What Is A Christian (Remix)

In an off topic rant in the Discussion of Moderation thread, Iano made this comment:

quote:

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Jar is not a Christian. Never has been (but hopefully will be). From Rays perspective (and mine) Jar is a 5th Columnist - and could expect to be (as per type) particularly reviled by those who recognize him for what he is.

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I will never be so brash as to judge whom God accepts versus whom God does not accept. Jar is an Episcopalian . I would pay close attention in this link to the following three statements:

Uniformity of beliefs and disciplines is stifling. Our differences disclose the variety of gifts the Spirit gives. We will have different perceptions about what friendship with God requires of us. So we don't tell each other what to do or make judgments about each other. We do try to be supportive of each other. We try to be "a church in which there are no outcasts" as our former Presiding Bishop puts it. We struggle hard to overcome those fears which keep us from being fully inclusive. God is not through with us yet. So we strive to be a community in which we have “in all things essential, unity; in all things non-essential, diversity; in all things, charity.”

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The Scriptures speak God's truth with special power and are God's Word. Simplistic and literalistic interpretations may miss the point of what God says to us.

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Reason is a gift. We should accept it even in religious matters. We affirm the importance of an ongoing conversation between the voices of faith and those of science, art, culture, economics and public life.

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In this topic, I wish to discuss the attributes of what makes a Christian a Christian.

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I also want everyone to be familiar with the following concepts:

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Inclusivism

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Exclusivism

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Common Grace

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Prevenient Grace

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Faith & Belief, please.

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Edited by Phat, : added link

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Edited by Phat, : added link again

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Edited by Phat, :

Although some believe that while on earth, Jesus was only human.
If God raised Him from the dead, the onus is still Gods power and not Jesus power.I would say that believing that He is alive today with God is more to the point. But thats just my personal belief. Its a different paradigm, though. The exclusivists believe that although Jesus died for everyone, individuals need to accept God (or Jesus) for who He is and not for who they think He is.

I agree with you. Anyone may be able to make it into heaven by doing the good philosophies of the tales told round the campfire, but to be a Christian, you need to relate to Christ IMHO.

This topic sure moves fast!

Some people believe that God died for everyone, and that salvation is unearned and not chosen. Others believe that Baptism is a central prerequisite. Still others believe that although God chose all of us, we must respond to His call.

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Ringo writes:

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What I've been saying is that "relating to Christ" means doing like Christ, not saying, "I relate to Christ."

so does "doing like Christ" mean praying a large portion of the day?

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I agree that being Christlike could be done by a Hindu, a Buddhist, or an Atheist.

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I don't agree that it is irrelevant whether or not Christ even actually lived. The whole idea of God becoming man has enormous implications. To throw that belief away is to reduce God to whatever
philosophical concept one chooses to ascribe to Him.

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IMB, God is not a product of human definition and wisdom. God exists and permeates our daily lives whether or not we choose to acknowledge Him. (An unsupported assertion, I know! )

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The issue seems to hinge on whether doing good simply for the sake of doing good carries as much weight with God as the concept of trusting in Him and allowing His Spirit to permeate your daily life.

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Edited by Phat, : spellcheck-o-rama

My observation was that not all Christians believe that one needs to be saved. Are we to conclude that they are not real Christians by believing in inclusivism?Further, not all denominations of Christianity believe that the Bible is inerrant. Can one side claim the moral high ground in that regard? So who is this enemy?Edited by Phat, : added

Evidently, some things never change. Of course, this brings up the question of what it means to follow Christ anyway... So Jesus deliberately set this up, or can we blame Dad for that one?

One, yet not the same. Jesus died. God never died.

You and I often discuss the difference between source and content.I usually take the position that the source of wisdom (which I believe to be GOD) is a necessary component of the value of that wisdom. You usually say that the source of wisdom is irrelevant, but that the content of the wisdom determines its value.IF Jesus was just a myth and a story told around ancient campfires, the storytellers still would have to acquire their content from some sort of a source, wouldn't they?In order to tell a good story around a campfire, one needs either:

experience

good teachers (such as other storytellers, which leads to the question of the source of wisdom for the very first storyteller)

Common sense (which usually is found through observation, logic, reason, and experience of reality).

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I guess my question is this: How can a good storyteller have good content without having good source(s)?

Funny, as I reread these old topics, but we indulge in exactly the same arguments today!

Looks like some things never change! We are again talking about whether or not jar is a Christian and what the criteria are for such a title. Look back through this old topic and many of the issues will be brought up again.

You were more open to how a believer thinks back then! Dont throw that away....