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Author Topic:   Why do apples taste good?
taylor_31
Member (Idle past 5923 days)
Posts: 86
From: Oklahoma!
Joined: 05-14-2007


Message 1 of 41 (402781)
05-29-2007 11:24 PM


I was wondering why so many different species - including apples, oranges, pickles, and pears - taste so good. Why would they evolve that way?
What survival benefit would "tastiness" bestow? I can think of some hypothetical explanations:
1) The species somehow benefited from an organism that was eating it, or
2) The species was simply trying to protect its seeds, and accidently evolved tastiness, or
3) The tastiness is a product of artificial selection over human history.
I'm sure you science-minded people have an answer . Thanks for any help!!

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by dwise1, posted 05-30-2007 1:13 AM taylor_31 has replied
 Message 4 by Taz, posted 05-30-2007 1:30 AM taylor_31 has not replied
 Message 6 by PaulK, posted 05-30-2007 6:54 AM taylor_31 has not replied
 Message 9 by crashfrog, posted 05-30-2007 10:14 AM taylor_31 has replied
 Message 10 by Dr Adequate, posted 05-30-2007 10:34 AM taylor_31 has replied
 Message 11 by anastasia, posted 05-30-2007 11:32 AM taylor_31 has not replied
 Message 41 by Hyroglyphx, posted 09-22-2007 5:09 PM taylor_31 has not replied

  
taylor_31
Member (Idle past 5923 days)
Posts: 86
From: Oklahoma!
Joined: 05-14-2007


Message 13 of 41 (402874)
05-30-2007 1:44 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by dwise1
05-30-2007 1:13 AM


dwise1 writes:
With all due respect, what is your source for this "how did food evolve?" line. Years ago I saw another, local (ie, nowhere near OK), creationist use it in his newsletter
Now that I think of it, I did read a creationist article about a year ago asking this same question. Perhaps this was where the question was "planted" in my mind.
Honestly, the question was almost an off-the-cuff remark; I've been eating loads of apples lately and I started to wonder about the evolution of taste. I thought of some guesses and proceeded to ask for this forum's input, finding that you guys are very intelligent and helpful.
Admittedly, I could have looked up the answer via Google Scholar or something, but I find that this forum is more one-on-one. I'm almost dyslexic in my learning methods, so I definitely favor education via direct contact versus reading an encyclopedia article.
dwise1 writes:
I just caught this. "pickles". Pickles? OK, show me a "pickle plant". Have you ever seen one? I doubt that very much, since it doesn't exist.
Whoops . But I think it's still relevant, is it not? I mean, they are the product of artificial selection. I think that falls under my "guesses".

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taylor_31
Member (Idle past 5923 days)
Posts: 86
From: Oklahoma!
Joined: 05-14-2007


Message 14 of 41 (402875)
05-30-2007 1:51 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by crashfrog
05-30-2007 10:14 AM


crashfrog writes:
Your body is always prepared to enter a period of starvation, so you're always being rewarded for foods that would be a good "last meal." If you were going on a 2-week fast, what would you want your last meal to be? A cheeseburger and a milkshake, or a salad and an iced tea?
This reminds me of something my dad says.
He claims when his body is thirsty, it tells him to drink water. When his body is tired, it tells him to sleep. In addition, when his body is hungry, it tells him to eat. His body doesn't tell him to eat salad; instead, it tells him to eat ice cream or something similar.
That is how he justifies his eating habits. Needless to say, my dad isn't a health freak like myself or my mom. I can't wait to tell him your explanation!
Edited by taylor_31, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by crashfrog, posted 05-30-2007 10:14 AM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
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taylor_31
Member (Idle past 5923 days)
Posts: 86
From: Oklahoma!
Joined: 05-14-2007


Message 15 of 41 (402878)
05-30-2007 2:25 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by Taz
05-30-2007 11:39 AM


Tazmanian Devil writes:
First of all, my apology for the previous post. I was bitten by the anger bug last night.
We're all angry at one point or another, so don't worry about it .
Tazmanian Devil writes:
It's just that some of these questions really really make me think it's creationist attempt to spark up controversy.
I understand your concerns, but I'm really not a creationist. Though it might be to my utter embarrassment, this was a sincere question.
Tazmanian Devil writes:
Like I said, it's stuff that they teach in grade school. In fact, right now at this moment I am vaguely remembering learning about this in grade school, and it was a christian school I went to.
Consider yourself fortunate, because I never learned anything about the mechanics of evolution at my school. Sure, we read the chapter and filled out the worksheets, but those were simply excuses to pass the class; the class's real purpose was to discuss football and movies.
I hope you don't take this as an excuse for my woeful ignorance. In these times, there isn't a good excuse for ignorance, and I'm trying to remedy my own. EvC is one of my favorite ways to do that, whether by reading threads or by asking questions.
Tazmanian Devil writes:
You don't need a college biology degree. Grade school stuff.
Biology was never my strong suit, and I have a lot of trouble with trying to understand it. However, I think that we all have areas where we are terribly undereducated, and it's up to ourselves to educate those areas.
I would apologize for my ignorance/stupidity, but I can't bend over that far; instead, I'll simply say that I'll try harder.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by Taz, posted 05-30-2007 11:39 AM Taz has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 18 by tudwell, posted 05-30-2007 5:13 PM taylor_31 has not replied

  
taylor_31
Member (Idle past 5923 days)
Posts: 86
From: Oklahoma!
Joined: 05-14-2007


Message 16 of 41 (402885)
05-30-2007 2:48 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by Dr Adequate
05-30-2007 10:34 AM


Thanks for your post! You obviously made an effort to explain the answer to my question and I appreciate that. Everybody else has made postive contributions, as well.
In addition, thanks for defending the sincerity of my question.
You are correct in that multitudes of people are deceived by creationist propaganda. Though I asked one of the creationists' favorite talking points, I'm glad that you gave me the benefit of the doubt and gave me a strong and satisfying answer. (Many others did as well, and I appreciate all of their help.)
As a nervous newbie with less than twenty posts, I definitely appreciate your support and offer you my sincere thanks .

This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by Dr Adequate, posted 05-30-2007 10:34 AM Dr Adequate has not replied

  
taylor_31
Member (Idle past 5923 days)
Posts: 86
From: Oklahoma!
Joined: 05-14-2007


Message 23 of 41 (402970)
05-31-2007 2:39 AM
Reply to: Message 20 by Dr Adequate
05-30-2007 7:33 PM


Dr Adequate writes:
Not necessarily: because alternatively our metabolisms can evolve to adapt to our diet.
I'm not sure I understand. You're saying that our metabolisms can adapt to our diet, but I thought Western diets were actually worse for our bodies than other cultures (*cough* McDonalds *cough*). Have our metabolisms sped up or something to compensate for the unhealthiness? Have they adapted for survival benefits?
Sorry, I'm having a mental block right now

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by Dr Adequate, posted 05-30-2007 7:33 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 24 by crashfrog, posted 05-31-2007 2:53 AM taylor_31 has replied
 Message 25 by Doddy, posted 05-31-2007 7:32 AM taylor_31 has not replied
 Message 26 by Dr Adequate, posted 05-31-2007 10:39 AM taylor_31 has replied

  
taylor_31
Member (Idle past 5923 days)
Posts: 86
From: Oklahoma!
Joined: 05-14-2007


Message 27 of 41 (403014)
05-31-2007 12:07 PM
Reply to: Message 24 by crashfrog
05-31-2007 2:53 AM


crashfrog writes:
I think the food police exaggerate a little bit, and c'mon, a hamburger can't be that bad - cows are made out of it, after all, and being made out of cow isn't bad for cows, is it?
This is probably off-topic, but it's sort of relevant.
I don't think a hamburger every now and then is bad, but certainly a diet consisting of hamburgers would be bad for you. Then again, I'm guessing that a diet consisting of any one food is bad for you, including "healthy" foods. For example, if I only had fruit all day, then I don't think it's any healthier than eating Twinkies all day.
It's just that with Twinkies, you become fat, while for the fruit, you look good.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 24 by crashfrog, posted 05-31-2007 2:53 AM crashfrog has not replied

  
taylor_31
Member (Idle past 5923 days)
Posts: 86
From: Oklahoma!
Joined: 05-14-2007


Message 28 of 41 (403015)
05-31-2007 12:14 PM
Reply to: Message 26 by Dr Adequate
05-31-2007 10:39 AM


Dr Adequate writes:
When Europeans pursued an unnaturally fatty diet, this tended to kill off those Europeans who were genetically less able to cope with animal fats. This gave a selective advantage to Europeans who could cope with such a diet, and so by natural selection Europeans are better able to tolerate such a diet than, for example, Polynesians. Polynesians have not gone through this evolutionary process, so the result is that if you feed 'em on a Western diet, they get obese and then die of heart disease.
Okay, that makes more sense, thanks.
The question was would a diet of healthy foods have selective advantage over the course of human evolution. If our metabolisms did not evolve, then the selective advantage would take place, because people eating the unhealthy foods would die; but since our metabolisms did evolve, any selective advantage is gone, because people eating unhealthy foods do not die.
Is that right?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 26 by Dr Adequate, posted 05-31-2007 10:39 AM Dr Adequate has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 29 by New Cat's Eye, posted 05-31-2007 1:01 PM taylor_31 has not replied
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