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Author Topic:   Christianity Today: Atheism is the only rational outlook.
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


Message 31 of 95 (401747)
05-21-2007 9:51 PM
Reply to: Message 30 by jar
05-21-2007 9:03 PM


Re: Once again it shows that Biblical Christian Evangelicals are simply LIARS.
Actually, that divorce poll was there before.
But I agree that they didn't handle it right. Faced with an apparently compromised poll, shutting it down seems about the only thing that they could have done. However, they need to have posted a statement to that effect. Whether or not their intent was to do a cover-up, their actions certainly do look like a cover-up.
----------------
Authentic Chinese Proverb (told to be by an authentic Chinese co-worker):
Do not tie your shoes in a melon patch.
Explanation:
You're walking through somebody else's melon patch. If you reach down to tie your shoe, it would look to somebody else like you're reaching down to pick one of the melons to steal it. Your true intentions mean nothing compared to others' perception.
Translation:
Avoid any and all appearance of misconduct.
Edited by dwise1, : Word choice.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 30 by jar, posted 05-21-2007 9:03 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
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jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 32 of 95 (401748)
05-21-2007 9:55 PM
Reply to: Message 31 by dwise1
05-21-2007 9:51 PM


Re: Once again it shows that Biblical Christian Evangelicals are simply LIARS.
Actually, that divorce poll was there before.
Yes, it was the poll before the Atheist one.
To simply "disappear" the recent poll they are willfully ignoring truth and facts.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
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ohnhai
Member (Idle past 5161 days)
Posts: 649
From: Melbourne, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2004


Message 33 of 95 (401757)
05-21-2007 10:55 PM
Reply to: Message 31 by dwise1
05-21-2007 9:51 PM


Re: Once again it shows that Biblical Christian Evangelicals are simply LIARS.
There is no guarantee that it was compromised (I do realise you said 'apparently)
sure the numbers are huge but the news of the poll went far and wide. It is not even remotely out of the question that 80k-ish people of an atheistic tenancy could have turned up to see how a Christian rag was mis-representing atheism today, and were surprised to find the 'correct' answer amongst the option. In this light they could not help but voting.
I was watching the numbers and they came in fits and starts (as the various web-sites and time zones discovered it). I would not be surprised if a few people figured out how to vote more then once but I would not be surprised if the VAST number of those votes were actually genuine

This message is a reply to:
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ohnhai
Member (Idle past 5161 days)
Posts: 649
From: Melbourne, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2004


Message 34 of 95 (401758)
05-21-2007 10:58 PM
Reply to: Message 32 by jar
05-21-2007 9:55 PM


Re: Once again it shows that Biblical Christian Evangelicals are simply LIARS.
To simply "disappear" the recent poll they are willfully ignoring truth and facts.
to simply 'disappear' the poll without comment is extremely bad form. And in the light of the fact I KNOW it has been recorded and screen grabbed through out its short but interesting life, probably quite a foolish move too.

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riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 415 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 35 of 95 (401759)
05-21-2007 11:03 PM
Reply to: Message 28 by jar
05-21-2007 9:21 AM


Why?
I voted in the poll and saw nothing unreasonable in the results.
I didn't see anything unreasonable either, what is your point?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 28 by jar, posted 05-21-2007 9:21 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
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jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 36 of 95 (401760)
05-21-2007 11:09 PM
Reply to: Message 35 by riVeRraT
05-21-2007 11:03 PM


LOL
Say What?
In the message I was replying to you said:
If the poll is accurate, then this has been a wake-up call for Christians, and continues to be.
I asked why you thought that and pointed out that I saw nothing unreasonable in the results.
now you say:
I didn't see anything unreasonable either, what is your point?
Okay.
Color me absolutely mystified by your posts.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 35 by riVeRraT, posted 05-21-2007 11:03 PM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 37 by riVeRraT, posted 05-22-2007 10:28 AM jar has replied

  
riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 415 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 37 of 95 (401814)
05-22-2007 10:28 AM
Reply to: Message 36 by jar
05-21-2007 11:09 PM


With Christianity having the reputation it does today, especially amoung atheists, it is not unreasonable to expect those results.
However, Christians should question this, and examine themselves, because if Jesus is the way, the truth, and the light, then why are all these people voting against Christianity?
You know this already.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 36 by jar, posted 05-21-2007 11:09 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
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jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 38 of 95 (401822)
05-22-2007 11:01 AM
Reply to: Message 37 by riVeRraT
05-22-2007 10:28 AM


But did anyone vote against Christianity?
However, Christians should question this, and examine themselves, because if Jesus is the way, the truth, and the light, then why are all these people voting against Christianity?
Christians should definitely question whether "Jesus is the way, the truth, and the light" and if they do so honestly, they will find that Jesus is not the way, the truth, and the light and that that is simply another of the soundbite nonsense phrases beloved of those who want to keep folk ignorant.
With Christianity having the reputation it does today, especially amoung atheists, it is not unreasonable to expect those results.
Christianity has the reputation it has today because it earned that reputation.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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subbie
Member (Idle past 1254 days)
Posts: 3509
Joined: 02-26-2006


Message 39 of 95 (401833)
05-22-2007 11:44 AM
Reply to: Message 37 by riVeRraT
05-22-2007 10:28 AM


Vote "against" christianity?
Why do you say people were voting "against" christianity?
The votes were for the position that atheism is the only rational position. That isn't a vote "against" christianity. It's simply an acknowledgement that christianity is based on faith, not reason. While I have no doubt that the poll was spammed, most thinking christians that I know say that it wasn't reason that led them to thir belief. It's mostly the fundies who wrap themselves up in knots trying, in vain, to establish logic in the bible.
While christianity has some marvelous philosophy of life stuff, you start to get into trouble when you try to make it do things that it just can't.

Those who would sacrifice an essential liberty for a temporary security will lose both, and deserve neither. -- Benjamin Franklin
We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat

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Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 40 of 95 (401886)
05-22-2007 4:31 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by AnswersInGenitals
05-20-2007 6:55 PM


Re: Uncovering the psychology of the post-modernist
science has shown us how to look at the sun... analyze it, determine its origin, and predict its demise. And now, science is going to do the same thing with 'god.'
"God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. How shall we comfort ourselves, the murderers of all murderers? what was holiest and mightiest of all that the world has yet owned has bled to death under our knives: who will wipe this blood of us? What water is there for us to clean ourselves? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games shall we have to invent? Is not the greatest of this deed to great for us? Must we ourselves not become gods simply to appear worthy of it?" -Friedrich Nietzsche
Who do you think Nietzsche is talking to here?

"God is like the sun. You can't look at it. But without it you can't look at anything else." -G.K. Chesterton

This message is a reply to:
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AnswersInGenitals
Member (Idle past 150 days)
Posts: 673
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 41 of 95 (401893)
05-22-2007 5:48 PM
Reply to: Message 40 by Hyroglyphx
05-22-2007 4:31 PM


Re: Uncovering the psychology of the post-modernist
nemesis_juggernaut asks:
Who do you think Nietzsche is talking to here?
Those who believe that god was once alive.

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ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 42 of 95 (401930)
05-22-2007 8:07 PM
Reply to: Message 40 by Hyroglyphx
05-22-2007 4:31 PM


Re: Uncovering the psychology of the post-modernist
nemesis_juggernaut writes:
Who do you think Nietzsche is talking to here?
I think Nietzsche was paraphrasing Macbeth.
He wasn't talking about "if" God is dead. He was talking about "who" killed God and how they can live with the guilt.
"Who" killed God is anybody who looks at the situation rationally, who doesn't need to postulate a supernatural cause for the wind and the rain, who doesn't need to consult a "Supreme Being" for every tidbit of advice on life.
Everybody who ever thought for himself did his part, slipped his little knife in - et tu, nemesis.
The ones Nietzsche was referring to, the ones who are concerned with cleaning the "damned spot" of blood, are those who think they killed something real.

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Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 43 of 95 (401963)
05-23-2007 2:34 AM
Reply to: Message 42 by ringo
05-22-2007 8:07 PM


Re: Uncovering the psychology of the post-modernist
I am reminded of two favorite quotes of my own.
"God Is Dead"---Nietzsche
Nietzsche Is Dead---God (author unknown)
Author unknown by many, at least!

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Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 44 of 95 (402045)
05-23-2007 9:31 PM
Reply to: Message 38 by jar
05-22-2007 11:01 AM


Lady Wisdom insists upon center stage
Jar writes:
Christians should definitely question whether "Jesus is the way, the truth, and the light" and if they do so honestly, they will find that Jesus is not the way, the truth, and the light and that that is simply another of the sound bite nonsense phrases beloved of those who want to keep folk ignorant.
I think that sound bites can come from many sources and in many flavors. "It's Just That Simple."
IMHO, it is good to be honest and to be a rationally thinking person. It would be foolish, however, to conclude that God never sent His Son as a message, an inspiration, and the beginning of the solution for everything that ails humanity.
I will agree with you that it is ignorant to assume that Jesus has done everything. Jesus did make a path possible, where before Him there was no path. To assume that other religions have found a path that somehow is able to bypass God in the flesh is, in my opinion, ignorant. Do you honestly think that God expects us to accept a message without a messenger? Do you honestly think that she could care less if we acknowledge the source of her message?
What do you think she expects us to conclude? That we ourselves made up our own message to give to ourselves? How pantheistic can one get?
Edited by Phat, : spalling
Edited by Phat, : Lady Wisdom

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 45 by jar, posted 05-23-2007 9:42 PM Phat has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 45 of 95 (402046)
05-23-2007 9:42 PM
Reply to: Message 44 by Phat
05-23-2007 9:31 PM


Re: Lady Wisdom insists upon center stage
Jesus did make a path possible, where before Him there was no path.
If that is true the God is even more evil than anyone could imagine.
To assume that other religions have found a path that somehow is able to bypass God in the flesh is, in my opinion, ignorant.
Based on what? LOL
Do you honestly think that God expects us to accept a message without a messenger?
Huh?
Another soundbite from the Christian Cult of Ignorance.
Do you honestly think that she could care less if we acknowledge the source of her message?
Of course. What does the source have to do with the message?
What do you think she expects us to conclude? That we ourselves made up our own message to give to ourselves?
Of course we did. Regardless of the reality of the Jesus story, it still is left to us to make the message, interpret the message and act on the message.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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