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Author Topic:   Discovery or Ignorance: The Choice Is yours?
bluegenes
Member (Idle past 2477 days)
Posts: 3119
From: U.K.
Joined: 01-24-2007


Message 61 of 402 (473919)
07-03-2008 4:53 PM
Reply to: Message 52 by John 10:10
07-03-2008 2:38 PM


You're an ape, John
John 10:10 writes:
Show us the evidence that the evolutionary model works from start to finish?
I can show you conclusive evidence that you descend from a common ancestor with the chimps, John. Do you want to see it, or does that frighten your cowardly soul?
Edited by bluegenes, : removed misleading word

This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by John 10:10, posted 07-03-2008 2:38 PM John 10:10 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 67 by John 10:10, posted 07-03-2008 6:38 PM bluegenes has replied

John 10:10
Member (Idle past 2995 days)
Posts: 766
From: Mt Juliet / TN / USA
Joined: 02-01-2006


Message 62 of 402 (473923)
07-03-2008 6:04 PM
Reply to: Message 56 by Dr Adequate
07-03-2008 3:23 PM


True science arives at conclusions by substantiating cause and effect ...
You know that doesn't mean anything, right?
This tells me and others volumes about your understanding of what true science is all about.
It's these people called "scientists". Who know science when they see it. And who don't get all muddly and confused over the basic terms and concepts of science like you do.
The ones who deal with substantiating cause and affect know and understand true science. The rest attend your university.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 56 by Dr Adequate, posted 07-03-2008 3:23 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 64 by Coyote, posted 07-03-2008 6:07 PM John 10:10 has replied
 Message 80 by Dr Adequate, posted 07-04-2008 5:34 AM John 10:10 has not replied

John 10:10
Member (Idle past 2995 days)
Posts: 766
From: Mt Juliet / TN / USA
Joined: 02-01-2006


Message 63 of 402 (473924)
07-03-2008 6:07 PM
Reply to: Message 57 by Dr Adequate
07-03-2008 3:38 PM


So perhaps instead of arrogantly shooting your mouth about what is and isn't scientific, a subject of which you evidently know damn-all, perhaps you ought to find out some of the things that scientists know about science and you don't. Like what science is and what scientists do.
When you don't have a rational answer to reason with, you attack the messenger.
Some science!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 57 by Dr Adequate, posted 07-03-2008 3:38 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 81 by Dr Adequate, posted 07-04-2008 5:43 AM John 10:10 has not replied

Coyote
Member (Idle past 2105 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 64 of 402 (473925)
07-03-2008 6:07 PM
Reply to: Message 62 by John 10:10
07-03-2008 6:04 PM


"True science" and other lies
I've noticed that fundamentalists are now using the term "true science" in an effort to disassociate the theory of evolution from the rest of science.
Isn't this known as bearing false witness?
Edited by Coyote, : No reason given.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 62 by John 10:10, posted 07-03-2008 6:04 PM John 10:10 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 68 by John 10:10, posted 07-03-2008 6:44 PM Coyote has not replied

John 10:10
Member (Idle past 2995 days)
Posts: 766
From: Mt Juliet / TN / USA
Joined: 02-01-2006


Message 65 of 402 (473928)
07-03-2008 6:13 PM
Reply to: Message 58 by Granny Magda
07-03-2008 3:46 PM


Re: What We Mean by Theory
Are you suggesting that past events cannot be studied scientifically? I would hope that you would not be so foolish.
No I am not! I am saying that past events should be studied and verified that they are true, and can be consistently repeated when tested.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 58 by Granny Magda, posted 07-03-2008 3:46 PM Granny Magda has not replied

John 10:10
Member (Idle past 2995 days)
Posts: 766
From: Mt Juliet / TN / USA
Joined: 02-01-2006


Message 66 of 402 (473929)
07-03-2008 6:17 PM
Reply to: Message 60 by Tanypteryx
07-03-2008 4:10 PM


Re: What We Mean by Theory
He claims to have been an engineer at many nuclear powerplants. A scary thought! We should run!
Nuclear power is producing 20%+ of the electric energy needs of our country, and about 80% in France.
How many watts of power have you helped produce?

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 Message 60 by Tanypteryx, posted 07-03-2008 4:10 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

John 10:10
Member (Idle past 2995 days)
Posts: 766
From: Mt Juliet / TN / USA
Joined: 02-01-2006


Message 67 of 402 (473933)
07-03-2008 6:38 PM
Reply to: Message 61 by bluegenes
07-03-2008 4:53 PM


Re: You're an ape, John
I can show you conclusive evidence that you descend from a common ancestor with the chimps, John. Do you want to see it, or does that frighten your cowardly soul?
I know whom I descended from, and into whose family I now belong to. You may join the apes if you like.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 61 by bluegenes, posted 07-03-2008 4:53 PM bluegenes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 69 by bluegenes, posted 07-03-2008 7:08 PM John 10:10 has replied

John 10:10
Member (Idle past 2995 days)
Posts: 766
From: Mt Juliet / TN / USA
Joined: 02-01-2006


Message 68 of 402 (473934)
07-03-2008 6:44 PM
Reply to: Message 64 by Coyote
07-03-2008 6:07 PM


Re: "True science" and other lies
I've noticed that fundamentalists are now using the term "true science" in an effort to disassociate the theory of evolution from the rest of science.
Isn't this known as bearing false witness?
Read my lips! True science is simply the explanation of how things are the way they are, and how they came be as they are, proven by testing results that can be accurately measured and duplicated time and time again.
When the theory(s) of evolution can do this, then they will have something they can call true science.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 70 by Organicmachination, posted 07-03-2008 7:59 PM John 10:10 has replied
 Message 82 by Dr Adequate, posted 07-04-2008 6:30 AM John 10:10 has not replied

bluegenes
Member (Idle past 2477 days)
Posts: 3119
From: U.K.
Joined: 01-24-2007


Message 69 of 402 (473935)
07-03-2008 7:08 PM
Reply to: Message 67 by John 10:10
07-03-2008 6:38 PM


Re: You're an ape, John
JohnTheSimian writes:
I know whom I descended from, and into whose family I now belong to. You may join the apes if you like.
I think you're scared of the truth, John. A frightened little ape, hiding behind his Bible. The evidence is there, John, in every cell of your body there is information, visible only with a microscope, that tells us that you're an ape.
There's no scientific doubt of this, John. But if you're scared of the truth, don't ask to see my evidence.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 67 by John 10:10, posted 07-03-2008 6:38 PM John 10:10 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 71 by John 10:10, posted 07-03-2008 8:37 PM bluegenes has replied

Organicmachination
Member (Idle past 5709 days)
Posts: 105
From: Pullman, WA, USA
Joined: 12-30-2007


Message 70 of 402 (473943)
07-03-2008 7:59 PM
Reply to: Message 68 by John 10:10
07-03-2008 6:44 PM


Re: "True science" and other lies
Hey, John, where'd you come up with the term "true science"?
Did you make it up? I'm sure you did, because there isn't a single textbook in all the libraries of the world that would differentiate between evolution and "true science".
If you want to make up terms and then say that your opposition cannot live up to them, then this is not the place for you. Try and stay within the boundaries of modern English.
For example, true religion must always be able to live in harmony with evolutionary theory and science, and therefore, your christian fundamentalist views aren't truly religious. Why don't you admit that you're going to hell for not believing in a true God?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 68 by John 10:10, posted 07-03-2008 6:44 PM John 10:10 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 73 by John 10:10, posted 07-03-2008 8:42 PM Organicmachination has replied

John 10:10
Member (Idle past 2995 days)
Posts: 766
From: Mt Juliet / TN / USA
Joined: 02-01-2006


Message 71 of 402 (473945)
07-03-2008 8:37 PM
Reply to: Message 69 by bluegenes
07-03-2008 7:08 PM


Re: You're an ape, John
I think you're scared of the truth, John. A frightened little ape, hiding behind his Bible. The evidence is there, John, in every cell of your body there is information, visible only with a microscope, that tells us that you're an ape.
Is this the best dialogue that evolutionists can descend to?
Yes, every cell of my body knows exactly where it belongs and where every other cell is.
Just how do you think it figured this all out without a Designer/Creator?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 69 by bluegenes, posted 07-03-2008 7:08 PM bluegenes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 72 by Coyote, posted 07-03-2008 8:41 PM John 10:10 has replied
 Message 79 by bluegenes, posted 07-04-2008 12:13 AM John 10:10 has not replied

Coyote
Member (Idle past 2105 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 72 of 402 (473946)
07-03-2008 8:41 PM
Reply to: Message 71 by John 10:10
07-03-2008 8:37 PM


Re: You're an ape, John
Just how do you think it figured this all out without a Designer/Creator?
Natural selection and descent with modification. Maybe a little founders effect and other similar things.
At least there is evidence for this. There is no evidence for a designer -- that's a religious belief.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 71 by John 10:10, posted 07-03-2008 8:37 PM John 10:10 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 74 by John 10:10, posted 07-03-2008 8:48 PM Coyote has replied

John 10:10
Member (Idle past 2995 days)
Posts: 766
From: Mt Juliet / TN / USA
Joined: 02-01-2006


Message 73 of 402 (473947)
07-03-2008 8:42 PM
Reply to: Message 70 by Organicmachination
07-03-2008 7:59 PM


Re: "True science" and other lies
Hey, John, where'd you come up with the term "true science"?
Maybe you can enlighten us as to what is wrong with my definition which reads as follows:
True science is simply the explanation of how things are the way they are, and how they came be as they are, proven by testing results that can be accurately measured and duplicated time and time again.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 70 by Organicmachination, posted 07-03-2008 7:59 PM Organicmachination has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 75 by Organicmachination, posted 07-03-2008 8:56 PM John 10:10 has replied

John 10:10
Member (Idle past 2995 days)
Posts: 766
From: Mt Juliet / TN / USA
Joined: 02-01-2006


Message 74 of 402 (473948)
07-03-2008 8:48 PM
Reply to: Message 72 by Coyote
07-03-2008 8:41 PM


Re: You're an ape, John
Natural selection and descent with modification. Maybe a little founders effect and other similar things.
At least there is evidence for this. There is no evidence for a designer -- that's a religious belief.
So that's how the DNA of cells figured out how to become DNA in the first place.
OK, show me the evidence?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 72 by Coyote, posted 07-03-2008 8:41 PM Coyote has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 76 by NosyNed, posted 07-03-2008 8:58 PM John 10:10 has replied
 Message 77 by Organicmachination, posted 07-03-2008 9:08 PM John 10:10 has replied
 Message 78 by Coyote, posted 07-03-2008 9:30 PM John 10:10 has not replied

Organicmachination
Member (Idle past 5709 days)
Posts: 105
From: Pullman, WA, USA
Joined: 12-30-2007


Message 75 of 402 (473949)
07-03-2008 8:56 PM
Reply to: Message 73 by John 10:10
07-03-2008 8:42 PM


Re: "True science" and other lies
Your definition is not incorrect, it is simply your branding of it as "true science." Evolution fits all of your restrictions, yet you deem it as not "true science."
If you don't believe me, look at any genetics journals, any modern college level, mind you, biology textbook involving the use of E. Coli, and for that matter, check out Jazzns' thread about the most recent evidence for evolution.
Seriously, check it out.
Also, even if you could thoroughly disprove evolution, although you can't, you still wouldn't convince us that God did it. Until you can prove that your Christian God in the Bible did it with your own "true science" with results that can be replicated time and time again, all you'll show us is that we're human and we don't understand everything there is to know about population biology. For all you know, speciation might be caused by some hitherto unknown mechanism much more complicated, yet still as rooted in modern science, as evolution.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 73 by John 10:10, posted 07-03-2008 8:42 PM John 10:10 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 86 by John 10:10, posted 07-04-2008 9:42 AM Organicmachination has not replied

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