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Author Topic:   Atheism and freedom of speech
ringo
Member (Idle past 439 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 34 of 108 (341741)
08-20-2006 1:25 PM
Reply to: Message 33 by Hyroglyphx
08-20-2006 1:04 PM


Re: Why not?
nemesis_juggernaut writes:
... what is happening in America with the slow and methodical criminilization of things like prayer is equally egregious. Both unwittingly set up partitions that don't need to exist.
Did I miss the news again? I wasn't aware that prayer had been criminalized in the US.
Removing prayer from the schools - if that's what you mean - was done to remove partitions between those who believe "the right thing" and those who don't.
Freedom of speech is not just the freedom to say what you believe. It's also the freedom from being forced to say something you don't believe.

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 33 by Hyroglyphx, posted 08-20-2006 1:04 PM Hyroglyphx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 35 by Chiroptera, posted 08-20-2006 1:35 PM ringo has replied
 Message 38 by Hyroglyphx, posted 08-20-2006 3:13 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 439 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 36 of 108 (341748)
08-20-2006 2:25 PM
Reply to: Message 35 by Chiroptera
08-20-2006 1:35 PM


Re: Why not?
Chiroptera writes:
What was removed was mandatory recitement and official endorsement.
On a somewhat related note: I presume that there is still "official endorsement" of the Pledge of Allegiance, but what if a student wanted to opt out of reciting it?
Once, when I working for the federal government, a co-worker solemnly informed me that I must have taken an oath of allegiance to the quuen to get the job. I have no recollection of ever having done so - and it doesn't seem like anything I would do.
("Save the mad cow, but get her picture off our money.")
Nationality is (often) an accident of birth. Does freedom of speech extend to the right to not pledge allegiance to something you don't believe in?

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 35 by Chiroptera, posted 08-20-2006 1:35 PM Chiroptera has replied

Replies to this message:
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ringo
Member (Idle past 439 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 42 of 108 (341779)
08-20-2006 6:19 PM
Reply to: Message 38 by Hyroglyphx
08-20-2006 3:13 PM


Re: Why not?
Hmm.... You quoted me saying,
quote:
I wasn't aware that prayer had been criminalized in the US.
and yet nothing in your post addresses that point. Exactly when was prayer criminalized?
As for all the US constitutional mumbo-jumbo, who cares?
nemesis_juggernaut writes:
Because much of the exodus from England to America was to escape religious persecution....
First off, "exodus" seems like a bit of an exaggeration.
Second, hundreds of years later, Britain does have freedom of religion even though they don't have "separation of church and state". Some would argue that their brand of freedom is better than yours.

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 38 by Hyroglyphx, posted 08-20-2006 3:13 PM Hyroglyphx has not replied

  
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