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Author Topic:   Why did they cover their nakedness?
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6187
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007


Message 61 of 81 (492741)
01-02-2009 2:12 PM
Reply to: Message 60 by Blue Jay
01-02-2009 2:02 PM


Re: A whole lotta Love
Hi Mantis,

Mantis writes:

I've never actually heard it claimed that Adam and Eve didn't have gonads in the Garden, but I have heard it claimed that their gonads were non-functional, like a pre-pubescent child's. So, Adam and Eve were unable to reproduce until after the Fall.

You ever thought about they did not even know they were naked. If they did not know they were naked they did not know they were different. Just a thought.

God Bless,


"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."
This message is a reply to:
 Message 60 by Blue Jay, posted 01-02-2009 2:02 PM Blue Jay has responded

Replies to this message:
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Blue Jay
Member (Idle past 805 days)
Posts: 2843
From: You couldn't pronounce it with your mouthparts
Joined: 02-04-2008


Message 62 of 81 (492771)
01-02-2009 5:26 PM
Reply to: Message 61 by ICANT
01-02-2009 2:12 PM


Re: A whole lotta Love
Hi, ICANT.

ICANT writes:

You ever thought about they did not even know they were naked.

Yeah.

But, I think everyone else has covered that one well enough that it didn't need to be repeated by me.

-----

ICANT writes:

If they did not know they were naked they did not know they were different.

They'd have to be on some pretty spectacular drugs not to notice that there were differences, I think. But, you might be somewhat right: maybe they just associated the "differences" with the other personal traits that they used to distinguish one another.

Who knows, really?

I'm not married to a particular interpretation (forgive the pun).


I'm Bluejay.

Darwin loves you.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 61 by ICANT, posted 01-02-2009 2:12 PM ICANT has not yet responded

  
Peg
Member (Idle past 3037 days)
Posts: 2703
From: melbourne, australia
Joined: 11-22-2008


Message 63 of 81 (492807)
01-03-2009 1:37 AM
Reply to: Message 59 by Bailey
01-02-2009 1:48 PM


Re: sado masochistic religion seeking god - apply within
hi bailey.

could you possibly put my name on the quote box's that are actually mine so i dont get confused lol

speculating doesnt produce theology unless it becomes official teaching...thats not my purpose here

i see we hold very different views on the account...but i do agree with you that we should definitely test and examine the scriptures.

cheers


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Peg
Member (Idle past 3037 days)
Posts: 2703
From: melbourne, australia
Joined: 11-22-2008


Message 64 of 81 (492808)
01-03-2009 1:47 AM
Reply to: Message 54 by Bailey
01-01-2009 1:50 PM


Re: mercy trumps judgement
Adam should have held greater affection and loyalty to his Father. but instead he chose eve over God

im sure you'd agree that loyalty to God is the most important thing.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 54 by Bailey, posted 01-01-2009 1:50 PM Bailey has not yet responded

    
Peg
Member (Idle past 3037 days)
Posts: 2703
From: melbourne, australia
Joined: 11-22-2008


Message 65 of 81 (492810)
01-03-2009 2:25 AM
Reply to: Message 60 by Blue Jay
01-02-2009 2:02 PM


Re: A whole lotta Love
Mantis writes:

basically, God set Eve up, and the serpent informed her of this, and she gave in to his temptation. And, after Eve took of the fruit, Adam knew he had to as well.

wow, i've never actually looked at specific beliefs of the Mormons...thats surprising. I know you guys use the book of mormon and its obviously different to the bible account.

Looking at the vs in Genesis, the only thing that you could deduct is that 1. they were not allowed to eat from the tree
2. if they did, they would die

“From every tree of the garden you may eat to satisfaction. But as for the tree of the knowledge of good and bad you must not eat from it, for in the day you eat from it you will positively die.”—Genesis 2:16, 17.

it stands to reason that had they obeyed, they would not have died. therefore, life was dependent on obedience and loyalty to God...his continued blessing would be the reality, only if they obeyed his 1 command

but it is interesting mantis, thanks for sharing.


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shalamabobbi
Member (Idle past 957 days)
Posts: 397
Joined: 01-10-2009


Message 66 of 81 (494824)
01-19-2009 1:08 AM
Reply to: Message 58 by Peg
01-02-2009 3:36 AM


Re: A whole lotta Love
Peg writes(post 58)..
One thing we do know for sure is that if neither of them had fallen from Gods favor, then they would still be alive today as the original parents to all of us... and quite a few billion more people... and the whole earth would be a garden of eden.

You do see a logical problem here?
No death combined with unlimited reproduction?!
Perhaps Rrhain will do a simple back of the envelope calculation for us..


This message is a reply to:
 Message 58 by Peg, posted 01-02-2009 3:36 AM Peg has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 67 by Peg, posted 01-19-2009 1:16 AM shalamabobbi has responded

    
Peg
Member (Idle past 3037 days)
Posts: 2703
From: melbourne, australia
Joined: 11-22-2008


Message 67 of 81 (494826)
01-19-2009 1:16 AM
Reply to: Message 66 by shalamabobbi
01-19-2009 1:08 AM


Re: A whole lotta Love
shalamabobbi writes:

You do see a logical problem here?
No death combined with unlimited reproduction?!

im not sure that would be a problem

the direction God gave to Adam was to 'fill' the earth' and subdue it.
if i asked you to 'fill' my cup, im sure you wouldnt keep pouring something into it once it was filled.

women do naturally go thru menopause... my guess is that this function is in place for a reason.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 66 by shalamabobbi, posted 01-19-2009 1:08 AM shalamabobbi has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 68 by shalamabobbi, posted 01-19-2009 1:30 AM Peg has responded
 Message 69 by Rahvin, posted 01-19-2009 7:26 PM Peg has responded

    
shalamabobbi
Member (Idle past 957 days)
Posts: 397
Joined: 01-10-2009


Message 68 of 81 (494828)
01-19-2009 1:30 AM
Reply to: Message 67 by Peg
01-19-2009 1:16 AM


Re: A whole lotta Love
women do naturally go thru menopause... my guess is that this function is in place for a reason.

Well, leaving aside the idea that immortality implies no aging and/or degradation of the body, the problem still remains of the bodies of all progenitors remaining in the environment. At some point the process of having children has to stop. Is that fair for the late comers? They can't have families? They have to wait until menopause sets in to enjoy companionship?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 67 by Peg, posted 01-19-2009 1:16 AM Peg has responded

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Rahvin
Member (Idle past 1295 days)
Posts: 3964
Joined: 07-01-2005


Message 69 of 81 (494896)
01-19-2009 7:26 PM
Reply to: Message 67 by Peg
01-19-2009 1:16 AM


Re: A whole lotta Love

if i asked you to 'fill' my cup, im sure you wouldnt keep pouring something into it once it was filled.

Unless the age menopause sets in is changed to around the same as puberty, it's irrelevant to the question. If nobody is dying and yet those in the fertile age range continue to reproduce, overpopulation will set in.

Arguably, humans already are overpopulated, but immortality makes the issue exponentially worse.

The only possible solutions would be to magically create more space/food/whatever (admittedly not beyond the powers of an omnipotent deity), leave Earth and support overflow population in space habitats/other worlds/etc, or simply turn off the ability to procreate at all.

And of course the second option only postpones the problem. Given unlimited time and continued reproduction, the entire Universe wouldn't be large enough to support the human population. Only repeated magical Creation of new space or removal of the ability to procreate entirely would resolve the issue permanently.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 67 by Peg, posted 01-19-2009 1:16 AM Peg has responded

Replies to this message:
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Peg
Member (Idle past 3037 days)
Posts: 2703
From: melbourne, australia
Joined: 11-22-2008


Message 70 of 81 (495738)
01-24-2009 5:53 AM
Reply to: Message 68 by shalamabobbi
01-19-2009 1:30 AM


Re: A whole lotta Love
shalamabobbi writes:

At some point the process of having children has to stop. Is that fair for the late comers? They can't have families? They have to wait until menopause sets in to enjoy companionship?

when and if this planet becomes full, who's to say that God will not create more planets for human habitation? The universe is always growing...its expanding as we speak

so why should he stop at one if its within his power?

Perhaps he has other plans? But i seriously doubt that it will be a problem.


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Peg
Member (Idle past 3037 days)
Posts: 2703
From: melbourne, australia
Joined: 11-22-2008


Message 71 of 81 (495739)
01-24-2009 5:58 AM
Reply to: Message 69 by Rahvin
01-19-2009 7:26 PM


Re: A whole lotta Love
ravin writes:

Arguably, humans already are overpopulated, but immortality makes the issue exponentially worse.

The only possible solutions would be to magically create more space/food/whatever (admittedly not beyond the powers of an omnipotent deity), leave Earth and support overflow population in space habitats/other worlds/etc, or simply turn off the ability to procreate at all.

And of course the second option only postpones the problem. Given unlimited time

the earth is not really overpopulated. The problem is that we all group together in one place. Look at the small area of the Gaza strip...their is over a million palestinians living there, yet their is a vast landscape all around them uninhabited. Its the same all over the world. Its something like 5% of Australia is inhabited...the rest is empty

there is more then enough room on this earth for everyone alive now and everyone who has ever lived if they spread out.


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Replies to this message:
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Vacate
Member (Idle past 2708 days)
Posts: 565
Joined: 10-01-2006


Message 72 of 81 (495741)
01-24-2009 6:07 AM
Reply to: Message 71 by Peg
01-24-2009 5:58 AM


Re: A whole lotta Love
there is more then enough room on this earth for everyone alive now and everyone who has ever lived if they spread out.

Is this just an assertion or do you have the data that suggests these people could not only have room but also not starve?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 71 by Peg, posted 01-24-2009 5:58 AM Peg has responded

Replies to this message:
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Peg
Member (Idle past 3037 days)
Posts: 2703
From: melbourne, australia
Joined: 11-22-2008


Message 73 of 81 (495758)
01-24-2009 7:07 AM
Reply to: Message 72 by Vacate
01-24-2009 6:07 AM


Re: A whole lotta Love
well how big is the earth?
197,000,000 square miles in area.
less the 71 percent which is water .

thats a land surface of about 57,000,000 square miles or approx 36,000,000,000 acres.

divide that by 6 billion odd inhabitants and they get at least 6 acres of land each. That's a hell of a lot of land to live on... land that has the ability to produce food under the right conditions.

certainly not impossible


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Replies to this message:
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bluescat48
Member (Idle past 2297 days)
Posts: 2347
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2007


Message 74 of 81 (495765)
01-24-2009 7:21 AM
Reply to: Message 73 by Peg
01-24-2009 7:07 AM


Re: A whole lotta Love
divide that by 6 billion odd inhabitants and they get at least 6 acres of land each. That's a hell of a lot of land to live on... land that has the ability to produce food under the right conditions.

That would work if all the land was capable of sustaining life, without having to alter the land to make it habitable or not having to rely on bringing in needed supplies at an alarming rate. I cannot see areas such as the the Himalayas, the Sahara, The arctic tundra or other mountainous, desert or tundral areas ever able to become fully habitable without drastic measures. The logistics of the matter would be virtually impossible to allow each person his "6 acres."


There is no better love between 2 people than mutual respect for each other WT Young, 2002

Who gave anyone the authority to call me an authority on anything. WT Young, 1969


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 Message 73 by Peg, posted 01-24-2009 7:07 AM Peg has responded

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Peg
Member (Idle past 3037 days)
Posts: 2703
From: melbourne, australia
Joined: 11-22-2008


Message 75 of 81 (495772)
01-24-2009 7:47 AM
Reply to: Message 74 by bluescat48
01-24-2009 7:21 AM


Re: A whole lotta Love
hi bluescat,

yeah i agree... it would be physically impossible with the way the world is now

but we know that there have been times when the sahara desert was lush and green... it would take some drastic changes, but for a bible student, there is nothing impossible for God to do

if he could create a life sustaining atmosphere, surely he can make adjustments to the climate of the world.


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 Message 74 by bluescat48, posted 01-24-2009 7:21 AM bluescat48 has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
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