Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 63 (9162 total)
5 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 916,337 Year: 3,594/9,624 Month: 465/974 Week: 78/276 Day: 6/23 Hour: 0/1


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Is the Designer Still Designing?
Rob 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5867 days)
Posts: 2297
Joined: 06-01-2006


Message 20 of 40 (392581)
04-01-2007 12:37 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Mike O Risal
03-26-2007 8:10 PM


An Offense... of an answer!
Mike O Risal:
If an initial intelligent designer is posited as the reason for the biodiversity we see today, does that intelligent designer still exist? If not, what happened to it? If so, is it still designing? If the latter of these two possibilities is the case, then why do we not see radically new body plans appearing currently? Just taking animals as an example, we see a very limited number of basic body plans. If the designer still exists and is still designing, why don't we see much departure from these.
The designer is no longer designing. he is in the business of recovery...
Hang with me here Mike. I am going to move fast...
Personally, I think the most encouraging aspect of Intelligent Design, is that it brings into focus the true nature of natural selections role in nature.
So to answer your question, I don't think that the designer is at work in the direct sense you presuppose with your question.
I believe that the creation was designed without error. And sidestepping the questions of free will and the emergence of evil which make that another problem, the creatures are now adapting to a changing environment.
So this idea of evolution is actually backwards. The design (or creation) is actually devolving into new forms that are not better, but often worse than their predesessors. For example, the sun is using up it's energy. The moon is slowly but steadily losing it's place relative to it's earth. The role of the 2nd law of thermodynamics we see clearly affirmed.
I think that is why genetic co-mingling within species produces hybrid vigor. Because the combination of two members of a species that have diverged over time, are more complete, healthy, and whole when put back together.
So things are coming undone we see. It is a fallen and broken world, that needs restoration and salvation.
And things that are coming apart must have once been whole (or together)... Holy if you will!
Biblically speaking:
Genesis 2:2 By the seventh day God had finished the work he had been doing; so on the seventh day he rested from all his work.
This corrosponds nicely to the first law of thermodynamics. It is finished. Energy can niether be created nor destroyed.
However, once we stepped in and decided to tinker with the laws as they were, things began to come apart. That get's into this whole other free will issue, and whether or not a perfect creation would allow such freedom. Again, I am forced to leave that alone for now in respect of the topic.
So, everything is not designed. Some changes we see in organisms are the result of simple consequence. Cause and effect may not be intelligeble to us, but who ever said tinkering with laws was intelligent?
This random variation we see, is only random outside the constraints of law. It is quite predictable, in the sense it is mindless.
With all the physical laws being relative to one another and interdependent, why do some assume that 'moral laws', if changed or bent, will not cause an opposite and equal reaction of mindless deterioration?
Why is it that a dichotomy is introduced between physical and metaphysical realitites?
We say often in science today, that metaphysics has nothing to do with hard physical science...
Oh yeah?
Tell that to the sub atomic particles!
The metaphysical reality that underlies this physical plane does transcend it, and makes it's presence known.
I don't know where you are coming from, so forgive me if I am preaching to the chior, but never forget that the word transcendant does not mean 'outside' but rather 'connected', as in the overlap of our atmosphere and the outer space beyond.
It's a relational universe...
There is no seperation of things existing, from that of one strand against another. To do so, is the disintegation of the whole for the sake of single entities. It would be less than 'real' and complete.
But there will be that seperation eventually. Some beings demand it... for themselves.
Be careful what you wish for, and think...
Edited by Rob, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Mike O Risal, posted 03-26-2007 8:10 PM Mike O Risal has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 21 by Taz, posted 04-02-2007 12:59 PM Rob has not replied
 Message 24 by IamJoseph, posted 11-23-2007 10:47 PM Rob has not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024