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Author Topic:   What is the biggest bible contradiction?
Brian
Member (Idle past 4986 days)
Posts: 4659
From: Scotland
Joined: 10-22-2002


Message 16 of 311 (365766)
11-24-2006 1:35 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by AdminNem
11-22-2006 7:52 PM


Re: Correct Forum?
but it seems the OP's point of view as far as the biggest contradiction stems for a scientific point of view.
Sorry, don't see that at all!
That's why I thought the theological aspects of creation/evolution would suit this topic best.
Yet not a single post so far has been anywhere near these issues and the member had requested Accuracy and Inerrancy.
I think it looks out of place here.
Brian.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by AdminNem, posted 11-22-2006 7:52 PM AdminNem has not replied

Neutralmind
Member (Idle past 6150 days)
Posts: 183
From: Finland
Joined: 06-08-2006


Message 17 of 311 (365809)
11-24-2006 4:42 PM


Thanks for all of your replies. I'll have to ask about Jesus riding different animals from my friend Thanks Clark.
My friends' a Yehowas witness btw. He doesn't want to come speak to the forums because the bible says something that you should not be taking any kind of contact with outcasts because it may stray you from the truth or something. But he's okay with me writing here and discussing his answers with you.
He got me convinced for a while that the bible is inerrant, but after some of my own studying I don't feel that way anymore.
And btw, is hypermicroevolution after Noah's arc explained by creos in any way?

Replies to this message:
 Message 28 by Clark, posted 11-25-2006 12:00 PM Neutralmind has replied

Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 18 of 311 (365810)
11-24-2006 4:49 PM


Judas! Don't forget Judas!
Another good one is Judas' death. In Matthew 27 Judas hangs himself. In Acts 1, he falls down and his guts burst open.
See if you can get your friend to claim that Judas hanged himself on his own entrails.

Kings were put to death long before 21 January 1793. But regicides of earlier times and their followers were interested in attacking the person, not the principle, of the king. They wanted another king, and that was all. It never occurred to them that the throne could remain empty forever. -- Albert Camus

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by Neutralmind, posted 11-24-2006 5:14 PM Chiroptera has replied

Neutralmind
Member (Idle past 6150 days)
Posts: 183
From: Finland
Joined: 06-08-2006


Message 19 of 311 (365821)
11-24-2006 5:14 PM
Reply to: Message 18 by Chiroptera
11-24-2006 4:49 PM


Re: Judas! Don't forget Judas!
Hmm... Interesting.
These are just the kind I was looking for
Edited by Neutralmind, : more text

This message is a reply to:
 Message 18 by Chiroptera, posted 11-24-2006 4:49 PM Chiroptera has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by Chiroptera, posted 11-24-2006 5:23 PM Neutralmind has replied

Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 20 of 311 (365825)
11-24-2006 5:23 PM
Reply to: Message 19 by Neutralmind
11-24-2006 5:14 PM


Re: Judas! Don't forget Judas!
Did you see my previous entry? That was the one that bothered me the most when I was a literalist.

Kings were put to death long before 21 January 1793. But regicides of earlier times and their followers were interested in attacking the person, not the principle, of the king. They wanted another king, and that was all. It never occurred to them that the throne could remain empty forever. -- Albert Camus

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by Neutralmind, posted 11-24-2006 5:14 PM Neutralmind has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 21 by Neutralmind, posted 11-24-2006 5:31 PM Chiroptera has replied

Neutralmind
Member (Idle past 6150 days)
Posts: 183
From: Finland
Joined: 06-08-2006


Message 21 of 311 (365830)
11-24-2006 5:31 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by Chiroptera
11-24-2006 5:23 PM


Re: Judas! Don't forget Judas!
The thing is, I've never read the bible very thoroughly so I can't say about the tomb thing.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by Chiroptera, posted 11-24-2006 5:23 PM Chiroptera has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 22 by Chiroptera, posted 11-24-2006 5:47 PM Neutralmind has replied
 Message 24 by Chiroptera, posted 11-24-2006 6:26 PM Neutralmind has replied

Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 22 of 311 (365838)
11-24-2006 5:47 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by Neutralmind
11-24-2006 5:31 PM


The story(ies) of the empty tomb:
Matthew 28:
Mary Magdalene and the other Mary went to the tomb. An angel appeared with an earthquake, rolled away the rock blocking the entrance, and sat on it. The guards fainted. The women went to tell the other disciples and met Jesus on the way.
-
Mark 16:
Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James, and Salome went to the tomb. The rock was already rolled away, and a young man (an angel) was sitting within the tomb. No mention of Jesus before they found the other disciples.
-
Luke 24:
Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James, Joanna, and other unidentified women came to the tomb. It was empty when they got there. Suddenly two angels appeared beside them. No mention of Jesus before they got to the disciples.
-
John 20:
Mary Magdalene came to the tomb alone. The rock was moved, the tomb was empty, and there was nothing to be seen. She ran to tell the others. Peter and another disciple ran to the tomb and saw that it was empty. When they left, two angels appeared to Mary, and also Jesus appears to Mary within the tomb.
-
How's that for an inerrant, divinely inspired book's description of the most important historical event in human history, and fairly recent history to the Gospel writers, and which had actual eye witnesses?
Edited by Chiroptera, : typo in the Luke version

Kings were put to death long before 21 January 1793. But regicides of earlier times and their followers were interested in attacking the person, not the principle, of the king. They wanted another king, and that was all. It never occurred to them that the throne could remain empty forever. -- Albert Camus

This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by Neutralmind, posted 11-24-2006 5:31 PM Neutralmind has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 23 by Neutralmind, posted 11-24-2006 6:06 PM Chiroptera has not replied

Neutralmind
Member (Idle past 6150 days)
Posts: 183
From: Finland
Joined: 06-08-2006


Message 23 of 311 (365842)
11-24-2006 6:06 PM
Reply to: Message 22 by Chiroptera
11-24-2006 5:47 PM


Re: The story(ies) of the empty tomb:
Sounds kinda fishy yeah
edit: Where are all the creos...?
Edited by Neutralmind, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 22 by Chiroptera, posted 11-24-2006 5:47 PM Chiroptera has not replied

Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 24 of 311 (365851)
11-24-2006 6:26 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by Neutralmind
11-24-2006 5:31 PM


A modern proposal.
quote:
I've never read the bible very thoroughly....
If I wanted to promote atheism, I would advocate for mandatory Bible reading classes in all the public schools.

Kings were put to death long before 21 January 1793. But regicides of earlier times and their followers were interested in attacking the person, not the principle, of the king. They wanted another king, and that was all. It never occurred to them that the throne could remain empty forever. -- Albert Camus

This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by Neutralmind, posted 11-24-2006 5:31 PM Neutralmind has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 25 by Neutralmind, posted 11-24-2006 6:47 PM Chiroptera has replied

Neutralmind
Member (Idle past 6150 days)
Posts: 183
From: Finland
Joined: 06-08-2006


Message 25 of 311 (365857)
11-24-2006 6:47 PM
Reply to: Message 24 by Chiroptera
11-24-2006 6:26 PM


Re: A modern proposal.
Chiroptera
If I wanted to promote atheism, I would advocate for mandatory Bible reading classes in all the public schools.
Actually, in Finland bible reading classes are mandatory for 99% of the people all the way until university. I was one of the 5 people out of 550 in school who didn't have to go to bible reading classes. And that was because of my parents insisting I don't need to read the bible.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 24 by Chiroptera, posted 11-24-2006 6:26 PM Chiroptera has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 26 by Chiroptera, posted 11-24-2006 8:55 PM Neutralmind has not replied

Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 26 of 311 (365872)
11-24-2006 8:55 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by Neutralmind
11-24-2006 6:47 PM


Re: A modern proposal.
Are you Finnish? Because your written English is excellent. Except for
Yehowas witness
no trace of an "accent".

Kings were put to death long before 21 January 1793. But regicides of earlier times and their followers were interested in attacking the person, not the principle, of the king. They wanted another king, and that was all. It never occurred to them that the throne could remain empty forever. -- Albert Camus

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by Neutralmind, posted 11-24-2006 6:47 PM Neutralmind has not replied

AdminNem
Inactive Member


Message 27 of 311 (365939)
11-25-2006 11:34 AM


Thread moved here from the Theological Creationism and ID forum.

Clark
Inactive Member


Message 28 of 311 (365941)
11-25-2006 12:00 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by Neutralmind
11-24-2006 4:42 PM


Yehowas witness.
In the US at least, it is Jehovah's Witness and not the more accurate Yahweh, and that would be an example of another contradiction. I'm not familiar with all the details but the JW's insist that it is Jehovah even though this is based on mistranslation from German Bibles.
Also, the JW's Bible has even more contradictions and problems than the orthodox Christian Bible.
Btw, Jesus riding two animals was part of what led my girlfriend to start questioning the Bible and eventually to lose her faith in fundamentalist Christianity. It is a great example that demonstrates how all these "miraculous" Biblical prophecies were invented. The virgin birth, also in the Gospel of Matthew, is another one, where the author is reading a mistranslation in the Septuagint from the Book of Isaiah. The virgin birth story seems to be a synthesis of that mistranslation and pagan beliefs about God[s] impregnating virgins.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by Neutralmind, posted 11-24-2006 4:42 PM Neutralmind has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 29 by Chiroptera, posted 11-25-2006 12:44 PM Clark has not replied
 Message 136 by Neutralmind, posted 12-07-2006 4:18 PM Clark has not replied

Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 29 of 311 (365946)
11-25-2006 12:44 PM
Reply to: Message 28 by Clark
11-25-2006 12:00 PM


Yep. When I was a Biblical literalist, what bothered me the most from a theological perspective was when I read these alleged Old Testament prophecies of the Christ's suffering and death in context, and realized what a stretch it was to make them out to be prophecies.

Kings were put to death long before 21 January 1793. But regicides of earlier times and their followers were interested in attacking the person, not the principle, of the king. They wanted another king, and that was all. It never occurred to them that the throne could remain empty forever. -- Albert Camus

This message is a reply to:
 Message 28 by Clark, posted 11-25-2006 12:00 PM Clark has not replied

Neutralmind
Member (Idle past 6150 days)
Posts: 183
From: Finland
Joined: 06-08-2006


Message 30 of 311 (366019)
11-26-2006 6:15 AM


I read on some other thread about bible saying the earth is a circle. Is that correct? I mean that if the bible says so, not that if it's true...
And how about "pick and choose" from the bible, any examples of that? Of people picking up stuff not minding that it is contradictory to other things mentioned in the bible.

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