Thank You Adam Smith.

Thank you for competition, for fatalities, for this rat-race.
Thank you for nicotine in cigarettes.
Thank you for the corporate money-making world.
Thank you for money.
Thank you for business as usual.
Thank you for the have-nots.
Thank you for the struggling.
Thank you for Social Darwinism.
Thank you for Industrialization.
Thank you for mediocrity.
Thank you for ghettoes.
Thank you for slums.
Thank you for retirement at 65.
Thank you for meaningless occupation.
Thank you for jobs.
Thank you for slavery.
Thank you for misleading the entire world.
Thank you for World Wars.
Thank you for killing for oil.
Thank you for Jingoism.
Thank you for Imperialism.
Thank you for borders.
Thank you for Nationalism.
Thank you for September 11th.
Thank you for terrorism.
Thank you for the primitive workings of the human mind.
Thank you for automobiles and thank you for pollution.
Thank you for not really living.
Thank you for the suburbs.
Thank you for the American Dream.
Thank you for conformity.
Thank you for glass cielings.
Thank you for Capitalism.
Thank you for the SystemThank you for nothing.

I think it will spark quite a large debate, and I am prepared to defend the claims. And tell what I meant by writing it. Thought it might make some people realize some things, or perhaps myself. Wrote it down today after sociology. I take back what I said about college by the way. Good stuff, that class.

It has that feel to it right?

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a typical Gish Gallop start but nothing there really worth debating.

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No, it's all worth debating.I didn't want to revise the OP, I think I would ruin it's highly controversial nature, and taint it's original qualities.It is what it is you know?

It's going good.When I put in on my schedule, I didn't really realize what it was going to be like, it's basic logic.arguments, premises, claims, etc... Critical thinking.So it's not the best course, it's like sunday school lol.I wanted a course on philosophy that taught about the philosophers, but it's not a bad course.

That's a good question.I guess I wouldn't know how to answer it other than, I think that these things would probably come about without Smith's existance. It's just that Smith represents what happens when humans invent currencies, and become greedy, and focus their lives on the gain of material "wealth". He not only invented capitalism. But he has become what it all really is. He epitomizes the rat-race that he created in his works.You should read this article from the sunday NY times that messenjah showed me, Dr. Chen from Harvard I believe, taught monkeys how to use money. There were many cases of stealing, and even a case of paying for sex. Doesn't say much for the mathematical genius that invests. Doesn't say much for almost all of the human race today does it?Edited by prophex, : No reason given.

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How is it affecting your personal beliefs?

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It isn't.

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For example, take the current topic, do you think it is a reasonable argument that if God created Smith then ultimately it is God who we should thank for your list, or should we be thanking Eve for eating that fruit?

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God allows human suffering, doesn't he?Why would a benevolent creator allow for this?I think he gave us our chance to do good. For altruism. But we were incapable of doing so, we did everything in my post, that is what the fruit most likely represents. Our inability to do good for eachother.

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Also, don't you think that you need to look at the influences on Smith's life and also the people that have improved Smith's original ideas?

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It's less about him, he's just the title for what is apparent.He's just there to represent the beginning stages of capitalism, and of the perpetuation of the collection of money, trade, and materialism.It's far beyond Adam Smith. Far, Far beyond his feeble workings.

Read my post to Brian at the bottom, it really wasn't about Smith."The Wealth of Nations"

I'll get back to you guys tomorrow hopefully.Peace

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You don't think that currency, greed, focus on material wealth, and capitalism existed before Smith?

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Reciprocity has always existed.

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"You scratch my back and I'll scratch yours."

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Why is that bad?

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I finally figured you out schraf.You state premises, not arguments. Simple claims/questions without any supporting facts and evidence...Good thing I have this new Critical Thinking class.And by the way my first post was meant to be like that.

I'll get back to you all, don't worry kurasu. (not kerasu)Edit: Wow I can't get your name right. Why is it so hard to spell lol.KURESU!!!Edited by prophex, : No reason given.

Haha, don't worry I'll write a nice long one for you. I'll address all your points. Too tired now.Sidelined too.Not phat though, he's on my side. Brian too. lol

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The competition's been arond forever--ever since we've had tribes competing against one another.
nicotene is naturally found in tobaccoo, and was already being used in the 1600s--why do you think it was a cash crop (for Virginia) under the mercantilist system?
money--ever since we switched from the bargaining system, we've had money. I mean, even Hammurabi's code deals with debt and credit, and we know they had money from the this--"if you don't have the cash, you gotta pay with grain" (paraphrased)
there have always been have-nots--ever since we've had greed.
I admit, social darwinism was bad--but so is this current capitalism--robber barons and Exxon-mobil was not what Smith was advocating
mediocrity has been here for a long while, and is actually not advocated by capitalism. why? if you make a so-so product, and someone else makes a better quality product, which are you going to buy? If you say the mediocre one, it is only becuase you do not care for quality.
You know, at least we get to retire at 65 and enjoy life afterwards--want to go back to a time when living to 65 was rare? Like in Smith's time?
slavery was well in existence before capitalism. Again, the sumerians had slaves. blame them for the idea.
Jingoism is a result of imperialism, see below
You want to tell me that Hammurabi, Alexander, the Romans, the Egyptians, the Hittites, and many other ancient and classical civilization's weren't in the least bit imperial, and wanted to expand their empire?
We've had borders since we first had city-states--again, blame the sumerians.
Nationalism is not the result of Capitalism--it is, in fact, one of the results of raison d'etat.
You know, I personally blame Osama for 9/11, but whatever.
Terrorism has been around for a long time--far longer than has capitalism.

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Listen. Adam Smith perpetuated these ideas, and realities in his works. He devised much of the current system existing today in "the cizilized world". It's not even about Adam Smith, or who did it first. It's about how screwed up and horrible everything is. Many of your replies focused on why my facts were wrong, when I was trying to point out these bad things and this system. To go through each of my "thank you's" is trivial.You expressed understanding of this though in quote "Something tells me you don't mean to thank Smith for not living, as he did in fact live. If you blame him for the "false" live we all lead, its our choice to follow the "false" lives. I happen to think mine's real, but then, "I think not" (oops. do I disappear now)" So I don't know if you know my intentions.Also, connect the dots with the 9/11 reply. Ask yourself why anyone would attack us, think about it for a while, and then tell me.

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Point put simple--quit blaming the wrong guy. Or, actually do something about it if you think it's so bad.

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It is rather obvious that I would end in blaming much of humanity if that were the intent of my original post.And I am going to do something about it. I am going to remove myself from the system. But I need time to think it out. I have people I care about who wish not to be liberated, who I do not want to sadden, or hurt.

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prophex
I have to ask. Are you able to offer solutions to the problems you think are presented here? Just how would you guide a nation state or city yourself? In what way would you get work done and how would you pay people?
Certainly a man such as yourself is not going to be hypocritical by merely pointing out supposed faults without showing the proper way to accomplish things to produce a world that you consider better run and more equitable. It is easy to talk of solutions ,it is quite another to convince the world to implement them.

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Believe me, I have had ideas of my own, but I don't want power, or money, or to rule over people just like me. Power dies with my body, Money is an illusion. All I can give is my love, all I can do is transcend.I can't put down into word what I mean by transcend really. But I have realized rather quickly that it is the only thing that is worth my existence.My post is about me removing myself from it.I don't want to change it, it's gone, it's over, it was destroyed at the eating of the fruit, it's sin, and it's forever.I don't want to be a part of it.

Stop CK.It's all meaningless. Those fancy words don't mean anything. It's all the same.Recycled ideas, crap, economics is dead.It's not complex, it's for simple men, it's for squanderers, and wastrels, it's not worth my time, and it wasn't worth Smith's existence.