Israel/Lebanon/Gaza conflict (continuation thread)

Yes, but one has to ask where are the pictures of the frightened and suffering Israelis? It isn't just a matter of quoting so and so, it's also what they choose to show. I don't buy the consumer-driven explanation myself. The average consumer mostly accepts what he's fed and the news media are definitely in a position to influence what people think. Why do we see so much Arab or Muslim outrage reaction, which has a tendency to justify their cause by evoking emotion on their behalf, and so little of the other side of the story? No reason they can't send journalists into Israel same as into Lebanon.

Lebanese deaths: ~800+ of which about 1/3 were children.Israeli deaths: ~60 of which at least 18 were civilians.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Question:
are children also guilty of storing weapons for hezbollah? NoAre they guilty by association? NoWhere is the outrage over the Lebanese civilians for putting their children in the line of fire.

And how are these statistics so readily available under these difficult circumstances?And how many of the Lebanese were Hezbollah?And what do such numbers prove? They don't prove motive, intention vs accident, cause or anything useful for judging the situation.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

And where is the fair media coverage that makes it clear that this is Hezbollah's plan if not the civilians? But with all the warnings Israel has given, you would think the people themselves would just pick up and leave the targeted areas. I heard someone say on the news a few minutes ago that they didn't know where to go. Well, the answer is OUT OF THERE. Good grief. You'd think some of their countrymen would be rallying to help them, take them in for a while. Most of Lebanon is untouched by this war after all. What's the explanation for all this? Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

You might have mentioned that the pictures are a part of a "Latest News" segment and the latest news happens to be the bombing in Qana and the pictures reflect that. You can be sure that if Hezbollah had just killed 60 Israeli civilians in one swoop there would be all manner of photos and video depicting the victims and the search for casualties. I saw plenty of pictures after the attacks on Haifa. So take your claims of propaganda elsewhere.As for your comment about the Israeli soldiers looking sinister, all I can say is that you are welcome to your interpretation, but photos of a patrol simply walking, a soldier smoking a cigarette, a soldier hugging his (girl?)friend upon returning home safely with a fellow soldier smiling next to him do not seem at all sinister to me. The only one I could possibly interpret as such (and I don't) is the one of the young soldier wiring up a bomb, but that is only a record of an event. If you think a picture of a soldier wiring a bomb in an apartment building looks sinister, imagine how it looks in real life and how it feels to those who become said bomb's casualties. How many Israeli civilians have been killed compared to Lebanese civilians? Last I heard it was between 500-600 Lebanese(depending on the source and time of report) and 18 Israeli civilians (there are a few websites that are placing the total dead at 51, but I think they are including soldiers in that count). Added to the Lebanese count would be more than 750,000 displaced people fleeing the fighting (MSNBC Article Relief Web Document) and the over 3,000 injured. On the Israeli side I've seen a number as high as 1200 but from the IDF's own words it is in the hundreds. Are you still wondering about the seeming disparity in casualty coverage?The incident in Qana is just the latest in a series that tells me that Israel has no regard for Arab civilians. Indiscriminate bombing of civilian buildings is not justified simply because terrorists may be in the area. If your bombs cannot be precise enough to actually hit the target you are aiming for, use of those bombs should be abandoned and ground troops should be sent in to deal with the actual target. Killing children and then brushing it off with the excuse that Hezbollah made them do it is positively disgusting.

Of course there couldn't be anybody left in the South who is:

• Too old to get out
• Too ill to get out
• Caring for the above
• Disabled
• Doesn't have a car
• Can't get petrol because the Israelis have hit the petrol stations
• Is too afraid to be on the roads in case the Israelis hit more civilian vehicles
• Only has a truck - which is almost certain to be hit by the Israelis
• Can't afford the Taxi fare to get out
• There's probably others I haven't thouoght of

Isn't most of Israel more or less untouched by this war as well?

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Oops! Wrong Planet

Yes, I should have but I didn't recognize that fact at the time, just reacted to the usual biased presentation, and it's obviously biased in any case. Well, I have a different impression. I would guess that they'd cover the casualties, certainly, but along with that coverage they'd be sure to be "balanced" and show the Lebanese side. Which they didn't do in their coverage of Qana. See above. You're simply playing apologist for what is obviously biased coverage. There was no need to show Israeli soldiers at all if their intent was to show the damage in Qana. The contrast they intended to make is obvious. Read the link I posted back there about how the Israelis are hiding in shelters and that isn't covered. Death isn't the only story here.And the coverage as usual focuses in on the most emotional stuff. When you focus in on individual wailing sufferers you are only intending to provoke an emotion-based judgment, you aren't interested in giving objective coverage of the overall situation. You are made to believe that what you are seeing is what they tell you it is, but as that link I posted says, you know no such thing. The numbers mean nothing. The point is that the coverage insinuates that there is no good reason for Israel's actions, insinuates that everything that happens in Lebanon is some kind of fault of Israel's, some callous targeting of civilians or some such, all manipulated judgments. The number of deaths does NOT tell the real story. Exactly. Just what the media manipulate you to believe. The Israelis may be knocking themselves out to avoid civilian casualties as a matter of fact but nobody would ever know that from the coverage that focuses only on the flat results and insinuates an anti-Israel interpretation of them. You have jumped to the conclusion that the bombing is "indiscriminate" and "simply because terrorists may be in the area." This is what the media coverage leads you to believe. Did you read my link about the disinformation war? Just how precise do you expect a bomb to be?And do you have the military experience to recommend this?If people are allowing children to be in an area that Israel has warned them it is going to bomb, that's the people's fault, not Israel's. Well, there you have it. You swallowed the propaganda whole. Message 178 Article on the disinformation war.
Message 92 For the audio link.

Yes, those could be reasons, but the reason I heard given was didn't know where to go. Not a good reason. You just go.And again, where are their countrymen who should be helping them from the untouched parts of Lebanon?And what does the fact that Israel is untouched in large areas have to do with any of this?

*******Is that what you plan to say to your God when you stand in front of him on judgement day? *********I'm praying to be in the first resurrection because like you fear the second resurrection great white throne judgement that has no power over those in the first resurrection.I agree it appears that Lebanon might well be experiencing a judgment of God (psalm 110:5) and that the kings of the earth are getting into the fray (psalm 110:6).Israel has given civilians 48 hours of not firing missles in spite of hezbolla's are still firing missles upon Israelie citizens. Where is the outrage that hezbolla are not cease firing upon Israelie citizens.I fear like you that the lebanese civilians ears will not heed the warning but that is not Israels fault but the Lebanese civilians. (psalm 58:4).********"those kids deserved it". ********Do you feel children are exempt in Gods judgments (psalm 110:6) & (psalm 58:3). Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.

That is a very strong point. The motive is not clear and disputed, but there might have been one. Then again I have decided to be open to it being an accident but the suspicions of the crew and other US government folks has me wondering what the full story is.lfen

I think they had such a frightening experience of being attacked and the Israelis not letting up, and they just can't believe that their identity wasn't obvious. That must have been very convincing to them. But it's still possible, despite that intense experience, that the Israelis did misread the signs, just couldn't believe a US ship would really have been there for starters, or even possibly thought the Egyptians were pretending to be an American ship, if they did have any doubts -- because that kind of disinformation is common on the part of their enemies. I don't think anybody has suggested this latter, and I may be completely wrong, but it crossed my mind. And there were messages that didn't get through.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

If you can find any evidence that someone deliberately put their children in the line of fire, by all means present it. Until the only parties that have put the children in the line of fire are Hezbollah and Israel.Not everybody in Lebanon can be in on 'it'.

They can be held accountable for not taking all the women and children and noncombatants OUT of an area which Israel has warned it plans to bomb. Why are any children left in the area. Why did so many children die in Qana? I don't know but it's even possible that they were located right where Hazbollah had some major operation going on. THAT we aren't told in the news, but it would fit their pattern of putting their weaponry among civilians. Just as the "massacre" at Jenin was all propaganda, so may Qana be when all the facts are in.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Israel had a responsibility to make sure the area was clear. Perhaps they could have aided the evacuation, or recommended the UN aid the evacuation. Once again, not all of south Lebanon is in on 'it'. Good question. As a comparison - which country do you think has a better infrastructure. The USA, or Lebanon? Relevant because of the New Orleans/hurricane disaster. Why are they left there? Are they able to leave? Are their parents negligent, unable to leave, dead, or afraid of packing up the truck for fear of being bombed by Israel?Parents are universally selfless. Not all parents, but globally parents will always try to get their kids out of danger - even if they themselves believe in Hezbollah's cause. I'd imagine then that most of the parents are not negligent/evil. Instead they are frightened of leaving after Israel's warning about any vehicles being viable targets. They could already be dead OR their exits are blocked (no bridges/roads). Indeed - I wouldn't be surprised if Hezbollah goaded Israel into making a publicity blunder. And I wouldn't be surprised if Israel fell for it.Edited by Modulous, : No reason given.