Childhood Vaccinations – Necessary or Overkill?

There is no evidence whatsoever that vaccinations cause autism.None.And there have been studies.

So you are telling me that vaccinations should be forced upon the entire population whether they want it or not? Wow. Has no one been listening to what I've said about vaccines possibly being unsafe? How do we know? Where are the studies? If I choose to believe that the risk from injecting my daughter with mercury, aluminum, antifreeze, bovine and monkey tissue and other substances is greater than the risk of her being permanently damaged by a disease, you would still strip me of my right to say "no"? I'm glad the government doesn't share your views.You seem to be assuming that your child would be in immediate danger of contracting harmful diseases because I choose not to vaccinate my child. You are assuming that my child would be in close regular contact with your infant, yes? What if I agreed not to let her near your infant until your infant was immunised, just to be on the safe side?Two other factors here in this hypothetical situation. One, if you had had several of these diseases yourself, you would have conferred immunity to your child for its first several months of life. That's how things worked naturally before vaccinations. Two, you choose to believe that there is less risk from the ingredients in the vaccines than there is from the diseases. Are you unconcerned about injecting an infant with the sorts of substances I listed above? Some of these substances are known neurotoxins. Your baby is very small and has a developing brain. Why is anyone who thinks this might be a cause for concern labelled as a hippy or a sadist?

I only included it to show that concerns about the efficacy of vaccines are not new. I found this document interesting from a historical perspective, but I also think there is sense in it.

there is NO evidence whatsoever that autism is in any way contributed to by vaccination. there have been tons of studies. the only evidence is crazy parents who want to blame someone for a "disorder" that makes them have to work harder. no evidence. none. and tons of evidence saying it has NOTHING to do with it. NOTHING. NOTHING. oh but my baby shut down the day after his vaccine and i saw his eyes glaze over! and you're insane and inventing stuff.further, to blame adhd (which no one "suffers" from) on them is just insane. sure, it's possible that much of neurological "disorders" are a mixed spectrum of distinct function which could be a single "disorder" with a handbasket of "malfunctions" which peoples minds exhibit at will. but. it requires a distinct misunderstanding of what makes these "disorders" and how they are aquired (or rather, aren't). stated simply, adhd is inherited. if your kids have it, it's all your fault. stop trying to pass the buck. but. if your child has adhd and can't function as a "normal" human being, it's even more your fault. you failed to give him the tools he needs to succeed. it's more than possible, and you failed. suck it up. some have discussed the potential of acquiring adhd through physical brain trauma, but i don't buy it. having a damaged brain is distinct from having a brain that works differently. my brain doesn't fail to work, it works just fine. but, even if adhd symptoms can be acquired through trauma, the idea that a vaccine can cause trauma (except through insane parents who create a feeling of crisis and attack) is ludicrous.penicillin is safe and useful and awesome. but, i'm allergic to it. if i take it, i will become psychotic and potentially harm myself and others. should we take penicillin off the market because it causes psychosis?i have another question for you. the chicken pox vaccine. not only does it prevent chicken pox (a disease that can kill people over the age of 10 or so, and one i've never had), but a study my great-aunt has been involved in at the UT hospital, it has been demonstrated that it cures shingles. amazing. so instead of giving my kid the vaccine, i should expose him to a ravaging virus that almost killed a friend of my brother's in middle school in the hope that he'll get it young and not die so that he can't get it when he's older and die? that's just CRAZY.

I honestly have to say I'm glad you recovered from your depression and were able to get your life back on track Nator. I know so many people who have gone through horrific experiences in trying to get their depression treated that it's refreshing to hear about someone who was spared that. I don't disagree with anything you've said. You've summed it up well in fact: in treating depression, it's important to address the roots of the problem, whatever they may be. It sounds like you identified yours. For others it isn't always that easy.I'd also ask you to remember that most people who are drawn to alt med are people who have exhausted their possibilities through the conventional medical system. They tend to be very ill, and often desperate. Their trust was placed in a system that was unable to help them. What you are calling "crank" has ended up being a lifeline for people who would otherwise have had nowhere else to turn, and I've watched many of them getting well.

and what about all the other people who come in contact with your child who would come in contact with his child? are you willing to keep your child locked in the house all her life, or make her wear a sign that says "i haven't been vaccinated" as an appropriate warning for anyone she make come in contact with and in turn kill? are you really willing to put her in the position of being responsible for giving someone a deadly or disfiguring disease? dear god, i hope you at least give her the hpv vaccine. you've still failed to demonstrate this. also, there's loads of bovine tissue in my body. mmmm tasty tasty bovine. out there waiting for your eyeballs to read them. this immunity is temporary. you can't acquire immunity. you have to build it.Edited by brennakimi, : No reason given.

you are aware that studies have demonstrated that even severe depression corrects itself after about 6 months, right?

Wow, do you know people with an autistic child? This is an amazing attitude.I agree that there is no evidence that says for certain that vaccination and autism are causally linked. However, it is a fact that autism is much more common than it used to be, and also that children are receiving many more vaccinations than they did in the past. I accept that it is a fallacy to assume that because A and B happened at the same time, they must be connected. But I think it ought to at least prompt some questions. Autism isn't the only disease/condition in children that is on the rise.Do you actually know what causes ADHD? A variety of possibilities have been postulated. Why are you so sure that vaccines cannot possibly contribute? I can't believe you are actually blaming parents for their children having ADHD, I'm gobsmacked. Where is your evidence that it's all the fault of the parents? This is nothing more than an argument from incredulity. Has it been published? Can I see it?You have a few choices there. You can get a vaccine. I'm not stopping you. Or you could megadose vitamin C for shingles. Linus Pauling says it works well.

Does it? I wonder how they'd explain the fact that I had it for three years? What are these studies exactly?Edited by LindaLou, : No reason given.

My child is not a leper and I am not going to let anyone treat her as such. She is not a walking cesspit of disease.There are no studies comparing a vaccinated population to an unvaccinated population to establish the safety of vaccines.There is a link to the CDC site in my post to Molbio girl where the ingredients of vaccines are listed. This should not now be in dispute.It is also a fact that a mother who has acquired immunity to polio, measles, mumps and chicken pox will confer that immunity to her child during its first few months of life.Do you not bother to look up any information?

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However, it is a fact that autism is much more common than it used to be

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No, thst is not a fact.The fact is that the diagnosis of autism is more common than it used to be.Autism has probably been around a long time but wasn't understood as well as it is today, so it is no surprise that the number of identified cases is higher now that our understanding is greater.Autism is NOT on the rise due to vaccines. It it likely that it isn't on the rise at all.Added by edit:LL, here is an excellent article that examines the evidence we have been discussing. Please do not reject it out of hand becasue it is a skeptical source. It is a well-referenced article and is balanced. Please read this Edited by nator, : No reason given.

i have a friend with aspergers and i worked with autistic children for two years in a swim program. every single one of their teachers and parents said they'd never respond, they can't hear you, they don't understand you, they won't learn anything. and yet, every single child learned to swim better while he was with me. maybe they can't swim the english channel. yet. but they did understand me and they did learn. it's uncomfortable to learn to work with people who are different. it's hard. but to do anything but do just that and you're being selfish and lazy. it is being more readily diagnosed instead of just consigning all "retards" to the local institution. it has, and studies have demonstrated that the vaccines clearly have nothing to do with the rise, but rather more ready diagnosis. it's hereditary. fault is really a stretch, but you know as well as i that people feel responsible for their genes. yes. a genetically sourced subarrousal of the frontal lobe. tell me how a vaccine can cause physical trauma. please. i'm not sure. i could call her. you're joking, right? vitamin c is a water solluble vitamin. the only thing a megadose will do is make my piss smell like oranges.

I couldn't let this pass. You said Do you also agree that many more children are keeping hampsters as pets as the rate of autism has increased? Should this prompt some questions?This is exactly what Andrew Wakefield did in his study which claimed that the MMR caused autism. He studied a grand total of 12 children who were selected on the basis of having autism, what he called "autistic bowel disorder" or both and then asked the question "How many of these children were given the MMR?"Given that the MMR uptake rate was pretty high at the time, the answer was pretty high, 11 out of the 12 I think. On the basis of this AND THIS ALONE, he announced that MMR caused autism and vaccination rates still have not recovered.All his co-authors on the paper have retracted their claims, subsequent studies have totally refuted his claims, the journal which published the original paper did so only to show how NOT to do research and explained this in their editorial of that issue. Unfortunately that wasn't reported. The media missed the point completely and the journal has said they should never have published in the first place.Meanwhile, there are still poeple who use outdated source material and claim to be informed. You can't use source material from the nineties and expect to be up to date or well-informed, I also note that many of your antivaccination sources are from the 1960s and before. Thy're worse than useless - they're dangerous and to trust you child's health to outdated opinions WHICH HAVE SUBSEQUENTLY BEEN SHOWN TO BE WRONG is misguided at best.A suggestion for you is to look at all the evidence. Don't just look at the evidence which you think supports your point of view. The reasons all the sources you have given are so old is because those sources which refute you are the more recent ones and they are pro-vaccine. Any anti-vaccine evidence of more recent date can only be found at crank websites, expounded by people who don't understand what they're talking about, but who know a few buzzwords which impress the even worse informed.I'll try to dig out more info on the Andrew Wakefield paper. I have it on .pdf on the hard drive of a dead computer and don't think I can access it. Can I say that after having read his paper I was appalled at the total lack of thinking, critical or otherwise, which went into that paper. I'm a research scientist myself. If I produced research of that quality, I would fully expect and deserve to be fired and blackballed.Edited by Trixie, : No reason given.

overlapping cases. or, you're not really depressed. it could be another psychological or neurological condition, or you're simply not fully stimulated by something.or, it's chronic depression which is different from acute depression, which i assumed you were speaking of. i've had chronic low-grade depression since 4th grade. it is a result from continued abuse relating to my neurological "disorders" and ptsd from personal illness and the death of family members and more abuse resulting from said "disorders". i'll bet you have an underlying stimulus that you're not paying attention to. if you're depressed to the level of not being able to function, there are solutions that don't depend on flavored water.

This is not true of autism. There have been many large scale studies of the link between MMR and autism. There isn't one. This is not "no evidence of a link", this is "compelling evidence of no link" Links to many, many studies