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Author Topic:   Does the evidence support the Flood? (attn: DwarfishSquints)
rueh
Member (Idle past 3662 days)
Posts: 382
From: universal city tx
Joined: 03-03-2008


Message 276 of 293 (473621)
07-01-2008 11:58 AM
Reply to: Message 275 by Rahvin
06-16-2008 3:37 PM


Re: Timeline of the flood
I know this is a bit off topic, however. Does anyone believe that the bible and/or the epic of Gilgamesh is merely a recreation of stories previously told from people who migrated into the middle east, after the Black Sea was flooded from the Mediterranean through the bospuros strait? I believe if we look at the bible from merely a recreation of previous stories adopted to include the hebrew culture, than it is possible they were describing a real event. Just not nearely on the scale of which the bible purports.
black sea deluge

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 Message 277 by PaulK, posted 07-01-2008 1:56 PM rueh has replied

  
rueh
Member (Idle past 3662 days)
Posts: 382
From: universal city tx
Joined: 03-03-2008


Message 278 of 293 (473642)
07-01-2008 2:15 PM
Reply to: Message 277 by PaulK
07-01-2008 1:56 PM


Re: Black Sea Flood
I know the verdict is still out on the rate of rise once the bosburos strait was breeched. I think however that for those communities that were closest to the head water the rate would have been significant enough to cause major damage in a short time frame. Than as they moved out of the effected areas they would have come others effected by the same event, giving them cause to believe that this may have occured world wide.

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 Message 279 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-01-2008 2:41 PM rueh has replied

  
rueh
Member (Idle past 3662 days)
Posts: 382
From: universal city tx
Joined: 03-03-2008


Message 281 of 293 (473651)
07-01-2008 3:30 PM
Reply to: Message 279 by New Cat's Eye
07-01-2008 2:41 PM


Re: Black Sea Flood
Could go either way, there may have been 40 days of rain or it could be an embelishment. The people at the time, I believe, would not have the knowledge to equate glacial melt and geographical location as a reason for the black sea flood. In order to overcome this they may have added in what they do know caused local floods in their area. Or with weather patterns changing as the glaciers receided it may have been that there really was 40 days of rain and that coupled with the other factors caused the bosburos straight to give way. Unfortunatly I am not knowledgable enough in that area of geology to say. Either way we know that depicitions of floods were real enough and had enough consequences to the people that it was worth retelling and incorporating into their world veiw. Every religion especialy ones that are spread through oral traditions are subject to embelishment. I believe that this is just another example of this. A real life event of major consequence enlarged to a clamatic event with moral and social implecations inorder to pass on those morals to the next generation.

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rueh
Member (Idle past 3662 days)
Posts: 382
From: universal city tx
Joined: 03-03-2008


Message 283 of 293 (473672)
07-01-2008 7:00 PM
Reply to: Message 282 by New Cat's Eye
07-01-2008 4:18 PM


Re: Black Sea Flood
It's possible that those communities located far enough away from the black sea would have seen a more gradual rise than those located at the head of the deluge.

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 Message 282 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-01-2008 4:18 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

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 Message 284 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-03-2008 9:13 AM rueh has replied

  
rueh
Member (Idle past 3662 days)
Posts: 382
From: universal city tx
Joined: 03-03-2008


Message 285 of 293 (473851)
07-03-2008 9:49 AM
Reply to: Message 284 by New Cat's Eye
07-03-2008 9:13 AM


Re: Black Sea Flood
No I totaly agree. The only point I was trying to make is that. The Noachian flood compared to real life requires much more extrapulation and "magic" than comparing the BSD to the Noachian. That and the time frame and location correlates closer than anything else that we have discovered.

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 Message 286 by New Cat's Eye, posted 07-03-2008 10:13 AM rueh has replied

  
rueh
Member (Idle past 3662 days)
Posts: 382
From: universal city tx
Joined: 03-03-2008


Message 287 of 293 (473877)
07-03-2008 11:52 AM
Reply to: Message 286 by New Cat's Eye
07-03-2008 10:13 AM


Re: Black Sea Flood
I agree. Before juddism became a written religion the stories were probably apt to changes either through personnel interpretation or changing world views. That being the case however, that means that the BSD isn't necessarily excluded from those same changes, inorder to draw it inline with the communities own beliefs.
Edited by rueh, : No reason given.
Edited by rueh, : No reason given.

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rueh
Member (Idle past 3662 days)
Posts: 382
From: universal city tx
Joined: 03-03-2008


Message 289 of 293 (474211)
07-06-2008 7:01 PM
Reply to: Message 288 by Hyroglyphx
07-03-2008 7:45 PM


Re: Black Sea Flood
quote:
In closing, I have a two part question geared towards theists and atheists alike. To the atheists, I ask, what does this information say to you about the validity of a considerable flood? Note that we do not, as of yet, know with certainty that this was a "global" flood. We know empirically that this was considered global to the inhabitants. Does this mean that such a Flood really did exist? If so, is this inconsequential to you?
The second question is geared towards biblicists. This study, conducted in 1993, has had virtually no coverage. And of that which is mentioned, it is routinely dumbed down in an apparent view of it being inconsequential. Do you find it disheartening that some people have divorced themselves from this discovery, and if so, do you attribute it to them denying it over its greater implications-- such as, the denial of the Bible's historicity?
I think over all it is a great example of how people on both sides of a debate, will ignore all the facts and implications of the evidence in order to hold true to their small understanding of something that can have greater implications. If the theist was able to treat this scenario as way to understand how people record their history and how legends develop. They would have a better grasp on why they believe what they believe, instead of having to fall back on faith for faith alone sake. The same holds true for the atheist. It would allow them to use what little written history from antiquity that we do have as a reference. i believe if this theory is indeed true, it perfectly demonstrates how slivers of truth can come through in all the stories and myths that man has created.

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 Message 290 by deerbreh, posted 07-07-2008 12:00 PM rueh has replied

  
rueh
Member (Idle past 3662 days)
Posts: 382
From: universal city tx
Joined: 03-03-2008


Message 292 of 293 (474406)
07-08-2008 9:45 AM
Reply to: Message 290 by deerbreh
07-07-2008 12:00 PM


Re: Black Sea Flood
Your right in a sense, I do have a tendencey to over generalize. However we were not discussing the creation/evolution topic here. We were talking about what geological evidence may support a flood of a porpurtion described in antiquity. I was trying to assert that we all heve a tendencey to gloss over any evidence that may not fall directly in line with your chosen veiw point. Regardless of what that veiw point is that you have choosen.
In line with the topic I assert that the geology does not support a world wide flood as described in the bible, but it may indicate a very large local flood that has been imbellished through culture and the ages to what many today consider to be the noachian flood.

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 Message 290 by deerbreh, posted 07-07-2008 12:00 PM deerbreh has replied

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