Are thoughts transcendant?

Hot-damn, frog, that was quite a pin-down.On the topic of telepathy... What is reality to anyone but input from your senses? That is our connection to the world, without our senses the only way we knew we existed is a la Descartes. What gives you the ability to judge outside of your senses? ... and many people believe in assorted varieties of deities as well, even though you mentioned in an earlier post you didnt ascribe to that. What is the differance between the two? Both are assumptions not founded in reality, that is to say, input from your 5 senses.Hmm, (on an unrelated topic) now that i think of it, shouldnt your inner-ear/cochlea system count as a 6th sense?

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Define sensefield.
Define raw energy.
Step out of the science fiction, and maybe those points can be adressed.As to the storm example, animals eqaute the sudden and obvious drop in pressure with a storm rather well, having nothing to do with EM radiation at all. The quake example has never been decisively proven; if you have evidance to the contrary then by all means post it.Human minds recieving and interpereting EM waves other than those outside the visible spectrum is utter bullshit. We do not have the hardware for it, and if we did by some random feat of genetics we would not be able to discern it from all the backround radiation that we are bathed in every single day.

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Sure there is frog!And here can it be found with its closely related cousin, the bible! In fact, im sure the latter stems from the former.I rather liked "sensefield" more, but that cant even be adressed in scientific form.

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This statement is false.Yeah so i lurk more than i post, thats why my posts are so low for two year's worth of membership. So sue me.

Superman : Kryptonite :: Telepath : Bananas
A battery might, but hows about a thermonuclear device? It can sit there all it likes and im still gonna have more respect for its titanic destructive power than a natural disaster. But lindaLou, you CAN quantify and/or qualify ANYTHING you perceive. Of course science can tell you your mother loves you: you can SEE her actions and judge them for yourself, you can FEEL her intimacy, you can even HEAR her say it to you. And the reason you arrive at the conclusion that she loves you is not because of some deeper unexplained phenomenon that preconditions you to love, it is based of your concept of love as based upon your upbringing.I challenge you to name one thing that EXISTS (and you can maintain at least a few people that agree with you) that cannot be quantified or qualified by the senses.Edited by Damouse, : No reason given.

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So if enlightenment cannot be quantified or qualified by the senses, how do you know that someone is enlightened? Can you just feel it?Do you know that they are enlightened before they speak?
No.You hear, see, or read their thoughts and ideas and then judge for yourself if they are enlightened, based on your perception of enlightenment, further based on any of hundreds of factors, all which can be traced to concrete conditions such as upbringing, schooling, and even what you read last weekend on the topic.If you were led into a room blindfolded and told that three people are seated in front of you, one of whom is perceived to be enlightened and the other two legally mentally retarded, could you tell which one was enlightened? Could you even tell that there was anyone sitting in front of you without using your senses?The universe is concrete, dont delude yourself otherwise. If you still maintain otherwise, continue the examples.

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Science is not a tool, it is a method. It is based upon logic, and most human beings claim to have some part of that. You do not gain knowledge from science, you use science to gain knowledge.What you say is not logical, lindalou. That there is something that you feel exists only to a certain select minority, or exists to everyone and only a few can percieve it does not make sense logically. The world we live in is mundane and is subject to logic. Your fantasies are not.Like the science turn around, i dont judge experiances because ive already made up my mind, ive already made up my mind because of what i have experianced. The universe is not ours to make of it as we please, it is what it is.Maybe i will oneday have spiritual experiances. And that day i will change my mindset. But then again, maybe one day the Magical People of of the Woo will come and take you away.

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Not in all aspects per se, but generally yes. If spirituality skews facts, then it has no place in science. There isnt a section of your brain that is logical and understandable and a section that is filled with etherereal, mythical dust. From a computer standpoint, no matter how complex and abstract a system is, it is always founded in logic in its lowest layer. In its highest abstraction layer, things might not seem so, but that has no bearing on what truely makes the system up. Likewise with the Brain. I dont claim to know the contents of the universe, but i do claim at least a bare knowledge of the rules of the game. What you say and think has nothing on the content that i percieve and even if it did i claim no knowledge over all of the contents. What you say goes against the basest rules of the universe, and unless we live in differant places, those tend to be the same.What you think has no direct impact on me, except that i percieve it to be wrong. Should i step back and say "hey, more power to you?" If that was the way things worked in debates nothing would be debated.

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Science may not be the same as logic by definition but science is founded upon science. The statement does not have to be valid in reverse for science to be a production of logic. When DOES logic contradict reality, out of general curiousity? A few potential situations come to mind, but there is always a logical, higher reason that i can think fo for each situation. What are you thinknig of? Did you read my post? I specifically said that at its highest levels, the brain is an incredibly abstract computer. But, like ANY computer or ANY abstract system, at its basest level you will always find simplicity and uniformity, all completly logic and obvious. NO. Specifically opposite to what i said, but maybe i didnt make my points clear. I stated that science should never be an object; you should never look at science, you should look at everything else with science, with logic. At its more obvious and concrete level it does create us models and explain the world around us, but the spirit of science, the skepticism and curiosity and logic, does not just have a place in the classroom and the lab.My favorite scholastic question was, "what is the point of learning this math?" And the answer begun; Its useful for x, y, z, it teaches you study habits, it expands your mind and teaches you to THINK. Once one leaves the classroom, you do not stop applying that open-mindedness, that Math sense because its only applicable for math.If we have no logic, we have nothing as humans.

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This statement is false.Yeah so i lurk more than i post, thats why my posts are so low for two year's worth of membership. So sue me.

Oh linda.What an interesting response. Im kinda sad we drove you out.

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This statement is false.Yeah so i lurk more than i post, thats why my posts are so low for two year's worth of membership. So sue me.