General Discussion Of Moderation Procedures 9.0

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I can read too, and I have several degrees, but I'm not sure I can fully understand quantum mechanics because of that.

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But I never said anything about QM. I referred to a specific example which required only being able to read and understand an essay (without needing to understand the technical content). Indeed, all he needed to do was to read and understand the relevant sentence of the essay when it was quoted for his benefit.It is this failure which cannot be attributed to stupidity or ignorance.

I have no problem with the suspension - I'd already read mod's previous post when I made my comments. I fully expected to be suspended.

This is undoubtedly true. There is literally no way to characterize some of the utterances by certain individuals on this board in any other way. HOWEVER, and I think this piece is key: once it has been shown (through, for example, linking to and quoting the exact statements in contention), then the job of the individual who is being misrepresented is done. I personally see absolutely no point in "putting their back up" about it. Anyone - and I mean anyone - reading the exchange can determine the relative merits of the two positions/statements. If someone is blatantly misrepresenting someone else (and it's not just a case of misunderstanding, in which case clarification is in order), then I've found that it is excrutiatingly obvious to all observers which is which. You should know as well as I do that we're simply not going to change certain individuals' minds and/or behavior (or in some cases, what passes for minds). Calling someone a liar (or saying that they are lying or that their statement is a lie, all of which amount to the same thing) is definitely not going to accomplish much of anything.As to the Showcase forum, as you know I have been opposed to the concept since its inception. Ban the irredeemable, don't put them in a cage for people to gawk at. On this subject, I disagree with Percy - and think his rationalization (that it provides a "worst of the worst" example), is, hmmm, a bit weak. However, I simply refrain from participating in that forum in any way. As long as Percy believes there is some utility in it, it's his board to run as he wishes. There isn't a single denizen of that forum that I wouldn't have permanently banned for flagrant and continual guidelines violations.

You may well be correct that the phenomena being displayed isn't stupidity or ignorance. I've worked with kids with learning disabilities (executive function disorder, not simple stuff like dyslexia (I'm not saying dyslexia isn't difficult to deal with, just that its symptoms make sense in light of the disorder)), and the things they get versus the things they don't get just have no rhyme or reason.I'm not saying Ray or anyone else has a learning disability, just that in many respects the human mind can't accurately be viewed as just a simple "comprehension machine" that you can point at bodies of information. I grant that the minds of Nobel Prize winners appear to operate that way, and for those of us who work in the sciences or in any field where the accurate analysis of information is important it probably appears that most of the people we work with have minds that operate that way, but even so, as RAZD points out most of us have our limits somewhere. Using myself as an example, even all these years after college I'd still like to know why I was so fantastic at math through algebra, trig, geometry, physics, mechanics, and calculus, then hit the wall at differential equations (I'm talking true crash and burn after stellar grades in math to that point, and I still don't get DQ). The mind is a mystery.The way I see it is that even though the mind is a mystery, and even though perhaps anyone's particular issues might not really be their fault, we still have to enforce standards in order to maximize the opportunities for productive discussion, no matter how unfair that might feel to the affected people.--Percy

i think this probably the case. you'll notice how common strawmen are around here. i think it's evident from the bible threads that they start with some knowledge of what it's supposed to say, read lightly, ignor context and detail, and post something they think confirms their view. careful reading, without assumption, commonly refutes their points.but when the intricacies of the text are explained at length, and they still insist, does it become something else? or are they simply not reading what we say either?

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i'm not sure. he hasn't demonstrated that. i mean, i know he can read, but reading isn't simply understanding what letters make what sounds, and recognizing words. it's understanding what it means, too. clearly, many of our fundamentalists members don't read very well. he makes a total of 3 points, ad nauseum. clearly there is a limited scope there. he evidently has not been exposed to the legitimate claims of modern biology, only creationism's charicature of "evolutionism." whether this lack of education is due in part to reading comprehension, lack of opportunity, or if it's willful is hard to say. it might be. but i suspect randman is not just putting on a show. i think he believes everything he says. sure it is.

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LOL on that.1. Though many would be fair, the likelyhood of bias favoring the vast majority may be significant.2. The more biased prone would likely be the ones to participate in the vote.

The board is not better off with opposition to the status quo gone. Unless, of course, your ideology is third-world.Faith is gone because she made the "mistake" of giving you Darwinists a taste of your own medicine, which you could not handle. Unfortunately, I have not had the pleasure of acquainting myself with NJ's posts. Based on what is written above he has decided not to give you a taste of your own medicine.RayEdited by Herepton, : No reason given.

[colorization emphasis mine - Ray]The experts of history (Marx, Engels, Mao, Stalin, Hussein, Castro etc.etc.) all agree: censorship and banishment works.Ray

You left out Constantine, Ray.And a few Popes.

actually, ray, i agree. and that was kind of the point of my post. the board is not better off without the opposition. "creation vs. evolution" doesn't work if it's just "vs. evolution."i protested faith's band before it happened, when it happened, and i continue to disagree with it even now. does that mean that nj is a genuine creationist? or a wolf in sheep's clothing? take some time and acquiant yourself with his posts -- you can still read the rest of the board, correct?

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They undoubtedly did. However, as noted in the section you so kindly bolded for everyone to read, I pointed out that I would have banned all and sundry for repeated forum violations, not for the positions they espoused. It's not what you say, Ray, it's how you - and the others - have proven repeatedly that you are incapable of civil discourse.If you are content with being put on display like some kind of curiousity for the amusement of idle passersby, then that is up to you. For me, I would have preferred to simply eliminate the problem. I personally don't believe EvCForum is well-served by placing any active members in a cage simply to showcase how pitiable they are. I also don't like pulling the wings off flies - but that's just me.

I agree that you cited "repeated forum violations" and never did I deny your stated reason, I, in fact, pasted your entire comment.Mao, Stalin and Hussein gave the same reasons for censorship and banishment (they violated rules/laws) when we know for a fact that the censorship was over "dangerous viewpoints."You have no point or ground to stand on. You are advocating third-world censorship of your Creationist opponents. We (= Creationists) only need to point out that our censors are Darwinists then all is explained.Ray

Strictly speaking, Stalin and Mao were second-world, not third. And keeping barking dogs outside isn't exactly censorship.

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And just how are you being censored? Who has restricted what you can post? What limits have been placed on what you can say in the showcase?

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