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Author Topic:   The Palin Mistake
Huntard
Member (Idle past 633 days)
Posts: 2870
From: Limburg, The Netherlands
Joined: 09-02-2008


Message 31 of 140 (487919)
11-06-2008 2:58 PM
Reply to: Message 27 by Fosdick
11-06-2008 2:13 PM


Re: Biden's Comment?.
From the debate:
quote:
Well, they're both extremely dangerous. I always am focused, as you know Gwen, I have been focusing on for a long time, along with Barack on Pakistan. Pakistan already has nuclear weapons. Pakistan already has deployed nuclear weapons. Pakistan's weapons can already hit Israel and the Mediterranean. Iran getting a nuclear weapon would be very, very destabilizing. They are more than - they are not close to getting a nuclear weapon that's able to be deployed. So they're both very dangerous. They both would be game changers.

Bolding mine.

I don't think he's talking about actually firing nukes here, I think he's merely mentioning the fact they can fire at any minute. At least that's the impression I get from reading that entire piece.


I hunt for the truth

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Replies to this message:
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subbie
Member (Idle past 81 days)
Posts: 3509
Joined: 02-26-2006


Message 32 of 140 (487923)
11-06-2008 3:31 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Buzsaw
11-05-2008 10:57 PM


Re: No Hail Mary
quote:
slick shady Kenyanisque fellow

Quite right. Keep dem darkies down on da farm, singin' spirituals and bringin' mint julips to all dem pretty white ladies. (Better keep an eye on 'em, though, you knows dem darkies like our women.)

Careful Buz, your racism is showing.


Those who would sacrifice an essential liberty for a temporary security will lose both, and deserve neither. -- Benjamin Franklin

We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat


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fallacycop
Member (Idle past 3858 days)
Posts: 692
From: Fortaleza-CE Brazil
Joined: 02-18-2006


Message 33 of 140 (487926)
11-06-2008 3:52 PM
Reply to: Message 19 by onifre
11-06-2008 1:15 PM


Re: No Hail Mary
yes there was clearly a better choice, Romney, who pundits thought would be the obvious choice. Not only for V.P. but for the presidential position too.

The problem was that McCain truely dislikes Romney and would rather had had Joe Liberman, but the base wouldn't accept him and would likely stay home.

Palin was a last minute choice. An atempt to square that circle. How to bring the base out without alienating the center? It failed.

Thats the way the system works, it is important to keep us in the dark and distracted. We are not suppose to fully understand American politics, or politics in general for that matter. The thinking is that we as citizens are too stupid to know whats good for us, and the country, so we are guilded ever so gently like cattle to where they feel we should be.

More unwarented cynicism

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onifre
Member (Idle past 1288 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


Message 34 of 140 (487927)
11-06-2008 4:03 PM
Reply to: Message 33 by fallacycop
11-06-2008 3:52 PM


Re: No Hail Mary
Hi fallacycop,

More unwarented cynicism

Cynicism yes, unwarrented why?

I believe I even provided a good article, not even from the US, from another country(Canada), where they too have problems with the government keeping them in the dark.

If I search well enough I can probably produce many more of these articles. It is a global issue with all political system.


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fallacycop
Member (Idle past 3858 days)
Posts: 692
From: Fortaleza-CE Brazil
Joined: 02-18-2006


Message 35 of 140 (487928)
11-06-2008 4:06 PM
Reply to: Message 28 by onifre
11-06-2008 2:25 PM


Re: No Hail Mary
Unless the objective was to lose.

Fo my benefit, tell me, why would they want that?

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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Huntard
Member (Idle past 633 days)
Posts: 2870
From: Limburg, The Netherlands
Joined: 09-02-2008


Message 36 of 140 (487932)
11-06-2008 4:41 PM
Reply to: Message 28 by onifre
11-06-2008 2:25 PM


Re: No Hail Mary
Hello again Onifre,

Unless the objective was to lose.

Losing an election is good for a party...Well, I suppose there is some truth to that, after all being in the opposition is easy, just blame everything that goes wrong on the ruling party and hey presto! you seem the sole voice of reason. And after the hate Bush is getting, it might do them good to play it like that.

I don't think they said "Oi" my Netherlands friend.

I know, and wouldn't that have to be "Dutch friend" ;) stay of that weed man, it's damaging your brain. (I should know, after all EVERYBODY smokes pot over here :P)

Not at all. It should be common knowledge by now. And not just in the US, even Canada has been faulted for keeping citizens in the dark,
http://www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/410909

Well, yes, governments are supposed to let people know, but sometimes this can turn the public eye against you. People don't always like the changes, even though they are better in the long run, so keeping something under wraps isn't always a bad thing. Though a more open government also has the benefit of seeming "honest" to the people.

Lets keep that to ourselves.

Very well. :D

I'll join you, then we'll drink to our success!

Great! *Takes out two beers* Cheers mate! ;)

Edited by Huntard, : Spellings


I hunt for the truth

This message is a reply to:
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Nighttrain
Member (Idle past 2331 days)
Posts: 1512
From: brisbane,australia
Joined: 06-08-2004


Message 37 of 140 (487934)
11-06-2008 5:40 PM


NAR
How come more attention isn`t being paid to Palin`s association with the New Apostolic Reformation crowd? Pretty scary bunch if some of the PDF report is on target.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/bruce-wilson/palins-movement-urges-god_b_139987.html


NosyNed
Member
Posts: 8868
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003
Member Rating: 7.2


Message 38 of 140 (487936)
11-06-2008 5:41 PM
Reply to: Message 31 by Huntard
11-06-2008 2:58 PM


Deployment
I don't think he's talking about actually firing nukes here, I think he's merely mentioning the fact they can fire at any minute. At least that's the impression I get from reading that entire piece.

That is also what "deployed" means. Weapons systems are "deployed" when they are in the "field" ready to use.

from the Concise Oxford English Dictionary:

quote:
verb
bring or move into position for military action.
â–¶bring into effective action

I guess we can tar Biden with an unfortunate ability to actually speak correct English.

Edited by NosyNed, : No reason given.


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Fosdick 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3837 days)
Posts: 1793
From: Upper Slobovia
Joined: 12-11-2006


Message 39 of 140 (487937)
11-06-2008 5:42 PM
Reply to: Message 29 by NosyNed
11-06-2008 2:39 PM


Re: Biden's Comment?
NosyNed writes:

He did say:
quote:

Which is, of course, completely true.


I was mistaken to think that "deploy" meant "to use." I've always thought that when troops were deployed they went into battle. Not so, according to the Oxford Dictionary; they just "moved into position for military battle." Thanks for the vocabulary lesson.


The first lesson of philosophy is that we may all be mistaken. —Will Durant

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iano
Member (Idle past 278 days)
Posts: 6165
From: Co. Wicklow, Ireland.
Joined: 07-27-2005


Message 40 of 140 (487940)
11-06-2008 6:08 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by Fosdick
11-06-2008 12:01 PM


Re: No Hail Mary
Hoot Mon writes:

Speaking as a frothing-at-the-mouth liberal, I happen to like Sarah Palin. She didn't call up John McCain and say: "Hey, why not me? I'm a hockey-mom reformer." She had it loaded on her back like a pack mule, and yet she was gracious about her multi-challenges. I don't know of anyone who could have mustered the needed wherewithal fresh out of the box and do as well as Sarah.

I'd say that's a pretty fair analysis. Although squirming at what she was required to do I'd say she played the ball that was lobbed pretty well.

-

She's authentic, even if she is on the wrong end of the political spectrum.

Authentic and frighening in one go.

-

It was McCain's mistake, and he could have done a lot worse by selecting just another drab Republican, like Elizabeth Dole, as his running mate.

Indeed.

-

The whole affair makes me thankful for God. To watch all that joy at Barracks election (no difference had the joy been in McCains election), all that hope in a grand new future.

To watch it so many succumb to the same old deciders and limitations and constraints.

To watch so many who will desire change in 4 or 8 years hence.

No we cannot. For there is nothing new under the sun.

-

Edited by iano, : No reason given.

Edited by iano, : No reason given.

Edited by iano, : No reason given.


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onifre
Member (Idle past 1288 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


Message 41 of 140 (487944)
11-06-2008 6:20 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by Huntard
11-06-2008 4:41 PM


Re: No Hail Mary
Hi Huntard,

I know, and wouldn't that have to be "Dutch friend"

Or friend from the Netherlands, which was my original intention, which I obviously screwed up. lol

(I should know, after all EVERYBODY smokes pot over here :P )

Then put those beers away! I have a better idea! :D

Well, yes, governments are supposed to let people know, but sometimes this can turn the public eye against you. People don't always like the changes, even though they are better in the long run, so keeping something under wraps isn't always a bad thing.

Well, this depends on what the ends are. The ends may justify the means if it truly is done for the publics benefit, maybe, but it does not seem like the 'publics benefit' is what they are after. It seeems like financial gain.

Though a more open government also has the benefit of seeming "honest" to the people.

Open government? Thats an oxymoron. Perhaps it may give the illusion of honesty but, as long as its a government controled by one class of society it will still only have its own interests in mind, not the peoples.

Great! *Takes out two beers* Cheers mate!

Cheers mate!...now, about that weed?

Edited by onifre, : grammer


"All great truths begin as blasphemies"

"I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks

"I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky


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NosyNed
Member
Posts: 8868
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003
Member Rating: 7.2


Message 42 of 140 (487945)
11-06-2008 6:21 PM
Reply to: Message 39 by Fosdick
11-06-2008 5:42 PM


Re: Biden's Comment?
It was a small mistake. And another lesson about how our memories (all of us!) and our perceptions are riddled with flaws.

That is why important things need to be checked over and over.


This message is a reply to:
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onifre
Member (Idle past 1288 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


Message 43 of 140 (487946)
11-06-2008 6:32 PM
Reply to: Message 35 by fallacycop
11-06-2008 4:06 PM


Re: No Hail Mary

Fo my benefit, tell me, why would they want that?

I believe you can answer it yourself.

If you had foreign business interests, and the US pretty much guilds the global market, and we currently are viewed as an oppressive nation full of bigots and racists(like Buzsaw :D) who want to impose western culture throughout the world, and this type of mass opinion of the US is causing problems with foreign affairs, who would YOU want to be the face of America, Obama or McCain?

If you remove the illusion of a 2 party system, and see it as a One Class System, then you may begin to see what the real interests are.


"All great truths begin as blasphemies"

"I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks

"I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky


This message is a reply to:
 Message 35 by fallacycop, posted 11-06-2008 4:06 PM fallacycop has not yet responded

RAZD
Member
Posts: 20326
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004
Member Rating: 3.6


Message 44 of 140 (487955)
11-06-2008 9:09 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by Huntard
11-06-2008 10:27 AM


Re: No Hail Mary
By the way, are there seriously people who want her to run in 2012?

Remember that significant numbers of people voted to re-elect shrubya. There really are people without a clue and no idea how to find one.

Enjoy.


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel American Zen Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


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LudoRephaim
Member (Idle past 3421 days)
Posts: 651
From: Jareth's labyrinth
Joined: 03-12-2006


Message 45 of 140 (487966)
11-07-2008 1:16 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Fosdick
11-05-2008 8:24 PM


Republican voters lost the election.
Hy Hoot Mon :)

I knew that lefties would pounce on Palin, and Evc, as shown in the replies on this thread, are no different. From saying she's a gift to comedians (like Jon Stewart, who basically told her (without her being there, so cowardly) "Fuck you", and Betty White calling her a "Crazy Bitch". What happened to taste?) to trying to make Joe Biden's word mishap ("Pakistan has deployed nuclear weapons"... Okay, which country have they nuked? India? Is testing nukes near a nation, targeting a nation with nukes without firing, having severe tensions with another nation, the exact same thing as nuking them? Has Mumbai been hit? How are those Tigers and Asian Elephants there holding up to the fallout?) "Better" than palin's, its all seen here. But I find it even more assinine that both Liberals and conservatives are both saying sht about her.

People, lets be clear; Neither Palin, nor McCain, were responsible for losing the election for the republican party. The blame goes to ultra-right wingers like CBN (and Limbaugh, whom i'll take a guess that he did the following too), people who bashed McCain througout the campaign, a man that was the choice of their OWN DARN PARTY (ODP) and had the basics of conservatism down (Pro-life, anti-gay marraige, no Socialism, small government, etc). A large number of republican voters didn't even bother to vote, most likely because McCain was not "Conservative" enough (You dont want somebody in office whose republican AND cares about the planet, even mildly!!! The ghost of Ronald Reagan forbid!!!!!!!). Does anybody here remember when McCain was booed by a large number of Conservatives before making a speech to them?

Republicans didn't go out to vote in full strength, and media conservatives continued to attack and disclaim McCain, because they didn't like him, and the latter phenomena had effect on the former. He wasn't a Bush JR. Unlike McCain, Palin was picked because she was ultra-conservative, charming, cute (to me she's hot)and had charisma. But she was also targeted by righters; several people in my own Church (mostly Republicans) didn't like her, one of them (at least) because she was (get this!) PENTECOSTAL! That would no doubt be echoed in other Churches (Southern Bapist, and the like) nationwide.

And republicans had the audacity (not of Hope) to be miffed at her when she makes word mishaps during interviews? These are the same people that muscled Bush into Office twice! There are several books about his legendary word mishaps! BUSHISMS!! Why the double standard? America didn't seem to care about word mishaps when considering Bush as President on two occasions. Why would they care for a Vice President who made them?

And people didn't think she was "Qualified" to be Vice President, or President should the need arise? She a successful Govenor, she was a mayor, she ran her own business. Did either McCain or Obama do those things??

The blame for the republican failure in this election goes to Bush JR and his 8 year reign, the economic collapse, and to both the republican voters who didn't vote and the pundits that helped them on. I put the blame in YOUR direction. So don't btch about the next four years!


"The Nephilim where in the Earth in those days..." Genesis 6:4

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