to her.
A lot of her Tv interviews don't have transcripts up, and I don't remember specifically which program it was, but I did see the interview, and she was directly asked if she was serious about the things she said, and she was absolutely affirmative.
Look. There are people who mock conservative pundits by taking on the role of one. Steven Colbert is one such example. Do you watch his show, at all? That's satire.
Coulter? She's serious. She's earnest. There's absolutely no satire there.
(though I'd be concerned if it wasn't)
It isn't. She's a reckless, bigmouth ideologue who absolutely refuses to apologize for anything that she says, absolutely refuses to claim she was joking. When she calls for the assassination of President Clinton, or calls for the terrorist bombing of the New York Times, she's absolutely serious. Aside from her crackhead giggling, what evidence do you have that she isn't?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 137 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-18-2006 8:03 PM Hyroglyphx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 147 by arachnophilia, posted 07-18-2006 10:38 PM crashfrog has not replied
 Message 162 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-19-2006 12:32 PM crashfrog has replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1467 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 146 of 298 (333133)
07-18-2006 10:29 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by Hyroglyphx
07-18-2006 8:00 PM


Re: Let's try this again
When Al Franken writes a book, no cares.
Lol, right. 5 books at #1 on the NYT Bestseller list, and "no one cares."
Like I said, conservatives don't check references.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-18-2006 8:00 PM Hyroglyphx has not replied

arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1344 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 147 of 298 (333135)
07-18-2006 10:38 PM
Reply to: Message 145 by crashfrog
07-18-2006 10:24 PM


Re: Let's try this again
Look. There are people who mock conservative pundits by taking on the role of one. Steven Colbert is one such example. Do you watch his show, at all? That's satire.
Coulter? She's serious. She's earnest. There's absolutely no satire there.
shhh, you're distracting me from laughing at how ridiculous she is.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by crashfrog, posted 07-18-2006 10:24 PM crashfrog has not replied

arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1344 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 148 of 298 (333138)
07-18-2006 10:50 PM
Reply to: Message 142 by Hyroglyphx
07-18-2006 10:09 PM


Re: Let's try this again
ok, i know it took a little backtracking -- but seriously, did you not know those were links to individual articles, and copy/paste removed the formatting and this the links?
here is the article WITH the formatting preserved, which i personally altered by hand to be compatible with the board:
quote:
All Coulter Plagiarism Allegations in One Post (Bumped Up For Your Weekend Reading Pleasure):
Update: The biggest problem with nearly all of the denials of the plagiarism charges against Coulter is that those doing the denying (including Crown Publishing) are basing their assessments on the examples from the New York Post article alone. It's actually a great deal more than what John Barrie's software disovered. To wit:
From the Rude Pundit:
July 1, 2005 - on Coulter plagiarizing descriptions of NEA-funded art.

June 9, 2006
- on Coulter plagiarizing in the first chapter of Godless.

June 13, 2006
- on Coulter plagiarizing part of a 60 Minutes transcript.

June 14, 2006
- on Coulter plagiarizing while discussing the Willie Horton case.
June 14, 2006 - on Coulter plagiarizing on page 37 of Godless.
From Raw Story:

July 20, 2005
- Following up on NEA-funded art description plagiarism.
June 14, 2006 - on Coulter plagiarizing a list of adult stem cell treatments.
From the New York Post:
July 2, 2006 - Reporter Philip Recchia gets John Barrie to run Coulter's book through Barrie's plagiarism identifying software, confirming some of the Rude Pundit's findings and discovering more examples.
From Media Matters:
July 6, 2006 - follows up on the Post article and the Rude Pundit's work.
That's where we stand. Is it enough to get Coulter's book recalled and her column cancelled? We shall see.
// posted by Rude One @ 1:38 AM
please click the links, and read them, for the specifics. i'm not going to re-post every single one of their articles. i know we're not supposed to argue with links here, but really. just go and read them.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 142 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-18-2006 10:09 PM Hyroglyphx has not replied

Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 149 of 298 (333153)
07-19-2006 12:03 AM
Reply to: Message 144 by macaroniandcheese
07-18-2006 10:20 PM


Re: Let's try this again
don't you read?
i told you i quoted from the website. THIS ONE THAT YOU SHOULD CLICK CAUSE I'M TIRED OF DOING YOUR LEGWORK FOR YOU
I went to Rude Pundit and you just copy and pasted what I already addressed. It gives no specifics whatsoever.
um. if you go to the website and click the links under the dates, you can read the original sources and her plagarized text.
No, it doesn't. Here are the links. Ot of three of the four, they're broken and the last one is irrelevant.
Ann Coulter: Biography and Latest Articles
Latest news from around the world | The Guardian
WordPress › ReadMe
Praxagora
what is it with you people. i'm not going to spoon feed it to you like a preacher. jesus. do some work yourself before you go off staring blankly into a room and quickly dashing around with your eyes and saying "i don't see anything in here, you're crazy".
fuckballs.
Your link was bare and gave no specifics for how or where to referrence any of the claims it made. And being that the same information you gave me is being parroted on other leftist blogs, it gives me no basis to do any homework of any kind. I'd like nothing more than to investigate the matter, but I have nowhere to start! This is the only site I found in a search engine other than the regurgitated blog you sent me.
Editor and Publisher
i didn't provide it. i simply repeated it. AGAIN. and you still have refused to look at it.
I even copied and pasted what your link said. Again, it gave no specifics. and the sublinks bring up error 404 tags. So yes, plagiarism at this point is unfounded.

“Always be ready to give a defense to
everyone who asks you a reason for the
hope that is in you.”
-1st Peter 3:15

This message is a reply to:
 Message 144 by macaroniandcheese, posted 07-18-2006 10:20 PM macaroniandcheese has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 150 by arachnophilia, posted 07-19-2006 12:32 AM Hyroglyphx has replied

arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1344 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 150 of 298 (333165)
07-19-2006 12:32 AM
Reply to: Message 149 by Hyroglyphx
07-19-2006 12:03 AM


Re: Let's try this again
I went to Rude Pundit and you just copy and pasted what I already addressed. It gives no specifics whatsoever.
it does, that's an index of blog entries. the index contains no specifics, the entries it refers do. with quotes, and sources.
No, it doesn't. Here are the links. Ot of three of the four, they're broken and the last one is irrelevant.
no, the links that ARE the dates. see my post above.
Your link was bare and gave no specifics for how or where to referrence any of the claims it made. And being that the same information you gave me is being parroted on other leftist blogs, it gives me no basis to do any homework of any kind. I'd like nothing more than to investigate the matter, but I have nowhere to start!
start at one of the links i already gave you. the case they make is fairly convincing -- they present the quotes from the book, and the source. and i happen to understand what plagiarism is in an academic context (ie: what will get me booted from class with an immediate F). i know the conservative blogs are mainly screaming that "minimal matching of words" isn't plagiarism, and "there are only so many ways you can present a fact." but after a certain point, "coincidence" is just not good enough as an explanation. in college, when you use someone else's idea without creditting them, it's plagiarism even if you reword everything completely. and yes, people DO get in trouble for not creditting their sources and backing up their arguments.
also understand that published books are held to a higher standard than message board posts, tv appearances, etc.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 149 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-19-2006 12:03 AM Hyroglyphx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 151 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-19-2006 12:57 AM arachnophilia has replied

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