Language and the Tower of Babel

Really this is a product of some kind of attempt to apply logic to "scripture as a whole". God provides Jesus to get us into heaven and must therefore be utterly pissed off by people getting close some other way. This means that heaven must really have been physically located in earth's atmosphere back then before God decided he couldn't outwit the humans that way and relocated (100 years after the flood in simple's chronology -- though that begs the question of where Jesus went when he ascended... if he ascended into space did he asphyxiate and die again?), or God wouldn't have had to ruin the project.

Non-sequitur. Please explain how this follows. If heaven was removed from earth's atmosphere and relocated, how could Jesus ascend into it? Was he human or not? Didn't he go to great lengths to prove he was still human after his resurrection? Possibly. Or this could be reading the OT with a NT lens, something I doubt the original authors intended.

The person in question is already bringing Jesus into the Tower of Babel, and has implied that there was a physical heaven somewhere in earth's atmosphere at the time that is somehow not there now but is but isn't like it was then. The parallel to the ascension of course is to show that even as far as NT some people still believed heaven was a physical place in the atmosphere, so it doesn't make sense to say that around the time of Babel the reality of heaven being a physical place in the atmosphere somehow changed. This raises the question of -- at what point did Jesus cease to be human and become supernatural? But that is OT.

Wait. Heaven is still over earth, just not the part that's over earth? And where is this? Inside our physical universe? Outside it? So if I'm to understand correctly, your chronology is that God removed heaven from above earth at some point post-flood, then Jesus ascended into some kind of temporary heaven that wasn't above earth but still there, then when he was there, built a New Jerusalem where heaven currently is. In other words, you're right and I'm wrong. Not a great stance to be taking for debate. You don't think that maybe this means that things "out of heaven" could just be similar to one another? Assuming biblical inerrancy and all. Nowhere in the NT does it say that Jesus was those heavenly hosts encountered in the OT.

So God actually built the molten iron core of earth to house unworthy spirits? It is hot, I'll give you that. But what about when earth gets engulfed by the sun when it goes red giant in a couple billion years? Is God going to have to move hell then or is the red giant sun going to become the new hell?If we could split earth in half and cool it off, would we see tortured, immortal bodies lodged in there? Or if it's just noncorporeal spirits without pain neurons, how is it that they would "feel" the heat anyway? What happens to an unsaved astronaut who goes to mars and dies there? Does he go to the center-of-mars hell or the center-of-earth hell? If spiritual things are always, forever, and permanently beyond physical detection, how can you possibly know they are real?

We do seem to be getting sidetracked trying to make simple clearly elucidate his concept of Just Where Heaven Is and as such we're allowing him to lead the thread.OK. We know how simple reconciles his beliefs with his reality, which was the thrust of my original post, even though a lot of us have been hounding him to elaborate because his beliefs don't make much sense to us and he seems to keep changing his answer. Perhaps we continue discussion of the location of heaven and hell (except as relates directly to ToB) in a separate thread?Edited by bernerbits, : added a qualifying parenthetical statement

Possibly because not even most fundies believe what simple does about the physical location of heaven?

No, he'll just turn UAE into a multicultural nation to thwart their plans. Oh wait.