Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9162 total)
2 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 915,818 Year: 3,075/9,624 Month: 920/1,588 Week: 103/223 Day: 1/13 Hour: 0/1


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Evolution or Creation
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 64 of 301 (396018)
04-18-2007 5:48 PM
Reply to: Message 61 by ICANT
04-18-2007 5:36 PM


Re: Everything in Life is a Choice
ICANT writes:
If I am right and there is a God and a Heaven I will spend eternity with Him.
More likely, He'll punish you for not seeing what's right in front of your face - evolution.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 61 by ICANT, posted 04-18-2007 5:36 PM ICANT has not replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 85 of 301 (396187)
04-19-2007 12:40 AM
Reply to: Message 84 by ICANT
04-18-2007 11:10 PM


Re: Everything in Life is a Choice
ICANT writes:
I don't see where it says they will be burned up at the end.
We had a thread on that subject here, in case you're interested.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 84 by ICANT, posted 04-18-2007 11:10 PM ICANT has not replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 96 of 301 (396274)
04-19-2007 1:32 PM
Reply to: Message 94 by ICANT
04-19-2007 12:54 PM


Re: 'Not Everything in Life is a Choice' admits OP Author
ICANT writes:
I BELIEVED BEFORE I HAD THE EXPERIENCE WITH GOD
So your "experience with God" was confirmation bias?

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 94 by ICANT, posted 04-19-2007 12:54 PM ICANT has not replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 101 of 301 (396298)
04-19-2007 3:13 PM
Reply to: Message 98 by ICANT
04-19-2007 3:02 PM


Re: ignorant and unlearned
ICANT writes:
Most of what I see on this site is telling Christianity that they have a faith based ignorance.
You misunderstand. Ignorance isn't faith-based - but misplaced faith preserves ignorance.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 98 by ICANT, posted 04-19-2007 3:02 PM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 106 by ICANT, posted 04-19-2007 3:37 PM ringo has replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 107 of 301 (396314)
04-19-2007 3:48 PM
Reply to: Message 106 by ICANT
04-19-2007 3:37 PM


Re: ignorant and unlearned
ICANT writes:
So what is there to misunderstand?
I won't speak for nator's specific wording, but I think she'd agree with me: Faith doesn't cause your ignorance.
There are plenty of people of faith who don't wallow in ignorance. They embrace learning. They don't fear knowledge as a threat to their faith.
I think when people around here use the shorthand "faith-based ignorance", they mean using your faith as a shield to protect your ignorance.
That usually indicates an ignorance of the basis of your faith, too. Rejection of evolution often goes hand in hand with a profound ignorance of the Bible. Repeating over and over and over and over that you have to choose between evolution or the Bible is not what you do if you came here to learn.
Edited by Ringo, : Spellling.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 106 by ICANT, posted 04-19-2007 3:37 PM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 112 by ICANT, posted 04-19-2007 4:29 PM ringo has replied
 Message 135 by nator, posted 04-19-2007 9:47 PM ringo has not replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 118 of 301 (396342)
04-19-2007 4:56 PM
Reply to: Message 112 by ICANT
04-19-2007 4:29 PM


Re: ignorant and unlearned
ICANT writes:
I understand them to mean that my faith in God is ignorance,
And that I should be an atheist.
As I said, you misunderstand.
What is being challenged primarily is your refusal to look at the facts.
I don't think anybody is trying to recruit you as an atheist. Frankly, if I was an atheist, I wouldn't want you on my side.
But nobody will tell me what the benefits would be.
You have been told: one benefit would be freedom from ignorance and prejudice.
Two have stated there would be no benefit.
Why do you notice only the ones who tell you what you want to hear?
Do you have any enlightenment to add?
Step One: rid yourself of the idea of "God or evolution".
When you can understand "God and evolution", you'll be able to find your own enlightenment.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 112 by ICANT, posted 04-19-2007 4:29 PM ICANT has not replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 151 of 301 (396511)
04-20-2007 12:30 PM
Reply to: Message 149 by ICANT
04-20-2007 11:49 AM


Re: Belief = Response to Experience
ICANT writes:
I think I have a little conviction about what I believe.
If you turned down the moon and three stars of your choice, do you think anybody would be impressed by your "convictions"?
On the contrary, it seems like a sad attempt to convince yourself that you're right.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 149 by ICANT, posted 04-20-2007 11:49 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 153 by ICANT, posted 04-20-2007 12:36 PM ringo has replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 154 of 301 (396516)
04-20-2007 12:55 PM
Reply to: Message 153 by ICANT
04-20-2007 12:36 PM


Re: Belief = Response to Experience
ICANT writes:
I know what I believe and why.
I'm just sayin'... if you're not whistling in the dark, what's the point of this topic?
You've been told the benefits of truth over delusion. You refuse to listen. You've demonstrated a less-than-zero understanding of science. You refuse to learn.
Thanks to you, the Atheist International Conspiracy has people lining up to sign.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 153 by ICANT, posted 04-20-2007 12:36 PM ICANT has not replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 225 of 301 (397083)
04-24-2007 10:05 AM
Reply to: Message 217 by ICANT
04-24-2007 2:41 AM


Re: Everything Is A Choice
ICANT writes:
Lets see I have a beautiful waterfront home, a 2007 Entourage van, a 2007 Nissan pickup, and a farm.
quote:
Mat 19:21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
quote:
Mat 19:24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
Your "testimony" would be much more impressive if you left out the bits about the neat stuff God gives you.
Apparently you did not read the post where I listed many things I had done because my God had given me several abilities.
Everybody has abilities. We're not all so insecure that we have to brag about them.
I did not do those things for free.
Maybe you should have.
Maybe then you'd understand that life isn't all about the almighty dollar.
quote:
Mat 6:24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 217 by ICANT, posted 04-24-2007 2:41 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 238 by ICANT, posted 04-24-2007 10:10 PM ringo has replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 239 of 301 (397198)
04-24-2007 10:39 PM
Reply to: Message 238 by ICANT
04-24-2007 10:10 PM


ICANT writes:
Jesus is speaking to a lost religious rich Pharisee.
So it doesn't apply to that other rich Pharisee named "ICANT"?
He is not talking to one of His children whom he has blessed.
Show us chapter and verse where Jesus blessed His children with material goods.
Ringo, why did you not give the explanation that Jesus gave to His disciples.
"With God all things are possible," is not an explanation. Jesus was speaking of the fact that a rich man can not get to heaven (at least, he can't take his earthly riches with him). He was saying that God can level the inequities of earth.
It must be very convenient to believe that none of Jesus' teachings apply to you.
That smug attitude isn't very satisfying for most of us though.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 238 by ICANT, posted 04-24-2007 10:10 PM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 243 by ICANT, posted 04-24-2007 11:22 PM ringo has replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 245 of 301 (397209)
04-24-2007 11:34 PM
Reply to: Message 243 by ICANT
04-24-2007 11:22 PM


Re: Re-Blessings
ICANT writes:
Jesus said: "I am come that they might have life, and that they might have (life) more abundantly.
It's sad that you think "more abundant life" has anything to do with the size of your bank account.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 243 by ICANT, posted 04-24-2007 11:22 PM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 247 by ICANT, posted 04-24-2007 11:56 PM ringo has replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 248 of 301 (397216)
04-25-2007 12:00 AM
Reply to: Message 247 by ICANT
04-24-2007 11:56 PM


Re: Re-Blessings
ICANT writes:
Who other that you said anything about the size of their bank account?
You were the one who brought up material goods as a "benefit" of being one of God's children. You have spent the whole thread talking about how God has blessed you materially.
The rest of us have been talking about the more abstract benefits of accepting the truth, but you don't seem interested in them.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 247 by ICANT, posted 04-24-2007 11:56 PM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 249 by ICANT, posted 04-25-2007 12:36 AM ringo has replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 250 of 301 (397220)
04-25-2007 12:55 AM
Reply to: Message 249 by ICANT
04-25-2007 12:36 AM


Re: Re-Blessings
ICANT writes:
I won't tell you how many years of those I spent working that I was pastoring small churches that could not afford a pastor.
I have no doubt that you have earned (in the earthly sense) all that you have. I am not questioning your right to earthly goods.
I'm just wondering about your priorities.
As I've already mentioned, the truth about evolution doesn't seem to interest you. Making false accusations against scientists doesn't seem to bother you.
You have talked about material goods and about your reward in the afterlife. I'm not seeing that you value integrity in this life very highly.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 249 by ICANT, posted 04-25-2007 12:36 AM ICANT has not replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 270 of 301 (397278)
04-25-2007 10:58 AM
Reply to: Message 256 by ICANT
04-25-2007 7:18 AM


Re: Everything Is A Choice
ICANT writes:
The Bible plainly says nations.
"All nations" plainly means all the people from those nations - no exceptions, not even you. The what-you-do-to-them-you-have-done-to-me judgement applies to everybody.
Jesus plainly said my brethren.
To be a brother of Christ you have to either be a Jew or be a Born again child of God.
But it isn't up to us to judge who is a child of God. From our point of view, anybody could be a child of God. So for all intents and purposes, we need to treat everybody as Jesus' brethren.
Any way you look at it, nobody is exempt from the judgement.
And Jesus said explicitly that some who say, "Lord, Lord," will be surprised by their judgement - i.e. some who believe they are "children of God" are not.
Edited by Ringo, : Spelling.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 256 by ICANT, posted 04-25-2007 7:18 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 272 by ICANT, posted 04-25-2007 11:52 AM ringo has replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 273 of 301 (397294)
04-25-2007 12:03 PM
Reply to: Message 272 by ICANT
04-25-2007 11:52 AM


Re: Everything Is A Choice
ICANT writes:
But everybody is not going to be judged at the same time.
I'll leave discussion of the judgement itself to a more appropriate thread. (I have never seen anybody successfully defend your position.)
But my point was that we don't know who is in what group. You can believe that you're in a certain elite group, but you don't know who else is.
If you believe that only a certain elite group is to be treated like Jesus, you still have to assume that anybody could be in that group. You still have to treat everybody as if they were Jesus.

Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 272 by ICANT, posted 04-25-2007 11:52 AM ICANT has not replied

Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024