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Author Topic:   Jesus Camp documentary
Lithodid-Man
Member (Idle past 2931 days)
Posts: 504
From: Juneau, Alaska, USA
Joined: 03-22-2004


Message 1 of 13 (384125)
02-10-2007 6:55 AM


I recently saw the video "Jesus Camp", a documentary about a youth camp in North Dakota run by Becky Fischer that serves evangelical children. The video profiles several of the kids before and during the camp. As a heartless atheist, I found some portions to hard to watch. Children brought to tears by medically incorrect descriptions of abortion and the like. The whole thing reeked of child abuse IMO.
But that aside. Some of the kids in this movie scared the hell out of me. They are like ten year olds but are talking about holy wars and sin. Unintended comic relief comes from a visit from pastor Ted Haggard where he discusses the evils of homosexuality (this was pre-outing).
I would like to discuss this video with people of varying opinions but only those who have seen it. No peanut gallery "we got what we needed from IMDB" (Internet Movie Data Base). Also I want to stay away from the documetary makers only focussing on the bad parts. The people say enough for a lively and intelligent discussion here. Maybe they were hopelessly biassed, but lets focus on what they did say.
No idea where this would fit. I am hoping someone smarter than myself will find a place.
Edited by Lithodid-Man, : Wrote out what IMDB stood for as per PD's request

Doctor Bashir: "Of all the stories you told me, which were true and which weren't?"
Elim Garak: "My dear Doctor, they're all true"
Doctor Bashir: "Even the lies?"
Elim Garak: "Especially the lies"

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by AdminPD, posted 02-10-2007 7:10 AM Lithodid-Man has replied
 Message 5 by arachnophilia, posted 02-11-2007 12:53 AM Lithodid-Man has replied
 Message 10 by Phat, posted 12-31-2007 3:24 AM Lithodid-Man has not replied

  
AdminPD
Inactive Administrator


Message 2 of 13 (384128)
02-10-2007 7:10 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Lithodid-Man
02-10-2007 6:55 AM


Could you provide what IMDB stands for?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Lithodid-Man, posted 02-10-2007 6:55 AM Lithodid-Man has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by Lithodid-Man, posted 02-10-2007 8:34 PM AdminPD has not replied

  
Lithodid-Man
Member (Idle past 2931 days)
Posts: 504
From: Juneau, Alaska, USA
Joined: 03-22-2004


Message 3 of 13 (384300)
02-10-2007 8:34 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by AdminPD
02-10-2007 7:10 AM


Changes made...
I edited the OP to include Internet Movie Database.
In terms of focus (if this helps placement) I would like to examine where on the spectrum the group in the movie lie. It seems to me that they are a fringe group relative to even conservative Christianity. But in my own fleeting experience with parents who homeschool I saw a good number of people who reminded me of the parents in this movie.
Great potential topics would be the similarity (or lack of) between these kinds of camps and some of the extreme madrasahs. Are some the activities portrayed in this movie child abuse? At least one of the children showed a tic disorder which could indicate some neurological misfunctions. So is it religious intensity or an actual physical disorder? Anyhow, video is ripe for discussion!

Doctor Bashir: "Of all the stories you told me, which were true and which weren't?"
Elim Garak: "My dear Doctor, they're all true"
Doctor Bashir: "Even the lies?"
Elim Garak: "Especially the lies"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by AdminPD, posted 02-10-2007 7:10 AM AdminPD has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by RAZD, posted 01-01-2008 7:02 PM Lithodid-Man has not replied

  
AdminPhat
Inactive Member


Message 4 of 13 (384332)
02-10-2007 11:18 PM


Thread moved here from the Proposed New Topics forum.

  
arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1344 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 5 of 13 (384354)
02-11-2007 12:53 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Lithodid-Man
02-10-2007 6:55 AM


unfortunately, i cannot participate yet.
i'd really like to see this documentary, but i have not yet. is it out on video now? where did you see it?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Lithodid-Man, posted 02-10-2007 6:55 AM Lithodid-Man has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by Lithodid-Man, posted 02-11-2007 12:58 AM arachnophilia has not replied

  
Lithodid-Man
Member (Idle past 2931 days)
Posts: 504
From: Juneau, Alaska, USA
Joined: 03-22-2004


Message 6 of 13 (384356)
02-11-2007 12:58 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by arachnophilia
02-11-2007 12:53 AM


Jesus Camp
I got the dvd from Netflix, it was released on Jan 23.

Doctor Bashir: "Of all the stories you told me, which were true and which weren't?"
Elim Garak: "My dear Doctor, they're all true"
Doctor Bashir: "Even the lies?"
Elim Garak: "Especially the lies"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by arachnophilia, posted 02-11-2007 12:53 AM arachnophilia has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 7 by Achilles, posted 02-13-2007 12:09 AM Lithodid-Man has not replied

  
Achilles
Inactive Member


Message 7 of 13 (384780)
02-13-2007 12:09 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by Lithodid-Man
02-11-2007 12:58 AM


Re: Jesus Camp
Hi all,
I've lurked in this forum for several years and registered a few weeks ago with the intent of being a more active member. I say all this because I have no idea why I'm breaking my silence with this thread. No matter.
I picked this up the day it came out however it took me a couple of sittings to finish. I hate to sound extremist, however I found it difficult to sit through a lot of the...brainwashing that this documentary attempts to capture. Powerful stuff that provides a lot of food for thought.
I thought it was interesting (and perhaps a bit manipulative) that the counter arguments are voiced by moderate Christianity. Whether or not the makers are legitimate Christian moderates or atheist/agnostics who used Christian moderates as fodder is unknown to me.
I was a little disappointed that the film makers did not appear to back up any of their stats with references (unless it was in the credits and I missed it). 75% of home schooled children are Evangelicals according to what source?
All in all, I'm glad I picked it up and have already lent it out to a couple of friends. If I had to describe the message of this film to someone that hasn't seen it in two words or less, I think I'd have to go with "Hitler Youth".
Thanks for reading.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by Lithodid-Man, posted 02-11-2007 12:58 AM Lithodid-Man has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by arachnophilia, posted 02-13-2007 12:35 AM Achilles has replied

  
arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1344 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 8 of 13 (384783)
02-13-2007 12:35 AM
Reply to: Message 7 by Achilles
02-13-2007 12:09 AM


Re: Jesus Camp
hi achilles, welcome to the board.
I hate to sound extremist, however I found it difficult to sit through a lot of the...brainwashing that this documentary attempts to capture.
you think that's bad, try going to a place like that.
I thought it was interesting (and perhaps a bit manipulative) that the counter arguments are voiced by moderate Christianity.
probably an intentional move. fundamentalists like to play the false dichotomy game, us against the world. people often point out rational moderate christians, as if to say "it's not the religion. it's you. you're crazy."


This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by Achilles, posted 02-13-2007 12:09 AM Achilles has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by Achilles, posted 02-13-2007 3:23 AM arachnophilia has not replied

  
Achilles
Inactive Member


Message 9 of 13 (384809)
02-13-2007 3:23 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by arachnophilia
02-13-2007 12:35 AM


Re: Jesus Camp
Thanks! Technically, I've been here more than 2 years, but I'll take the welcome all the same.
quote:
probably an intentional move. fundamentalists like to play the false dichotomy game, us against the world. people often point out rational moderate christians, as if to say "it's not the religion. it's you. you're crazy."
I assumed as much, but I can't help but feel that the intention is slightly dishonest if the actual film makers are non-religious. At the end of the day it doesn't really matter, but this is the type of stuff I think about

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 Message 8 by arachnophilia, posted 02-13-2007 12:35 AM arachnophilia has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by jar, posted 12-31-2007 9:58 AM Achilles has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 10 of 13 (444835)
12-31-2007 3:24 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Lithodid-Man
02-10-2007 6:55 AM


Its On TV Right Now
I'm watching it right now for the first time. It is worse than any church meeting I ever attended, although some that I attended came fairly close to being as ludicrous.
Whats sad about it is the fact that most of those kids will probably turn away from Jesus because of the way they were forced to accept Him.
(I'm watching the part about abortion where they hand out those wee plastic babies)
Add By Edit: I saw the whole thing from that part I mentioned. Its amazing to see Ted Haggard smiling and beaming, telling an entire audience that the Bible tells us how to behave even when we think otherwise. He must have left his Bible in Colorado Springs during those liaisons in Denver!
Edited by Phat, : add by edit

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Lithodid-Man, posted 02-10-2007 6:55 AM Lithodid-Man has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 11 of 13 (444885)
12-31-2007 9:58 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by Achilles
02-13-2007 3:23 AM


Re: Jesus Camp
Actually the film makers seem to be pretty proreligion. An earlier documentary they made was Into Africa with 'The Boys of Baraka' which follows three kids from the Baltimore inner city to a school in Kenya. It is another must watch documentary.

Immigration has been a problem Since 1607!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Achilles, posted 02-13-2007 3:23 AM Achilles has not replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 12 of 13 (445306)
01-01-2008 7:02 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by Lithodid-Man
02-10-2007 8:34 PM


info
This is just the trailer:
You can find other clips on you tube.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by Lithodid-Man, posted 02-10-2007 8:34 PM Lithodid-Man has not replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3292 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 13 of 13 (445310)
01-01-2008 7:04 PM


I particularly like the part about global warming. Jesus will come back anyday now, so it really doesn't matter. Cut down all the trees. Pollute this planet all we want. The end is just right around the corner.

  
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