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Author Topic:   Christianity, Knowledge and Science
sidelined
Member (Idle past 5930 days)
Posts: 3435
From: Edmonton Alberta Canada
Joined: 08-30-2003


Message 68 of 221 (376144)
01-11-2007 8:21 AM
Reply to: Message 47 by Rob
01-10-2007 8:47 PM


scotness
NO it doesn't. It stigmatizes knowledge of evil as terrible
I have a question then. Does it also stigmatize good as being terrible since the fruit was of the knowledge of both good and evil?
Edited by sidelined, : the first reply did not post entirely

This message is a reply to:
 Message 47 by Rob, posted 01-10-2007 8:47 PM Rob has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 185 by truthlover, posted 03-02-2007 9:20 AM sidelined has replied

  
sidelined
Member (Idle past 5930 days)
Posts: 3435
From: Edmonton Alberta Canada
Joined: 08-30-2003


Message 109 of 221 (376453)
01-12-2007 8:01 AM
Reply to: Message 108 by Rob
01-12-2007 1:46 AM


Re: End of silly game playing
scotness
I am sure it was a result of being inundated with many replies however I was wondering if you could answer a question I asked you back in post #68 as revealed here?
scotness
scotness writes:
NO it doesn't. It stigmatizes knowledge of evil as terrible
I have a question then. Does it also stigmatize good as being terrible since the fruit was of the knowledge of both good and evil?
This answer of yours was in response to a statement by cocytus which says
cocytus writes:
Christianity has, within it's very first book Genesis, stigmatized knowledge itself as something terrible.
Perhaps you could help to clear up some confusion I have about your position.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 108 by Rob, posted 01-12-2007 1:46 AM Rob has replied

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sidelined
Member (Idle past 5930 days)
Posts: 3435
From: Edmonton Alberta Canada
Joined: 08-30-2003


Message 199 of 221 (389034)
03-10-2007 10:37 AM
Reply to: Message 185 by truthlover
03-02-2007 9:20 AM


truthlover
It doesn't stigmatize good or evil as terrible, but it forbids taking up the knowledge of good and evil, which belongs to God.
If it belongs to God then why did he place it in the garden?

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 206 by truthlover, posted 03-17-2007 3:40 PM sidelined has replied

  
sidelined
Member (Idle past 5930 days)
Posts: 3435
From: Edmonton Alberta Canada
Joined: 08-30-2003


Message 212 of 221 (390731)
03-21-2007 6:03 PM
Reply to: Message 206 by truthlover
03-17-2007 3:40 PM


truthlover
The point was to say that the knowledge of good and evil belongs to God.That's why eating from it made them like God. It wasn't good for that to be so, so they were punished.
I am sorry to say that this seems ludicrous. If it was not good for us to have the knowledge of good and evil, why would God offer it to us?
Indeed, if we do not have a knowledge of Good and Evil, then how can we be punished for not knowing better?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 206 by truthlover, posted 03-17-2007 3:40 PM truthlover has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 214 by truthlover, posted 03-22-2007 11:55 AM sidelined has replied

  
sidelined
Member (Idle past 5930 days)
Posts: 3435
From: Edmonton Alberta Canada
Joined: 08-30-2003


Message 215 of 221 (390950)
03-22-2007 6:02 PM
Reply to: Message 214 by truthlover
03-22-2007 11:55 AM


truthlover
God decides good and evil. We are punished for disobeying God. Adam & Eve were not punished for anything else they did, except for not doing the one command God gave them.
That is just it though. Eve was obeying god until the serpent {created by God} came to talk to her. Since God is all knowing, apparently, then why is it necessary to invoke temptation upon her since she, before eating of the fruit, cannot be capable of understanding the act to be wrong?
And since, in the course of a given life, we often run across the need to discern good and evil {or rather relative good and evil} in the moment without the benefit of running it past God first, then it is an impracticality on the part of God to expect such obeisance.
Perhaps God should lay the blame on the guy in the mirror.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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 Message 218 by truthlover, posted 03-23-2007 11:15 AM sidelined has replied

  
sidelined
Member (Idle past 5930 days)
Posts: 3435
From: Edmonton Alberta Canada
Joined: 08-30-2003


Message 219 of 221 (391663)
03-26-2007 6:04 PM
Reply to: Message 218 by truthlover
03-23-2007 11:15 AM


truthlover
It's a story. Personally, I think the serpent is a great addition to the story, and that way there's also an explanation for the rather bizarre way snakes travel.
Certainly it is a story. God is a part of a story, that does not mean that there is really a God either. The story could just be emphasizing that we are responsible for our choices and cannot be complacent in our innocence with the notion that we are incapable of making wrong choices.
An allegory cannot be expected to answer every situation. Exceptions do not render the lesson of an allegory invalid. Despite encountering situations where good and evil has not been defined for us, the lesson that good and evil are determined by God, not man, and that moral decisions should be based on God's determinations, remains a valid lesson even when we're faced with situations where we don't know God's determination.
I agree about allegory being only so efficient at lessons, however, I cannot see that good and evil are based on God's determinations since we are the only ones that bitch about injustice. We seldom give thought about the nature of the situations that require us to make decisions that, in the moment, are all that we are capable given imperfect information, and as such we cannot be expected to make but imperfect decisions.
A god, on the other hand, by definition having perfect information cannot be expected to be arbiter of justice since there is no situation to which God could claim an injustice as He cannot possibly be surprised by any given situation.{Makes you wonder why he had such a bug up his ass over Sodom and Gomorrah eh?}
Nor can we expect him to have an understanding of the innumerable balancing acts one makes in the course of living a life of limited span and essentially unlimited experience possibilities.

``A paradox is not a conflict within reality. It is a conflict between
reality and your feeling of what reality should be like.''
- Richard Feynman

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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