Does the evidence support the Flood? (attn: DwarfishSquints)

Crocodiles have nostrils. Seals have nostrils.
I think the skunks on Noah's Ark must have been stowaways. Edited by Libmr2bs, : No reason given.

This goes against your own Biblical account:

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There is no better love between 2 people than mutual respect for each other WT Young, 2002Who gave anyone the authority to call me an authority on anything. WT Young, 1969

Cat I am sorry you missed the sarcasm there.I was pointing out that if they were related to people before the flood they should be related to people after the flood.God Bless,

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"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

No problem, but if I missed the sarcasm it could be that others did, also

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There is no better love between 2 people than mutual respect for each other WT Young, 2002Who gave anyone the authority to call me an authority on anything. WT Young, 1969

ICANT, this is a gigantic red herring stacked on a strawman. No scientific theory states that the Universe "came from an absence of anything," and cosmology is not in any way related to this topic.And since we both agree that the Flood is a scientific impossibility, why are you participating in this thread, which resides in the science forums? If you claim the Flood happened, provide objective evidence to support such a claim - put up or shut up.If you have nothing more useful to contribute than strawmen and red herrings in an attempt to derail the thread with utter nonsense, stop posting.

I know this is a bit off topic, however. Does anyone believe that the bible and/or the epic of Gilgamesh is merely a recreation of stories previously told from people who migrated into the middle east, after the Black Sea was flooded from the Mediterranean through the bospuros strait? I believe if we look at the bible from merely a recreation of previous stories adopted to include the hebrew culture, than it is possible they were describing a real event. Just not nearely on the scale of which the bible purports. black sea deluge

It sounded possible when it first came out. Since then estimates of the rate of flooding have gone down considerably. Perhaps it can't be ruled out, but it seems to have been more significant for forcing people to move, rather than as a direct hazard to life.

I know the verdict is still out on the rate of rise once the bosburos strait was breeched. I think however that for those communities that were closest to the head water the rate would have been significant enough to cause major damage in a short time frame. Than as they moved out of the effected areas they would have come others effected by the same event, giving them cause to believe that this may have occured world wide.

What about the 40 days of rain?

Mythological exaggeration, as happens in most mythology.I don't know specifically about the Dead Sea flooding, but it would certainly be plausible that the similarities between the various middle-eastern flood myths like the Epic of Gilgamesh and the Noachian Flood could be explained as exaggerated retellings of a real-life event.Rivers flood all the time, and it's certainly not an extraordinary claim to suggest that a big local flood happened coupled with a significant storm, and that an individual and his family survived along with their livestock in some primitive boat. The retelling of such a story can easily reach mythical proportions, especially after it's adapted into the Hebrew culture, where the story could be made "better" by making it a global event.I'd say the evidence available fits such a scenario far better than a literal reading of the account - the physical evidence doesn't match up to a global Flood even remotely, but we do have many examples of myths surrounding real-world natural phenomenon, including floods.

Could go either way, there may have been 40 days of rain or it could be an embelishment. The people at the time, I believe, would not have the knowledge to equate glacial melt and geographical location as a reason for the black sea flood. In order to overcome this they may have added in what they do know caused local floods in their area. Or with weather patterns changing as the glaciers receided it may have been that there really was 40 days of rain and that coupled with the other factors caused the bosburos straight to give way. Unfortunatly I am not knowledgable enough in that area of geology to say. Either way we know that depicitions of floods were real enough and had enough consequences to the people that it was worth retelling and incorporating into their world veiw. Every religion especialy ones that are spread through oral traditions are subject to embelishment. I believe that this is just another example of this. A real life event of major consequence enlarged to a clamatic event with moral and social implecations inorder to pass on those morals to the next generation.

In the Black Sea deluge theory:

quote:

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Then, about 5600 BC, as sea levels rose, Ryan and Pitman suggest, the rising Mediterranean finally spilled over a rocky sill at the Bosporus. The event flooded 60,000 mile (155,000 km) of land and significantly expanded the Black Sea shoreline to the north and west. Ryan and Pitman wrote:

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"Ten cubic miles [42 km] of water poured through each day, two hundred times what flows over Niagara Falls. . The Bosporus flume roared and surged at full spate for at least three hundred days."

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That just doesn't add up with the Biblical Flood of 40 days of rain gradually flooding everything. That seems like a much more immediate and violent flooding, not to mention that it lasted longer. If this is what inspired the Biblical story, then I think it it would have been described differently.

It's possible that those communities located far enough away from the black sea would have seen a more gradual rise than those located at the head of the deluge.

Well, sure its possible, I'm not saying its impossible.I'm saying that it improbable that The Flud^TM was inspired by the Black Sea deluge (BSD) because the descriptions in the Bible don't match what we'd expect from the BSD and there are extra description that the BSD wouldn't provide (like the 40 days of rain).

No I totaly agree. The only point I was trying to make is that. The Noachian flood compared to real life requires much more extrapulation and "magic" than comparing the BSD to the Noachian. That and the time frame and location correlates closer than anything else that we have discovered.