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Author Topic:   Reliable history in the Bible
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 33 of 300 (375546)
01-08-2007 11:56 PM
Reply to: Message 32 by doctrbill
01-08-2007 9:31 PM


Re: What about the tales of Assyrian conquests as far south as Gaza
doctrbill writes:
... Assyria once held Egypt as far south as the first (or was it the second?) cataract of the Nile.
According to this map, a little below the first cataract (though I don't know if the map represents the height of the Assyrian Empire).
**insert joke about A Cataract Too Far**

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ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 107 of 300 (378929)
01-22-2007 1:13 PM
Reply to: Message 106 by Nimrod
01-22-2007 12:55 PM


Re: My exact words!
MightyPlaceNimrod writes:
... Ill Quote a very specific part of my near-quote of Silberman (I will find HIS exact quote later....
Since this is the Bible Accuracy forum and the topic is about reliable history, maybe you could clarify your methodology:
What exactly is a "near-quote"? And how does it differ from an "exact quote"?

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This message is a reply to:
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ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 110 of 300 (378953)
01-22-2007 2:34 PM
Reply to: Message 108 by Nimrod
01-22-2007 1:53 PM


Re: Exact quotes.
MightyPlaceNimrod writes:
(first of all Ringo, I was quoting MYSELF in the post #106 responce to CA, and it wasnt something I Quoted from Silberman.I was simply pointing out Finkelsteins views as outlined by Silberman, read my initial post and you wilI see I only highlighted what I was quoting."Invisible Israelites" was a quote because it had quotation marks, though i ddint highlight it.)
Even if that paragraph is in English - and I highly doubt that it is - it doesn't answer the question.
I asked what a "near-quote" is and how it differs from an "exact quote".
It has nothing to do with any Silberman/Finkelstein controversy. It has nothing to do with whom you quoted. It has nothing to do with highlighting or non-highlighting. It has nothing to do with quotation marks or non-quotation marks or quotation non-marks.
I'm just asking what a "near-quote" is, according to you, and how it differs from an "exact quote".
We can only assess the quality of your research if we understand your terminology. (Being able to understand a simple question would testify to your reading comprehension too. )

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Replies to this message:
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ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 112 of 300 (379014)
01-22-2007 5:13 PM
Reply to: Message 111 by Nimrod
01-22-2007 4:39 PM


Re: Scratch out "near-quote"
MightyPlaceNimrod writes:
Scratch out "near-quote". Replace it with *summary*.
Fair enough.
I'm a stickler because "near-quote" sounds a lot like "I'm quoting Silberfinkel but I'm changing the parts I don't like."
We have enough problems with quote-mining. We don't need to invent new methods of misquoting.
Either it's a quote or it's not.

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ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 114 of 300 (379037)
01-22-2007 6:26 PM
Reply to: Message 113 by Nimrod
01-22-2007 5:56 PM


Re: Thanks.
MightyPlaceNimrod writes:
(off topic but I want to beat this a little more)
Since I'm giving out free advice today: When trying to alleviate confusion, don't ramble on and on and on and on and on about things the confusee didn't question.

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ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 242 of 300 (420862)
09-09-2007 7:32 PM
Reply to: Message 240 by Siggy
09-09-2007 7:02 PM


Siggy writes:
... science is the study of repeatable events.
Science is more like the study of repeatable observations. The events themselves don't have to be repeatable.
The same goes for history.

“Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels
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Replies to this message:
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ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 247 of 300 (420934)
09-10-2007 11:04 AM
Reply to: Message 243 by Siggy
09-10-2007 1:51 AM


Siggy writes:
have you ever observed the age of the earth?
Have you ever observed your own age?
You were there at your own birth, but you weren't in any condition to observe, or to know the time and date. Think about it: How do you really know how old you are?
As Ned has suggested, detailed discussion of that question should go to the appropriate thread.
until you see something happen, you can only make inferences about what happened from the effects left behind.
And, of course, inferences from solid data are far more relaible than eyewitness reports - both scientifically and historically.
It is, however, wrong for science to do what they are now....
The topic isn't about your misunderstanding of science. It's about reliable history in the Bible.
Edited by Ringo, : Sprlling.

“Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels
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 Message 251 by Siggy, posted 09-13-2007 9:36 PM ringo has replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 263 of 300 (421854)
09-14-2007 8:38 PM
Reply to: Message 251 by Siggy
09-13-2007 9:36 PM


Siggy writes:
... someone did witness my birth; and they recorded it on an official document....
The point (for this thread) is that that document is of no value without other evidence to corroborate it. There's a lot of fake IDs around. That's why you have to provide three pieces of ID, photo ID, ID with your signature, etc. You need documents from different sources that agree with each other to authenticate who you are.
Similarly, any documentary evidence in the Bible needs outside evidence to corroborate it.
That's what this thread is about. Is there any history in the Bible that's been verified by evidence from outside the Bible?
Your next post should consist of:
  1. An example from the Bible, including the citation and preferably the quotation.
  2. Arachaeological, documentary, etc. evidence from outside the Bible that directly confirms the Bible story.

“Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels
-------------
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ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 266 of 300 (422565)
09-17-2007 6:43 PM
Reply to: Message 264 by Force
09-17-2007 6:23 PM


trossthree writes:
Can you please provide some resources for your claim.
The way the thread is set up, you should give some examples that you think are supported by archaeology, etc.
quote:
... start at the begining of Genesis and work your way through the Bible and tick off just how many 'historical' events mentioned are supported (or even plausible) in an historical context. Message 1
Then we'll have something specific to discuss.

“Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels
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ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 268 of 300 (422571)
09-17-2007 7:25 PM
Reply to: Message 267 by Force
09-17-2007 7:00 PM


trossthree writes:
I am seeking information from the poster.
Brian hasn't been around for a while. Don't hold your breath waiting for him.
In any case, he presented a challenge to those who think there is reliable history in the Bible. He isn't obligated to show that there isn't.

“Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels
-------------
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 Message 267 by Force, posted 09-17-2007 7:00 PM Force has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 269 by Force, posted 09-17-2007 7:42 PM ringo has replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 270 of 300 (422577)
09-17-2007 7:48 PM
Reply to: Message 269 by Force
09-17-2007 7:42 PM


trossthree writes:
Brian on the other hand posted an argument with no resources to support his evidences.
Brian didn't post an argument. He posted a challenge to Bible-as-history advocates to present their argument.

“Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels
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Replies to this message:
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ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 273 of 300 (422597)
09-17-2007 8:11 PM
Reply to: Message 272 by Force
09-17-2007 8:03 PM


Re: The Bibles Historical Credibility
trossthree writes:
Just to show that I am aware of the direction of this thread; I will argue that "some of the Bible may have credible histories".
If you're going to make an argument, please make it here (and in your own words), not by link.
Also, please get on with it. These threads are normally shut down after 300 posts.

“Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels
-------------
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This message is a reply to:
 Message 272 by Force, posted 09-17-2007 8:03 PM Force has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 274 by Force, posted 09-17-2007 8:13 PM ringo has replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 275 of 300 (422600)
09-17-2007 8:17 PM
Reply to: Message 274 by Force
09-17-2007 8:13 PM


Re: The Bibles Historical Credibility
trossthree writes:
I made my argument. The link was my support.
You made a statement, not an argument. You need to tell us how your link supports your statement.

“Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels
-------------
Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
 Message 274 by Force, posted 09-17-2007 8:13 PM Force has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 276 by Force, posted 09-17-2007 8:51 PM ringo has replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 277 of 300 (422618)
09-17-2007 8:58 PM
Reply to: Message 276 by Force
09-17-2007 8:51 PM


Re: The Bibles Historical Credibility
trossthree writes:
... you seem to agree with me or we would have an argument.
Agree with what? I haven't seen anything from you about the topic.
If you have an example of reliable history in the Bible, post it. Give the chapter and verse (preferably quote them) and then explain in your own words what historical/archaeological evidence there is to support it.
Edited by Ringo, : Shpelling.

“Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels
-------------
Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation.
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC

This message is a reply to:
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