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Poll; theist, atheist or agnostic

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Author Topic:   Poll; theist, atheist or agnostic
mitchellmckain
Member (Idle past 6444 days)
Posts: 60
From: Salt Lake City, Utah, USA
Joined: 08-14-2006

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Message 228 of 295 (340999)
08-18-2006 5:23 AM 		Reply to: Message 1 by Hyroglyphx
08-11-2006 2:09 PM

Re: Theist, Atheist, or Agnostic
Theist.
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Christian ... and scientist.
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A "minimalist" "anti-Gnostic" born-again Christian existentialist, "orthodox" open theist and theistic evolutionist.
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An opinionated intellectual that got religion. LOL
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Attend Calvary Chapel of Salt Lake where I participate in worship but otherwise keep my mouth shut.
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See my relativistic physics of space flight simimulator at Astahost.com
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mitchellmckain
Member (Idle past 6444 days)
Posts: 60
From: Salt Lake City, Utah, USA
Joined: 08-14-2006

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Message 243 of 295 (341391)
08-19-2006 1:37 PM 		Reply to: Message 237 by Archer Opteryx
08-19-2006 6:01 AM

Re: Ladder Unto Heaven
Archer writes:
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When we look at your Ladder--starting at the top, where the cream rises--we see the upper rungs indeed occupied by Theists.
...
In the middle of the list, suspended between realms above and below, we find the Agnostics. Their limbo state places them neither above,
...
At bottom of the list, in the pit farthest removed from heaven, lie the Atheists and the Unclassifiable--cast down, as it were, across the great chasm. Oh, woe, woe!
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Wow you are like the religious in your insistence on seeing meaning in the random events of life. Of course since I prefer work on my laptop upside down so that I have all that extra blood supply in my brain, what you see as up is what I see as down, so maybe n_j is really a Satanist.
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P.S. In other words, don't be absurd!
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See my relativistic physics of space flight simimulator at Astahost.com
This message is a reply to:
 Message 237 by Archer Opteryx, posted 08-19-2006 6:01 AM Archer Opteryx has not replied
Replies to this message:
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mitchellmckain
Member (Idle past 6444 days)
Posts: 60
From: Salt Lake City, Utah, USA
Joined: 08-14-2006

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Message 251 of 295 (341500)
08-19-2006 8:13 PM 		Reply to: Message 250 by Archer Opteryx
08-19-2006 5:02 PM

Re: Ladder Unto Heaven
Archer writes:
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An order that appears neutral to some observers can carry different connotations for others. You say yourself that such patterns of thought are characteristic of 'the religious.' Indeed they are.
Yep. But just because we're paranoid doesn't mean somethin's not out to get us.
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Archer writes:
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Cool avatar, by the way.
Sure. Go is my favorite game. And I love games. But I am a "Hikaru no Go" fanatic. I have watched all 70 episodes 7-8 times.
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See my relativistic physics of space flight simimulator at Astahost.com
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mitchellmckain
Member (Idle past 6444 days)
Posts: 60
From: Salt Lake City, Utah, USA
Joined: 08-14-2006

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Message 266 of 295 (341954)
08-21-2006 1:21 PM 		Reply to: Message 263 by Phat
08-21-2006 7:40 AM

Re: More updates
I don't know where you got your definitions from but that definition is at least incomplete or misleadin and at worst down right incorrect.
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http://www.thefreedictionary.com/deist writes:
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de·ism (dzm, d-)
n.
The belief, based solely on reason, in a God who created the universe and then abandoned it, assuming no control over life, exerting no influence on natural phenomena, and giving no supernatural revelation.
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Wikipedia writes:
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Historical and modern deism (from Latin: deus) is defined by the view that reason and logic, rather than revelation or tradition, should be the basis of belief in God. Deists reject both organized and revealed religion and maintain that reason is the essential element in all knowledge. For a "rational basis for religion" they refer to the cosmological argument (first cause argument), the teleological argument (argument from design), and other aspects of what was called natural religion. Deism has also come to be identified with the classical belief that God created but does not intervene in the world, though this is not a necessary component of deism.
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http://www.answers.com/topic/deism writes:
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de·ism
n.
The belief, based solely on reason, in a God who created the universe and then abandoned it, assuming no control over life, exerting no influence on natural phenomena, and giving no supernatural revelation.
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http://encarta.msn.com/dictionary_1861603447/deism.html writes:
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de·ism
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noun
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Definition:
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rational belief in God: a belief in God based on reason rather than revelation and involving the view that God has set the universe in motion but does not interfere with how it runs. Deism was especially influential in the 17th and 18th centuries.
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See my relativistic physics of space flight simimulator at Astahost.com
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mitchellmckain
Member (Idle past 6444 days)
Posts: 60
From: Salt Lake City, Utah, USA
Joined: 08-14-2006

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Message 267 of 295 (341961)
08-21-2006 1:35 PM 		Reply to: Message 265 by ringo
08-21-2006 1:12 PM

Re: More updates
Ring writes:
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How would you categorize somebody who has felt the same things that theists feel (to the extent that one human can "know" what another human feels) but doesn't ascribe those feelings to an external entity?
An atheist playing games.
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To think that you are feeling the same things that theists feel but that these are not due to an external entity is a denial of the experience of the theist. Such a person is essentially atheist, for even if he declares that existence of God is merely unknowable, he repudiates the idea that any experience of God could have any basis in fact.
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See my relativistic physics of space flight simimulator at Astahost.com
This message is a reply to:
 Message 265 by ringo, posted 08-21-2006 1:12 PM ringo has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 269 by ringo, posted 08-21-2006 2:14 PM mitchellmckain has replied
mitchellmckain
Member (Idle past 6444 days)
Posts: 60
From: Salt Lake City, Utah, USA
Joined: 08-14-2006

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Message 279 of 295 (342668)
08-23-2006 6:19 AM 		Reply to: Message 269 by ringo
08-21-2006 2:14 PM

Re: More updates
ringo writes:
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Ding ding ding ding! You win the prize!
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That's the first time I've actually been called an "atheist" at EvC.
Oh. I didn't know we were talking about you.
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ringo writes:
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Nonsense. It is the theist who is denying my experience.
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I grew up in an utterly theist environment and I am telling you that I have the same feelings as every theist I have ever met.
I am just saying that I'm not convinced that those feelings were injected into me.
The theist simply experiences God. I never heard of anybody claiming to share what an atheist experiences and then claim that this is not the result of the fact that God does not exist. Of course that does not mean that you haven't. But accusing every theist of the same thing is wrong.
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It is you that assume that you experience everything that I do, not me who assumes that I experience everything that you do. Thus you call my experiences delusions, but since I presume no knowledge of your experiences, then I would not make any comment about them.
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But it does seem strange to me if you are claiming a experience of the non-existence of God. This is implied by your claim that the theist's belief in God is a denial of your experience. An experience of the non-existence of something does seem like a rather unusual claim to me. So even if I was claiming that your disbelief in God was a denial of my experience of God (and I am not), the situations are not equivalent.
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ringo writes:
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I am saying that the "experience" does have a basis in fact - but there is a possible disconnect between that fact and "God".
I was paying attention the first time. I just did not know we were talking about you. But now I can say now it is you who are playing games. The experiences in question are experiences of God, to deny the connection to God is to deny that they are experiences of God. And by assuming that everyone's experiences of God are delusions, you are most definitely an atheist.
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Edited by mitchellmckain, : spelling
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See my relativistic physics of space flight simimulator at Astahost.com
This message is a reply to:
 Message 269 by ringo, posted 08-21-2006 2:14 PM ringo has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 280 by ringo, posted 08-23-2006 10:23 AM mitchellmckain has replied
mitchellmckain
Member (Idle past 6444 days)
Posts: 60
From: Salt Lake City, Utah, USA
Joined: 08-14-2006

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Message 281 of 295 (342767)
08-23-2006 1:27 PM 		Reply to: Message 280 by ringo
08-23-2006 10:23 AM

Re: More updates
ringo writes:
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I'm telling you: I have had the same "experiences" as every theist I know and I have reservations about attributing them to "God".
Well that does sound more like an agnostic position. But my point was simply that by claiming to have the same experiences as other people, the judment you pass on those experiences have a quality of universal judgement.
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ringo writes:
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Exactly. I deny that the experiences are necessarily experiences of God.
And I deny that your experiences are necessarily the same as my experiences.
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See my relativistic physics of space flight simimulator at Astahost.com
This message is a reply to:
 Message 280 by ringo, posted 08-23-2006 10:23 AM ringo has replied
Replies to this message:
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