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Author Topic:   Has there been life for 1/4 of the age of the Universe?
Woodsy
Member (Idle past 3373 days)
Posts: 301
From: Burlington, Canada
Joined: 08-30-2006


Message 70 of 114 (370269)
12-16-2006 8:18 PM
Reply to: Message 69 by Fosdick
12-16-2006 8:06 PM


Re: The odds of life are unknown
Since the early earth was a very different place than it is these days, I doubt that not seeing new life happening today tells us much about our origins.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 69 by Fosdick, posted 12-16-2006 8:06 PM Fosdick has replied

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Woodsy
Member (Idle past 3373 days)
Posts: 301
From: Burlington, Canada
Joined: 08-30-2006


Message 82 of 114 (370662)
12-18-2006 3:07 PM
Reply to: Message 81 by Fosdick
12-18-2006 2:20 PM


Re: The Thingies are Everywhere!
I'll give the principles of carbon chemistry and cellular organization; those seem perfunctory to me.
How are these perfunctory (whatever that means in this context)? It does take several years of hard study to get a working knowledge of either. And, after all, living things are chemical in nature.
With zillions of possible organic molecules to choose from, why would anyone expect the abiogenisis problem to be easy? If no working model has yet been found, all one can conclude is that no working model has yet been found.

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 Message 81 by Fosdick, posted 12-18-2006 2:20 PM Fosdick has replied

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Woodsy
Member (Idle past 3373 days)
Posts: 301
From: Burlington, Canada
Joined: 08-30-2006


Message 93 of 114 (370936)
12-19-2006 3:30 PM
Reply to: Message 91 by Fosdick
12-19-2006 2:49 PM


Re: And the principles are...?
Yes, it was slick indeed, but so what? Once there is replication with variation, no matter how simple the system, selection can rachet up the complexity.
You seem to be misleading yourself with your anthropomorphic phrasing. With the right start, even a very simple one,the process can look after itself. No teaching is needed and the process need not start with complex components.

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 Message 91 by Fosdick, posted 12-19-2006 2:49 PM Fosdick has replied

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Woodsy
Member (Idle past 3373 days)
Posts: 301
From: Burlington, Canada
Joined: 08-30-2006


Message 96 of 114 (370969)
12-19-2006 5:15 PM
Reply to: Message 95 by Fosdick
12-19-2006 4:42 PM


Re: And the principles are...?
It it were this simple then life would be just an gadget and abiogensis would be a self-starting manufacturing "process that can look after itself."
That is how I see it. Why not?
Could you be more specific with "the right start"? How about "the right stuff"?
The "right stuff" would be a self-replicating molecule that could form in the conditions of the early earth. I understand that there are chemists busy looking for such molecules. One should not expect the search to be easy, though. Organic chemistry is complicated stuff and the earth was early a long time ago.

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 Message 95 by Fosdick, posted 12-19-2006 4:42 PM Fosdick has replied

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