EvC Forum: Ancient ice shelf breaks free in Arctic

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He is treading softly because scientists try not to exceed the bounds of their data...and because there is a large population of global warming deniers--such as right wing evangelicals--eager to depict any warning as overstatement.

God's not an idiot. Signs of the end are not as a result of "supernatural" occurrences that cause the disasters to ensue. They are perfectly natural. They can still be signs non-the-less...after all, dont' Christians believe that God put the laws of nature into action? A true Christian believes that God does not intentionally cause disasters, rather man is reaping the results of our sin-ridden planet. He withdraws His spirit, and Satan takes over. It's like your armor-bearer leaving you on the battlefield becasue you don't want him. Then the enemy has the advantage over you.

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Do you refer here to the evangelical Christian leadership in the U.S. which condemned an expression of concern by a few concerned evangelicals as tantamount to "pagan nature worship"?

I have no idea what you're talking about. Please explain better.

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A long procession of "end-times" prophets--starting with Jesus--have predicted the immiment end. They were all wrong. When someone gets it right, that person likely will be a scientist with good data, not a prophet.

Oh really? Last time I read, they were all right. And their prophecies apply more to our day than they did their own. I'm nobody's fool. You simply are reading their prophecies wrong. Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greece, Pagan Rome, Papal Rome--Catholacism, the Reign of Terror...it was all prophecied, and it happened to an exact T. If you think all these prophecies failed because of one or two seamingly inconsistencies, you're majoring and minoring my friend. You're completely missing "overall picture", and that's just what Satan wants everyone to do. He delights in it.

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This particular event happened over a year ago, back in 2005. It is not really that a significant an event and similar to what we have seen in Antarctica for many decades.

It's not a significant event, but it could be a smaller event that could be severely linked to a signifcant event.

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The section that broke free is not that old, the ice being around 3000 years old.

And that's not old? For me, a Young Earth Creationist, that is half the age of the earth.

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The section that broke free drifted a ways and then refroze into the ice pack during winter.

I would hope to God that it would freeze in the winter. But what will happen this Summer? Next Winter? The Summer and Winter after that? Will it continue to keep freezing?

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The issue of Global Warming is important and so far no one seems to be doing much to ameliorate any negative impacts it will bring. They seem to spend far more time talking about nonsense issues like "Is it a sign of the End Times" or whether it is caused by man or a natural cycle.

When a prophecy takes place, it will always seem like there are ones at "fault" for allowing it to happen. Yes, when prophecies take place, there are usually people to blame. But that doesn't mean God didn't know what would happen. He already predicted that "man would cause it or natural cycle would cause it". In other words, it was prophecied there would be people to blame, and it was also prophecied that the natural cycle would take place. Just because it's a "natural cycle" doesn't mean anything.

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Yup. It means we're mismanaging our resources. That mismanagement and overexploitation will cause lots of species to go extinct and lots of people to die young, mostly very young. It will require all the science and technology we can possibly wisely apply to ease the pain caused by our messups.

So this makes it not a prophecy? God knowing man would mismanage their resources cannot be a prophecy? He knows how man's minds will work, and what their decisions will cause. Again, a Prophecy is nothing supernatural. It's a foretelling of what's already immanent.

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But praying won't help much.

Praying won't help much if you're asking the future to not come, but praying will help if you ask for God's protection in times of trial.

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Pray tell, what chapter and verse of what book of the bible foretells a breaking off of an ice shelf and describes it as a sign of the end-times? If you can show me that, I'll be impressed.

Who's talking about specifics? It doesn't matter. The Bible talks about calamities or natural disasters. The breaking of an ice-shelf is not a calamity or natural disaster. But it could to what will eventually turn into a calamity or natural disaster. The Bible talks about "signs of the end", yet it does not necessarily describe just what all those signs might be. If it did, that would be too obvious. God doesn't want dummy worshippers for fear of destruction. However, God gave humanity intelligence to infer what might be signs and what might not be.

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While ecological damage is and will happen and the earth's systems will be perturbed with rising human population - using the bible as some sort of signpost is useless and perhaps dangerous. For example, the Christian right block in the US are apposed to most environmental causes.

Well those Christians certainly arn't me. They're simply wrong in the angle their looking at it. They are certainly environmental causes. But these environmental causes can still be prophecies nonetheless. The fall of Babylon was prophecied, but the cause of it's fall was another empire--Persia. Man caused it because God foretold man would cause it. He knows what they'll do, and he knows what the environment will do and what it will cause.

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Do you ever wonder if the Bible is a crock?

Do you ever wonder if it's not? Crashing your head into a computer certainly won't help, fyi.

Edited by Lysimachus, : No reason given.

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Ancient ice shelf breaks free in Arctic - Signs of the end?