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Author | Topic: Magnetism | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
2ice_baked_taters Member (Idle past 6248 days) Posts: 566 From: Boulder Junction WI. Joined: |
These well meaning people have neglected to tell you the simple answer.
We do not know. We know things about the phenomenon we call magnetism but we haven't a clue exactly what it is or how it came to be. For all we know it may have always existed. We keep looking though. ![]()
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cavediver Member (Idle past 4040 days) Posts: 4129 From: UK Joined: |
We know things about the phenomenon we call magnetism but we haven't a clue exactly what it is or how it came to be Speak for yourself ![]()
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2ice_baked_taters Member (Idle past 6248 days) Posts: 566 From: Boulder Junction WI. Joined: |
I have spoken a fact that is true for all of humanity. We do not know. I said nothing about wether or not an answer exists.
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nwr Member Posts: 6492 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: |
Okay, I can agree that you don't know. But that's because you are a mysterian. You like to make a mystery out of everything. Thus you are using "know" in your own mystical sense.
For the rest of us, cavediver is right. With the ordinary meaning of "know", as used by scientists, we know magnetism very well. Compassionate conservatism - bringing you a kinder, gentler torture chamber
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2ice_baked_taters Member (Idle past 6248 days) Posts: 566 From: Boulder Junction WI. Joined: |
Okay, I can agree that you don't know. But that's because you are a mysterian. You like to make a mystery out of everything. Thus you are using "know" in your own mystical sense. I am no such animal.
For the rest of us, cavediver is right. With the ordinary meaning of "know", as used by scientists, we know magnetism very well. Take a look at the question posed by Argonath. My assesment of the responses was quite accurate as was my statement about what we know. There is nothing mystical about my statements.
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Son Goku Inactive Member |
What remains unknown about magnetism?
What have you read to give you the impression that human knowledge on the subject is lacking?
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2ice_baked_taters Member (Idle past 6248 days) Posts: 566 From: Boulder Junction WI. Joined: |
What remains unknown about magnetism? What have you read to give you the impression that human knowledge on the subject is lacking? Basics of Magnetism by Ron Kurtus - Physics Lessons: School for ChampionsWhat is a charge? As in moving charge What are lines of flux? I have searched and found the link to be correct.We know many things about the phenomenon of magnetism but do not know what it is. I have not found a sufficient explanation of what a charge is. I have not found an explanation of exactly what lines of flux represent. What is particle spin and what causes spin? I have found no answers here. My point here is an answer to a question is not another question. The nature of Argonath's question is fundamental The answer is: Fundamentally, we do not know.
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Son Goku Inactive Member |
What is a charge?
The charge of an object is the strength of its coupling to the electromagnetic field.
What are lines of flux?
A visual tool used by Michael Faraday.
We know many things about the phenomenon of magnetism but do not know what it is. I have not found a sufficient explanation of what a charge is. I have not found an explanation of exactly what lines of flux represent.
Have you read any texts that deal specifically with the subject?What is particle spin and what causes spin? I have found no answers here. There are detailed accounts of what electromagnetism is and how magnetism arises out of this force. What level of explanation would satisfy you?
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nwr Member Posts: 6492 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: |
We know many things about the phenomenon of magnetism but do not know what it is.
We have excellent answers to the question of what magnetism is physically. Pick up any physics book on electricity and magnetism. What we don't have, is a metaphysical answer to what magnetism is. And you are talking about metaphysical answers. That's your commitment to mysticism, which you claimed (in Message 20 to not have). Metaphysics is that field of study which attempts to answer such questions as: There is no reason for us to care about metaphysical answers for anything. Compassionate conservatism - bringing you a kinder, gentler torture chamber
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2ice_baked_taters Member (Idle past 6248 days) Posts: 566 From: Boulder Junction WI. Joined: |
The charge of an object is the strength of its coupling to the electromagnetic field This does not answer the question.Coupling? what dose this mean? Answering questions with questions. A visual tool used by Michael Faraday. What exactly do they represent?
Have you read any texts that deal specifically with the subject? There are detailed accounts of what electromagnetism is and how magnetism arises out of this force. What level of explanation would satisfy you? I have pointed out the nature of this topic.Aganoth's question has been ignored. I apreciate your responses and learning a level of understanding of how magnetism works is quite interesting, however it's fundamental cause and how it came into being is the question. We know many things about it but this we do not know. If you would answer in the context: "This is what we currently understand" It would be more appropriate however, the condensed answer still is, fundamentally, "we do not know". Edited by 2ice_baked_taters, : No reason given.
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Son Goku Inactive Member |
This does not answer the question.
I have answered what charged is. Coupling is a general concept.Coupling? what dose this mean? Answering questions with questions. Coupling is the amount/measure of how the dynamics of two fields effect each other. What exactly do they represent?
The path of a particle in a Magnetic Field.
I apreciate your responses and learning a level of understanding of how magnetism works is quite interesting, however it's fundamental cause and how it came into being is the question.
It came into being in the early universe when various symmetries were broken.We know many things about it but this we do not know. If you would answer in the context: "This is what we currently understand" It would be more appropriate however, the condensed answer still is, fundamentally, "we do not know". "It is the purely spatial terms of 4 dimensional electromagnetic curl" or "It is the result of a relativistic disagreement between an electric field and a stationary observer". It's existence can be derived from two simpler assumptions in current theory, so its nature is very well understood. Edited by Son Goku, : No reason given.
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kuresu Member (Idle past 2910 days) Posts: 2544 From: boulder, colorado Joined: |
I don't recall argontath ever asking how magentism ever came into being. here's the bulk of his OP:
In essence, what is magnetism. By this I mean How was the first magnet created. I mean, I know north and south poles, but what force would make something like that happen. Is it something spiritual or what. IDK but it baffles me. He wants to know what magnetism is. He wants to know when the first magnet came into being (and we interpreted that as being like a fridge magnet). The last question, is whether it's spiritual or not--it's entirely physical, which, if we didn't show, we hinted at. I think you've misread his OP. Want to help give back to the world community? Did you know that your computer can help? Join the newest TeamEvC Climate Modelling to help improve climate predictions for a better tomorrow.
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cavediver Member (Idle past 4040 days) Posts: 4129 From: UK Joined: |
We know many things about it but this we do not know. No, totally wrong. If there are some things we know and some things we do not, then magnetism falls into the category of things we know. If we know nothing, then the point is moot. Why do we know about magnetism? Because we can describe everything about it in terms of more simple concepts, that are in themselves not magnetsim. We may or may not fully understand the more simple concepts, but that is not required for us to be able to claim that we understand magnetism. To argue otherwise would be to suggest we do not understand hammers because we have not yet gained a successful theory of qunatum gravity. Magnetism is a 3d observer dependent phenomenon arising from the observer-independent nature of 4d electromagnetism which in turn arises from a breaking of the symmetry of an SU(2) gauge field in the early universe (as described by Son Goku above). If you started a thread requesting a tutorial on this subject (it is complex, difficult, and very mathematical) I am sure both Son Goku and I would put in some time to guide you through the subject.
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