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EvC Forum ⇒ Science Forums ⇒ Creation/Evolution Miscellany ⇒

Do I have a choice? (determinism vs libertarianism vs compatibilism)

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DominionSeraph
Member (Idle past 4773 days)
Posts: 365
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Joined: 01-26-2005

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Message 198 of 210 (364987)
11-20-2006 6:31 PM 		Reply to: Message 188 by JavaMan
11-15-2006 11:34 AM

quote:
Don't confuse motion for freedom.
What do you mean?
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If one must change, one is not free to stay the same. If one must change in a particular way, one is not free to change in any other.
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Moving doesn't mean you're free -- it just means you're moving.
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JavaMan writes:
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Why do I need to be free to choose whether to suspend choosing or not?
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You used the presence of the event as evidence of freedom. If it's forced upon you, it certainly isn't freely chosen.
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 Message 188 by JavaMan, posted 11-15-2006 11:34 AM JavaMan has replied
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 Message 207 by JavaMan, posted 11-28-2006 7:47 AM DominionSeraph has not replied
  
DominionSeraph
Member (Idle past 4773 days)
Posts: 365
From: on High
Joined: 01-26-2005

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Message 199 of 210 (365016)
11-20-2006 8:00 PM 		Reply to: Message 197 by AdminOmni
11-20-2006 6:25 PM

AdminOmni writes:
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But the clear communication of one's position and reasoning is a goal of this forum.
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Something can be defined by the totality of what it is not.
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Clear? Yes. Easy? No.
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DominionSeraph
Member (Idle past 4773 days)
Posts: 365
From: on High
Joined: 01-26-2005

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Message 205 of 210 (365995)
11-25-2006 8:28 PM 		Reply to: Message 202 by JavaMan
11-21-2006 8:28 AM

JavaMan writes:
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My difficulty with the notion of learned behaviour is that it is rather a static, passive model of human behaviour. If we only act out the behaviour we've learned, how can behaviour change? In order to understand the dynamic aspects of behaviour, I think you need to understand what motivates people to do things - and I think at the root of motivation you always find the pursuit of pleasure and the avoidance of pain.
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Learned behavior encompasses the motivation(s).
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 Message 202 by JavaMan, posted 11-21-2006 8:28 AM JavaMan has replied
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DominionSeraph
Member (Idle past 4773 days)
Posts: 365
From: on High
Joined: 01-26-2005

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Message 209 of 210 (366703)
11-29-2006 12:55 AM 		Reply to: Message 206 by JavaMan
11-28-2006 7:35 AM

JavaMan writes:
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What do you mean?
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You learn how the behavior relates to what you want. So, what you've learned encompasses what you want.
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JavaMan writes:
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But does the fact that I have to do something mean that I don't have any choice at all?
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No. You have no choice if you're locked into doing one thing, so the question is whether the change could end up being different on a subsequent run (which would require another dimension of time).
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Edited by DominionSeraph, : No reason given.
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