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Author Topic:   Prophecy
johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5619 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 106 of 140 (380612)
01-28-2007 3:01 AM
Reply to: Message 105 by iceage
01-28-2007 12:00 AM


Servants Heart
The bible says the Lord Jesus yoke is easy his burden light. To me its more about having a servants heart. I have a problem with the prosperity gospel where I give and you recieve.
If you want to be chief you become servant of all so when I vote I vote for empowerment to help the poor. I don't believe in the democrats that want to raise taxes to help the poor. I believe we should cut taxes not raise them. We have plenty of food pantries, George W. Bush is making a difference.
http://www.abpnews.com/880.article
Your not supposed to allow yourself to be trapped like a roe to the hunter or the bird to the fowler by those that say there your friend but to make sure of your brother. kjv pro 6:5. Which is the whole reason why Kent Hovind made a stand, the money given to the anti-christ bankers through the IRS should be used to feed the poor, fund health insurance not siphoned out of our country. But interestingly everyones ears are deaf mocking Kent and not understanding the bigger issue.
The root problem with the poor in our country the interest on nothing (Fed Notes) and the local communities need to raise property taxes because most of the federal taxes are being siphoned out of our country.
Myself I'm quite poor at the moment can not afford health insurance but will try to do whatever I can to keep myself not a burden to others. Its probably the best because I can go to the free clinic if need be get free food at the food pantry.
About those that desire to be great to be the servant of all. Now when someone comes begging I tell people of the free food at the various food pantries. I'm believe more if your able to help others help themselves your having the servants heart. If your only their servant you cease to be a servant or their friend but become their slave and then the yoke can become grievous. Jesus said his yoke is easy his burden light.
Then your about what Christ is about and you will not be his servant but his friend. Its about being about what he is about but not about being entrapped as a roe to the hunter or a bird to the fowler.
People are quite manipulative perhaps why the LORD said to give anonomously because its not about you getting the glory but God.
P.S. I'm however like the Man Called Norman cause well I'm one of those unlovable ones that George MacDonald too mentioned in one of his books. Empathy can be a two edged sword like the good samaritan parable. Its like when someones down and out no one is their friend its hard its more than hard. So I understand that what your saying and can relate hopefully we all can make a difference in Christ.
Edited by Charley, : No reason given.
Edited by Charley, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 105 by iceage, posted 01-28-2007 12:00 AM iceage has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 107 by iceage, posted 01-28-2007 3:17 AM johnfolton has replied
 Message 109 by Vacate, posted 01-28-2007 3:48 AM johnfolton has replied
 Message 124 by Jaderis, posted 01-28-2007 7:25 AM johnfolton has replied
 Message 127 by Archer Opteryx, posted 01-28-2007 4:58 PM johnfolton has replied

  
iceage 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5942 days)
Posts: 1024
From: Pacific Northwest
Joined: 09-08-2003


Message 107 of 140 (380613)
01-28-2007 3:17 AM
Reply to: Message 106 by johnfolton
01-28-2007 3:01 AM


Re: Servants Heart
charley writes:
I have a problem with the prosperity gospel...
I believe we should cut taxes not raise them. We have plenty of food pantries, George W. Bush is making a difference....
Which is the whole reason why Kent Hovind made a stand, the money given to the anti-christ bankers through the IRS should be used to feed the poor
I am not talking about the prosperity gospel, politics or tax evaders.
I am talking about the very clear, precise and inexorable words of Jesus Christ.
These are red letter scriptures that commands you to give all you have to the poor. It is really quite literal and clear. You are rich compared to the poor of the world, regardless of how you think you are relatively.
Health insurance? Isn't that for those of meager faith?
I mention this because you put so much stock in various scriptures but I suspected you ignore the clear difficult scripture - the passage is straight and narrow.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 106 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 3:01 AM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 108 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 3:44 AM iceage has replied

  
johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5619 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 108 of 140 (380617)
01-28-2007 3:44 AM
Reply to: Message 107 by iceage
01-28-2007 3:17 AM


Re: Servants Heart
These are red letter scriptures that commands you to give all you have to the poor. It is really quite literal and clear. You are rich compared to the poor of the world, regardless of how you think you are relatively.
Well go ahead and we can look at those verses that too me are not what you suppose them to mean. Some he said to give all and follow him, but he explained to the apostles in regard to the rich man putting his trust in riches its easier for a camel to go thru the eye of the needle but with God all things are possible.
Meaning that with God its possible for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. It also talks in the bible to invest your money so too me its like merchants can be liken to kings and others liken to Priests. They go hand in hand as it says in revelations that the kings and priests. Is not that what it saying? Its not about money persay, but that some that are called to be kings because they trust in God, because what is impossible with man is possible with God. The rich man was being called to be a priest not a merchant because he was putting his trust in his riches. Many are called few are chosen. It was kind of like Elisha when he was called to be the prophet he answered the Calling, etc...
http://www.kings-priests.org/home.php
Edited by Charley, : No reason given.
Edited by Charley, : No reason given.
Edited by Charley, : No reason given.
Edited by Charley, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 107 by iceage, posted 01-28-2007 3:17 AM iceage has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 111 by anglagard, posted 01-28-2007 4:21 AM johnfolton has not replied
 Message 112 by iceage, posted 01-28-2007 4:21 AM johnfolton has replied

  
Vacate
Member (Idle past 4628 days)
Posts: 565
Joined: 10-01-2006


Message 109 of 140 (380618)
01-28-2007 3:48 AM
Reply to: Message 106 by johnfolton
01-28-2007 3:01 AM


Re: Servants Heart
Which is the whole reason why Kent Hovind made a stand
So just how much would a person have to earn to end up owing 640,000 dollars to the IRS?
How much money is it going to cost the US to house Kent Hovind while he stamps licence plates for the next decade?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 106 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 3:01 AM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 110 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 4:19 AM Vacate has replied

  
johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5619 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 110 of 140 (380625)
01-28-2007 4:19 AM
Reply to: Message 109 by Vacate
01-28-2007 3:48 AM


Re: Servants Heart
How much money is it going to cost the US to house Kent Hovind while he stamps licence plates for the next decade?
Its an outrage an attack on the churches, we should all be outraged with the federal judges biased decision. The IRS has such confusing interpretation that it should be made simple instead of complex in respect to the Christian Organizations in respect to taxation.
WTP Update

This message is a reply to:
 Message 109 by Vacate, posted 01-28-2007 3:48 AM Vacate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 114 by Vacate, posted 01-28-2007 4:39 AM johnfolton has replied

  
anglagard
Member (Idle past 864 days)
Posts: 2339
From: Socorro, New Mexico USA
Joined: 03-18-2006


Message 111 of 140 (380626)
01-28-2007 4:21 AM
Reply to: Message 108 by johnfolton
01-28-2007 3:44 AM


All Things are Possible
Charley writes:
Some he said to give all and follow him, but he explained to the apostles in regard to the rich man putting his trust in riches its easier for a camel to go thru the eye of the needle but with God all things are possible.
Yes, according to those who base their claims on the inerrent and literal interpretation of the Bible, all things are possible. Evidently this includes ignoring any inconvenient commandments.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 108 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 3:44 AM johnfolton has not replied

  
iceage 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5942 days)
Posts: 1024
From: Pacific Northwest
Joined: 09-08-2003


Message 112 of 140 (380627)
01-28-2007 4:21 AM
Reply to: Message 108 by johnfolton
01-28-2007 3:44 AM


Re: Servants Heart
charley writes:
verses that too me are not what you suppose them to mean
Oh I have heard all the rationalizations and semantic gymnastics. I prefer the plain literal meaning and not try to distort the direct word of the Lord - since he is not a God of confusion.
charley writes:
Meaning that with God its possible for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven.
Sure, even a serial killer has a chance eh?
charley writes:
It also talks in the bible to invest your money so too
Old testament sure, and it also talks about not mixing fibers, respecting the sabbath and not approaching a women during her period, etc.
I am suspecting that Jesus's red lettered words carries significance - no? Especially since he repeatedly teached giving all to the poor and practiced austerity.
Again my point is that you are cherry picking scripture to meet your needs but ignoring the difficult one - the path is straight and narrow.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 108 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 3:44 AM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 113 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 4:38 AM iceage has replied

  
johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5619 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 113 of 140 (380631)
01-28-2007 4:38 AM
Reply to: Message 112 by iceage
01-28-2007 4:21 AM


Re: Servants Heart
I am suspecting that Jesus's red lettered words carries significance - no? Especially since he repeatedly teached giving all to the poor and practiced austerity.
I'm suspecting not all are called to be priests some are actually called to be kings. I think your missing the significance since all things are possible with God. Faith in God in respect to those called to be kings.
http://www.kings-priests.org/home.php
Edited by Charley, : No reason given.
Edited by Charley, : No reason given.
Edited by Charley, : No reason given.
Edited by Charley, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 112 by iceage, posted 01-28-2007 4:21 AM iceage has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 117 by iceage, posted 01-28-2007 5:08 AM johnfolton has replied

  
Vacate
Member (Idle past 4628 days)
Posts: 565
Joined: 10-01-2006


Message 114 of 140 (380632)
01-28-2007 4:39 AM
Reply to: Message 110 by johnfolton
01-28-2007 4:19 AM


Re: Servants Heart
Charley writes:
The IRS has such confusing interpretation that it should be made simple instead of complex in respect to the Christian Organizations in respect to taxation.
How many other Christian Organizations have expressed such confusion? Perhaps Kent should have invested in a tax specialist instead of looking at the papers and saying "screw it, its too confusing. I'm not paying taxes".

This message is a reply to:
 Message 110 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 4:19 AM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 115 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 4:53 AM Vacate has replied

  
johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5619 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 115 of 140 (380633)
01-28-2007 4:53 AM
Reply to: Message 114 by Vacate
01-28-2007 4:39 AM


(Lev. 25) an AMNESTY on debt
Perhaps we should just kick those foreign banker out like Christ kicked the money changers out of the temple. Is there really any reason we should pay interest on nothing, when our own country could be printing money based on nothing. This is our national debt that we should simply refuse to pay because its all based on nothing. If we printed our own money we could simply wash the debt without payment every 50 years as was the case in Jewish Law. The reason the bible condones amnesty of debt is because it brings justice to the equation.
-----------------------------------
The Jubilee had an ecological ethic calling for the resting of the land every seven years (Lev. 25:1- 7); animals were to be given regular Sabbath rests (Ex. 31:12-17 Deut. 15); and every 50th year (Lev. 25) an AMNESTY on debt was declared. In agrarian societies the cycle of poverty begins when a family had to sell off its land in order to pay off debt (for example after a year or years of poor harvests). Poverty reached its conclusion when landless peasants can only sell their labor becoming bond-slaves. The great 50 year AMNESTY allowed the land that was sold to be returned to its original owners therefore ending generational poverty(Lev. 25:13, 25-28). All debt was written off (Lev. 25:35-42 Deut. 15:1-11) and all slaves were freed and given the means to be economically self sufficient (Deut. 15:12- 17). The rational for this unilateral restructuring of the economy was to remind Israel that the land belongs to God (Lev.25:23) and Israel was chosen to be a counter-cultural people who must never return to an imperial system like Pharaoh’s that produces slavery for some while enriching an elite. Lev.25:42).
http://www.scn.org/wwfor/richlang070205.htm
Edited by Charley, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 114 by Vacate, posted 01-28-2007 4:39 AM Vacate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 116 by anglagard, posted 01-28-2007 5:01 AM johnfolton has not replied
 Message 118 by Vacate, posted 01-28-2007 5:10 AM johnfolton has not replied
 Message 119 by iceage, posted 01-28-2007 5:26 AM johnfolton has replied

  
anglagard
Member (Idle past 864 days)
Posts: 2339
From: Socorro, New Mexico USA
Joined: 03-18-2006


Message 116 of 140 (380634)
01-28-2007 5:01 AM
Reply to: Message 115 by johnfolton
01-28-2007 4:53 AM


Re: (Lev. 25) an AMNESTY on debt
Charley writes:
Is there really any reason we should pay interest on nothing, when our own country could be printing money based on nothing.
Ever heard of the Weimar Republic?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 115 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 4:53 AM johnfolton has not replied

  
iceage 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5942 days)
Posts: 1024
From: Pacific Northwest
Joined: 09-08-2003


Message 117 of 140 (380635)
01-28-2007 5:08 AM
Reply to: Message 113 by johnfolton
01-28-2007 4:38 AM


Re: Servants Heart
Christ said plainly that if you want to be complete, give all to the poor and follow him and don't look back.
It is a plain as language as can be.
charley writes:
I'm suspecting not all are called to be priests some are actually called to be kings
Wasn't Christ Kingly? and he had "No Place To Lay His Head".
charley writes:
I think your missing the significance since all things are possible with God.
Basically you saying that you can skirt the hard issues and pursue matters of the flesh, as God will in the end make the impossible possible.
I think you are minimizing the significance of your own quoted scripture
KJV writes:
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 113 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 4:38 AM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 120 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 5:36 AM iceage has replied

  
Vacate
Member (Idle past 4628 days)
Posts: 565
Joined: 10-01-2006


Message 118 of 140 (380636)
01-28-2007 5:10 AM
Reply to: Message 115 by johnfolton
01-28-2007 4:53 AM


For the love of money - Dr.Dino theme song
Perhaps we should just kick those foreign banker out like Christ kicked the money changers out of the temple.
When Christ kicked them out did he scoop up the money and hide behind his followers in hopes of keeping his ill gotten gains? Did Christ steal 640,000 dollars or did he advocate paying taxes? Do you expect me for even one second to accept your comparison of Kent Hovind to Christ?
If we printed our own money we could simply wash the debt
In ten years when Kents back on the road selling videos for extreme wealth, perhaps you can suggest that he spread this idea to his followers. Sadly he never thought of this while he was chaining himself to IRS buildings shouting "We shall overcome!"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 115 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 4:53 AM johnfolton has not replied

  
iceage 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5942 days)
Posts: 1024
From: Pacific Northwest
Joined: 09-08-2003


Message 119 of 140 (380637)
01-28-2007 5:26 AM
Reply to: Message 115 by johnfolton
01-28-2007 4:53 AM


Re: (Lev. 25) an AMNESTY on debt
Perhaps we should just kick those foreign banker out like Christ kicked the money changers out of the temple.
The "foreign bankers" are not setting up shop in the temple. There are no parallels. This is simply an attempt to avoid the clear anc concise teachings of the scripture.
Lay onto Ceasar what belongs to Ceasar and give unto God what belongs to God
It does not qualify that with "unless you can concoct a really good conspiracy theory".
You are worried about some corruption and foreign influences? just what the hell do think Caesar represented in Jesus's day?
Why oh why can't literalist believe in the literal God breathed holy writ?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 115 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 4:53 AM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 121 by johnfolton, posted 01-28-2007 5:57 AM iceage has replied

  
johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5619 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 120 of 140 (380639)
01-28-2007 5:36 AM
Reply to: Message 117 by iceage
01-28-2007 5:08 AM


Re: Servants Heart
Wasn't Christ Kingly? and he had "No Place To Lay His Head".
Its about the son of mans accension into heaven, he "has" no place to lay his head.
I think you are minimizing the significance of your own quoted scripture
Its a good scripture glad to see someone other than myself appreciates it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 117 by iceage, posted 01-28-2007 5:08 AM iceage has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 123 by iceage, posted 01-28-2007 6:23 AM johnfolton has replied

  
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