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Author | Topic: Religion v Spirituality | |||||||||||||||||||||||
Larni Member (Idle past 184 days) Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Infixion writes: This reminds me of what a World Religions professor of mine claimed that spirituality was: something that is in all of us; a "fire of restlessness", a burning and unsettling feeling that there are things that we have yet to understand, and may never quite grasp(the classic being, what is the meaning to life?). How's that different from curiosity or wanderlust?
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pelican Member (Idle past 5006 days) Posts: 781 From: australia Joined: |
I don't believe I have a physical organ called hate!
larni writes: All these are physical and have physical indicators that can be measured (often by me) in the course of psychological assessments. If you believe psychological is physical, there's no point, is there?
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pelican Member (Idle past 5006 days) Posts: 781 From: australia Joined: |
You experience the unseen energy as a physical feeling but they themselves are not a physical organ within the body. They do not exist physically otherwise we would be able to see them. The fact that we can only observe them from a feeling proves they are not physical.
If mine is an example of woowoo thinking, what kind of thinking confuses the physical with non-physical?
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pelican Member (Idle past 5006 days) Posts: 781 From: australia Joined: |
You experience the unseen energy as a physical feeling but they themselves are not a physical organ within the body. They do not exist physically otherwise we would be able to see them. The fact that we can only observe them from a feeling proves they are not physical.
If mine is an example of woowoo thinking, what kind of thinking confuses the physical with non-physical?
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Larni Member (Idle past 184 days) Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Heinrik writes: I don't believe I have a physical organ called hate! Nor do I. Nice that we agree.
Heinrik writes: If you believe psychological is physical, there's no point, is there? When we experience hate (or any emotion) our bodies undergo physical/behvioural/cognitive changes that we can measure. This is the realm of science not 'spirit'. Still waiting for your definition of spirit.
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Larni Member (Idle past 184 days) Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Heinrik writes: The fact that we can only observe them from a feeling proves they are not physical. If I understand you correctly you are saying that the energy changes we percieve with our senses are non physical and thus fit a concept of 'spirit'. If this is the case you are wrong. E=MC2. Energy/Matter, Matter/Energy. Energy is not spirit. Btw: lets drop the woohoo thinking. I should not have used it and would hate for us to get hung up on it. Edited by Larni, : No reason given.
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pelican Member (Idle past 5006 days) Posts: 781 From: australia Joined: |
The body may well undergo physical changes because of an emotional reaction, but it still does not the make the emotion physical. All emotion is non-physical.
Do you think hate or do you feel it?
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pelican Member (Idle past 5006 days) Posts: 781 From: australia Joined: |
Energy and matter are two different things. One may not exist without the other but it doesn't make them the same.
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Phat Member Posts: 18298 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
Heinrik writes: Have you not heard of Wilhelm Reich, Alexander Lowen, and Bioenergetics? The body may well undergo physical changes because of an emotional reaction, but it still does not the make the emotion physical. All emotion is non-physical. There is most definitely a thing as Psychophysical reactions to emotional events.
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Larni Member (Idle past 184 days) Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Heinrik writes: Do you think hate or do you feel it? You think hateful thoughts. These trigger noradrenaline, adrenaline to pass into the blood stream and begin the fight or flight reaction. In the case of hate there are cognitions around the hated object (normally revolving around the removal of the physical sensations (autonomic arousal) the hated object triggers). Then action is selected to remove the autonomic arousal. If the action is successful in removing the autonomic arousal the negative cogntions stop; along with the production of the noradrenaline etc. Then the body goes back to a rest state. Try looking up the 'Four Systems Model of Emotion'. The above is a very truncated version of that. So the answer is: both and more besides. Emotion is complex but to write it off as 'spirit' is to stop trying to understand it.
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Larni Member (Idle past 184 days) Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Heinrik writes: Energy and matter are two different things. Did you miss my reference to e=mc2 Mass—energy equivalence - Wikipedia Still waiting for a difinition of spirit that is not bogus.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3948 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
it isn't, really. that's the point.
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Larni Member (Idle past 184 days) Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Then to use the world spiritual as a shorthand for curiosity and wanderlust inappropriate.
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Larni Member (Idle past 184 days) Posts: 4000 From: Liverpool Joined: |
Phat writes: Have you not heard of Wilhelm Reich, Alexander Lowen, and Bioenergetics? Not sure whether these ideas are on the level, Phat.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3948 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
no, it isn't. curiosity (that is excessive curiosity) and wanderlust are subset of that which makes up spirituality. just like christianity isn't the sum total of religion.
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