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Author Topic:   Reasons for Creationist Persistence
cavediver
Member (Idle past 3669 days)
Posts: 4129
From: UK
Joined: 06-16-2005


Message 185 of 220 (403043)
05-31-2007 3:44 PM
Reply to: Message 183 by Dr Adequate
05-31-2007 10:17 AM


Re: If I Was A Creationist ...
Creationists, in my experience, are not interested in nature; they have no integrity; they do not have logical minds; they have all the humility of Satan himself; and they do want to win the argument, but they are so ignorant of science and the scientific method that they have no idea what this would entail.
Hey, Dr A... have you ever been a fundementalist Christian? I disagree with several of your points above, but in any case they are all trumped by one over-arching fact:
Couple what Percy said:
On average, lack of knowledge and expertise is extremely common at the grass roots level, for everyone, not just creationists, and because they're not really capable of studying the issues themselves they have to rely on what outside sources tell them. But this lack of ability to objectively study and analyze issues seems to persist right up the creationist chain of command
with...
A typical fundementalist Christian will trust and believe another fundementalist Christian over ANYONE else. Of course there are ranks of trust with Christian circles, but just about anyone within the circle trumps anyone outside that circle. If we are talking about an elder, pastor, leader, or above... then they are speaking with God's authority and speaking against them, even in private, is an act of rebellion. This scary fact is true also (and in some cases especially true) of undergraduates and even graduates/post graduates.
Of course there are many evangelical Christians that I would not consider fundemental and fall outside of this scary subset of Christianity. My family and I attend a fundementalist church

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 Message 183 by Dr Adequate, posted 05-31-2007 10:17 AM Dr Adequate has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 186 by Taz, posted 05-31-2007 5:00 PM cavediver has replied

  
cavediver
Member (Idle past 3669 days)
Posts: 4129
From: UK
Joined: 06-16-2005


Message 190 of 220 (403171)
06-01-2007 8:00 AM
Reply to: Message 186 by Taz
05-31-2007 5:00 PM


Re: If I Was A Creationist ...
I seem to recall reading about an evangelical pastor that was converted from creationism and began preaching against it. Almost over night, he lost most of his attendees.
Yes, of course. He was no longer a Fundementalist...
The simple fact is creationism is much simpler to digest than real science.
I don't think this has ANYTHING to do with the situation. It is a community belief, simple as that. Don't foget that I am also talking about grads and post-grads, some in life-science.
Since most people have not spent the effort and time in learning real science, talking to real science minded people somewhat give them a sense of inferiority.
And how often do you suppose that grass-roots individuals talk to science-minded people? It is the LACK OF contact with such science-types that makes the job of indoctrinating creationism so easy. And it is the SUPERIORITY that a Christian feels that enables one to so easily dismiss 'secular' scientific views - this is especially true amongst young Christians in their school environment.
In other words, you could say that jealousy is why the creationist movement is so popular among the ignorant crowd.
jealousy? are you kidding? There is pity, there is scorn, there is derision, there is anger, there is arrogance, and there is a huge dose of apathy to what the secular world thinks... but jealousy of scientists??? No, no, no...

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 Message 186 by Taz, posted 05-31-2007 5:00 PM Taz has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 191 by berberry, posted 06-01-2007 9:21 AM cavediver has replied
 Message 192 by jar, posted 06-01-2007 10:26 AM cavediver has replied

  
cavediver
Member (Idle past 3669 days)
Posts: 4129
From: UK
Joined: 06-16-2005


Message 193 of 220 (403205)
06-01-2007 10:53 AM
Reply to: Message 191 by berberry
06-01-2007 9:21 AM


Re: If I Was A Creationist ...
Hi Berberry,
First off, yes I'm sure there are Fundies like that but as you say, "I'm talking about a rather atypical fundie"
at least a few of them are deeply jealous of people who understand and can converse about scientific concepts. They are adults who probably regret the fact that they were either never taught science or didn't pay attention. They were taught their church's interpretation of the bible and not much, if anything, else.
If they are really at that point of regret, I would suggest that they are ripe for de-conversion from Fundie-hood. If they truly think that they are missing something, that is a good sign. I would thus place jealousy as a positive marker. It is those, in the vast majority, who do not think they have missed anything - on the contrary they have avoided the secular brainwashing!
Edited by cavediver, : No reason given.

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cavediver
Member (Idle past 3669 days)
Posts: 4129
From: UK
Joined: 06-16-2005


Message 194 of 220 (403211)
06-01-2007 11:10 AM
Reply to: Message 192 by jar
06-01-2007 10:26 AM


Re: If I Was A Creationist ...
Hi Jar, sorry I've give the wrong impression here - I am only talking about Creationist/Fundies so yes, the CCoI.
And I'm not talking about Christian schools, just Fundie kids in normal state/private schools. Given a clique of two or three minimum, they will have the confidence and superiority complex to laugh at all the evolution/secular teaching - this attitude is carefully nurtured on Sundays.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 192 by jar, posted 06-01-2007 10:26 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 196 by jar, posted 06-01-2007 11:38 AM cavediver has not replied

  
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