I think the question should be: Why do some listen to their conscience and some do not?
What do you mean? Are you suggesting I suppress my conscience? I can assure you I do not. Or is it that my conscience is in perfect alignment with that of god? In which case I'd like you to answer me why he is apparently in favour of abortion? I don't suppress my conscience when it comes to this, there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that abortion is justifiable. Or are you suggesting I do this subconsciously? Then how are we ever to know when we are doing it or not?
Then this is further complicated by the fact of different issues. I may be more sensative in conscience in one matter. I notice that that is no garantee that I have boasting rights over another person who may be more prone in another area to listen to his conscience than I.
Here we have the same problem. How do we know we all have the same conscience when apparently we can;t tell when we "suppress" it or not?
There is also the problem of an over sensative conscience too. That can lead to mental problems. I do not deal with that here.
Ok, neither will I then.
Now, here's what I read in the Bible.
Ok, I'll tell you what I read then as well. Just remember, without evidence, every view is equally valid, and thus not valid at all.
1.) Cain and Abel's parents told them how God needed to be worshipped.
Dammit, you made a part of genesis again, and all in vain, it never says they knew HOW to worship god, they just offer stuff to him.
2.) Abel obeyed. Cain decided to invent his own procedure.
Nowhere does it say this. You can't invent your own story to go along with what you THINK it should say.
3.) God recognized Abel's offering and rejected Cain's with an encouraging word to Cain that if he did well he too would be received.
No. God gave absolutely NO reason as to why he did bless Abel and not Cain.
4.) Cain, over come with the jealousy of rage becomes the world's first murderer. He also becomes the world's first inventor of a man made religion.
Nowhere does it say Cain established a "man made religion".
Conscience problem? Where? He lies to god, where is there an implication that he has a problem with this?
He has just murdered his brother Abel. He is totally callous about it.
Indicating he felt no such thing as a conscience.
It is not that Cain had no conscience. It is that he excecised his will power to suppress it. He shut it down. He shut it up. He refused by act of will to listen to his conscience.
Really? where does it say this is the case? You're just making stuff up now.
The problem with his conscience is really the problem in his will's choice to suppress the feeling of wrong doing in his conscience.
He DIDN'T suppress his conscience. He didn't feel bad at all! If the bible wanted to make clear he was suppressing his conscience, it could've said so, but it didn't. You're assertion that he IS doing it is just that, an assertion.
Of course God knew exactly where Abel was.
Really? then why did he ask Cain? Why not just say, "I know what you did"? Why did he need the "calling of the blood from the ground" to become aware of the situation?
God was giving Cain an opportunity to realize what he had done and to confess his sin.
Or god didn't know, and just wondered where Abel was.
The result was disappointing:
I'll say.... First, he chooses to prefer one over the other on a whim, then he is surprised the other acted as he did. I thought this fellow's supposed to be omniscient and all, doesn't seem like it.
Cain still shows no sign of remorse.
Again indicating that he didn't feel bad about it at all, which points to the fact that there is no universal conscience.
He only cares that his punishment is too harsh.
I would complain too, after being so unfairly treated.
He is scared that someone will seek vengence upon him and kill him, an act which God strictly forbids.
Well, since the only people so far are his mother and father, I'd say he'd just have to get away from them. I mean, how hard can it be t outrun two people when you've got an entire planet t hide on? Oh, and god finally sees he can;t put all the blame on Cain, so he decides to have some mercy upon him, bit late, but still.
The Bible portrays the downward current of the human race from Adam's disobedience. The next stage from entry of death is sin, murder, and the refusal to heed the God given conscience.
NOWHERE does it mention that Cain had a conscience, much less that he was suppressing it. Stop making stuff up.
Some would listen to the conscience and some would not.
There is no such thing as a universal conscience, if you have evidence to the contrary, please show it.
Now the conscience is a part of what the Bible calls the heart.
The heart is a muscle that pumps blood around a body, it has no impact on one's thoughts whatsoever. Unless, it doesn't function well, of course, that can be pretty detrimental to one's thought processes.
Psalm 33 says:
Jehovah looks down from heaven; He sees all the sons of men. From the site of His habitation He gazes at all the inhabitants of the earth, He who fashions the hearts of them all, He who discerns all their works.
This is just another way to refer to the creation story, god literally made our hearts, that's what this is saying.
God fashions the hearts of all created men.
He has to, if he didn't we'd all die.
Then God observes their lives and their works. He is watching. He is observing how each of us reacts to our conscience.
There is no universal conscience, there may be a subjective one. So, basically, god's just watching us a great big real life soap. I'll bet he's laughing his ass off.
He does not expect us to be able to carry out all of the good that we know.
We don't KNOW of ANY good. Further, the notion of what is "good" changes all the time, again pointing to the fact that there is no absolute moral right or wrong. To give an example that ties nicely into this thread, most of the "developed nations" used to think slavery was quite nifty, they don't now.
He knows that we have fallen into a sinful nature.
He should, he's responsible.
He does neither expect us to be able to resist all of the evil that we know.
We don't KNOW of ANY evil. Same argument as for the good, basically.
He knows that we have become corrupted and damaged by the poisoning of man's nature with the Satanic spirit operating in Adam's descendents.
He should, he's responsible.
He hopes that the conscience will be listened to to the point that when the Gospel comes and informs us that we have sinned we would agree.
The he should've given us all a universal conscience. Since he hasn't, he's playing a mean trick again.
When it says that Jesus had died for our sins He hopes we will believe.
Why hope, he could've made it so much easier. Oh, and hope implies he doesn't know what we'll do, so, is he Omniscient or not?
When we do and accept Jesus as our Savior and Lord there is a great peace that comes into the conscience that nothing in the world can give.
Really? how do you know? Tried everything there is have you?
There is no imitation for it.
Really? how do you know? Tried everything there is have you?
It is supernatural.
No, actually, it is quite natural, sorry. Feelings of euphoria are caused regularly by using drugs such as heroin and others. But then again, even if you tried all these things and still said that this "god experience" is so much better, it would still not be supernatural. For, you see, it's quite normal to claim the drugs you're using at this moment are the "best ever".
Yet it is quite normal.
So what is it? Supernatural, or normal?
I don't. I think he's an asshole.
We know that we are now, under the blood of Jesus, in a status AS IF WE HAD NEVER SINNED.
Uhm, no I'm not. Jesus, as described in the bible, never existed.
The conscience is restful and peaceful because, JUSTICE, has occured on our behalf in the death of Christ.
Nailing someone to a cross for telling people to get along is your idea of justice?
We have not been overlooked. We have been JUDGED. We have been judged in Christ. Justice has been imputed on our behalf in the death of Jesus the Son of God.
Really? I'd like to state here that I do not consider nailing a man to the cross for asking people to get along good justice, in fact I find it very bad justice.
On Calvary, on Christ's cross, our sins which offend our God created conscience were dealt with by Christ.
Thee is no god-created conscience. If there is, why is it not consistent?
The wrong reaction is to reason like this:
"No I am NOT a sinner. I am a pretty good person. At least I am not as bad as this guy over here. I am better than that one over there. I am better than a lot of religious people. I don't need to be saved. I don't need a Savior.
Even if I am bad I can change. Just give me one more day. I'll prove that I can change. I can live a life pleasing to God. Beside I don't want to have someone else take the penalty for me. That is not noble. That is not responsible. I will be responsible before God for my own sins. I don't want to say that I am all forgiven because of the death of Jesus."
Yes, for that is a stupid reaction. A better one would be something like this:
"I'm not a sinner, for sin is something invented by men to keep other men under their control. I'm a pretty good person, of course, I don't do everything like another person would do it, but that's because we have a different viewpoint on different things. I think, I act better then that person, but he probably thinks the same about me. I am better than a lot of religious people, at least I don't cling to false hopes and fairy tales, I look upon life through realism, not fantasy. Of course, the religions people say they're better than me, but what do you expect with everybody's morals differing. I don't need saving, that's something for the religious type. they want to believe this they can go right ahead.
I'm not bad, so why would I change? Because of the irrational fear of the religious?"
that would be much more realistic.
These kinds of reasonings are rebellion and unbelief. It is better to pray like this:
"Lord Jesus. I realize that I am a sinner. I don't promise to change myself. I don't promise I can turn over a new leaf. But I do acknowledge that I am a guilty sinner. I need your precious blood to wash away the stain of my sins before God. I receive you as my Lord and Savior."
Irrationality based in fear is never better then rationality based on reality.
That is much much wiser response to the Gospel. In fact just to confess "Lord Jesus" is most of the battle.
Confessing to an imaginary friend is what I did when I was 4, now, I talk to my real friends about my life.
This post is not meant to completely explain the Christian experience. I mean it to address the question you had on the conscience.
Pretty lengthy post and a lot of sermonizing to do that.
I also wanted to show you how the conscience can be released, made free, clean, gloriously at peace and how you can have a brand new start with a keener and ever brightening conscience.
Ok, too bad it's all fictional.
I hunt for the truth
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