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Author | Topic: How did Monkeys get to South America? | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
RAZD Member (Idle past 1427 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
(1) rubber ducks
http://rubaduck.com/...s-200302-duckies_around_the_world.htm
quote: So for a good average speed you can figure the great circle route. It also looks like the surface travels faster than the main current or the ducks (and hence rafters) are assisted by prevailing winds -- looks like you can double your speed estimates for rafts. (2) Steve Callahan, Adrift: Seventy-six Days Lost at Sea: Amazon.com
quote: His sailboat sank so fast he was not able to provision the raft or even grab navigation gear. What provisions he had were soon gone, and he was left with his wits for 3-1/2 months. http://www.inspirationline.com/EZINE/27SEP2004.htm
quote: I remember reading about it when he was rescued. So yes, primates can survive drifting on rafts for a long time. Enjoy. Edited by RAZD, : format by our ability to understand Rebel American Zen Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. • • • Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click) • • •
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Engineer Member (Idle past 5538 days) Posts: 65 From: KY, USA Joined: |
quote: Please provide your link, It doesn't come up at all on my search engine. That's pretty unusual. A 3 foot alligator was spotted in the mountains of North Carolina. Either way of getting there is totally ridiculous. Somebody put it there obviously: http://www2.brevard.edu/reynoljh/fbgator.htm
Also dead shark was found in Lake Michigan: MSN | Outlook, Office, Skype, Bing, Breaking News, and Latest Videos
quote: It probably was from africa, but wouldn't last more than about 10 days without fresh water.
quote: It would take several monkeys without any competitors to establish a new population. This would take several trans-atlantic rafting expeditions before one of them finally succeeded in establishing a population. I think the most likely way of crossing and surviving would be on a tossock floating island: Floating island - Wikipedia
It would take a big rain storm or a tidal wave to remove one of these from a swamp. Either could potentially tear it apart. Edited by Engineer, : requested link on green monkey
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Engineer Member (Idle past 5538 days) Posts: 65 From: KY, USA Joined: |
ok I found the link about Charles Sutherland Elton after a google search. The same link says the monkeys got to South America probably by island hopping.
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bluegenes Member (Idle past 2499 days) Posts: 3119 From: U.K. Joined: |
Engineer writes: It probably was from africa, but wouldn't last more than about 10 days without fresh water. I've been on the Indian ocean when it was pouring with rain at least three times that I can remember. The distance from the east coast of Africa to Java is greater than the distance from the west coast to South America, incidentally.
It would take several monkeys without any competitors to establish a new population. This would take several trans-atlantic rafting expeditions before one of them finally succeeded in establishing a population. A pair of mammals is sufficient, as I pointed out further up the thread. http://www.sciencedaily.com/...ases/2007/06/070620154911.htm Placental mammals tend to do well when arriving on continents with only marsupial mammals, so there are no great problems preventing them from founding a population. The strongest evidence for the event is the fact that they are there. All we're doing on this thread is pointing out that it's perfectly feasible in the face of your irrational incredulity.
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Darwinist Junior Member (Idle past 5538 days) Posts: 22 From: Two Rocks, Western Australia Joined: |
My island hopping theory was original.
Always wanting to hear other peoples opinions about God and evolution. Email me. |
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9143 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.3 |
They are in South America, so it happened.
As has been stated in previous posts we will never know exactly how, but that they are there is evidence it happened. Your incredulity does not make it not a fact.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 306 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
It probably was from africa, but wouldn't last more than about 10 days without fresh water. See my previous post about "fresh water".
It would take several monkeys without any competitors to establish a new population. "Without any competitors"? But of course. We're trying to figure out how monkeys arrived in a continent without any monkeys. The first monkeys to get to South America had no competitors in the business of being monkeys.
This would take several trans-atlantic rafting expeditions before one of them finally succeeded in establishing a population. Again, yes. Of course. Surely most monkeys cast out to sea on rafts of vegetation or pumice rafts must die. We concede the point. But there are millions of years for this to happen again and again, and the monkeys only have to be lucky once. Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.
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Coragyps Member (Idle past 756 days) Posts: 5553 From: Snyder, Texas, USA Joined: |
and the monkeys only have to be lucky once. That's the money quote, Engineer. Luck wins this one over prosimian navigational skills.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 306 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
At least this has been interesting.
Most stuff on EvC is just the same old stupid boring crap that was refuted 100 years ago This topic has at least made us all think and do a little research. Pumice islands? Really? Vegetation rafts more than a mile in extent? Wow. Green monkeys off the coast of Indonesia? Well I didn't know that. To speak for myself, I've found out stuff that I didn't know by participating in this discussion, so it's been fun. I have made a post like this before, but I think it was more than a year ago ... we really don't get interesting questions that often. So I should like to thank Engineer.
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Engineer Member (Idle past 5538 days) Posts: 65 From: KY, USA Joined: |
quote: Other sources say it takes more than once because there were natural competitors in south america at the time. The time period surmised is about 35 million years ago. There are other threads on the internet that have already covered this debate. At 35 million years the separation between continents was about 1400 km.
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Engineer Member (Idle past 5538 days) Posts: 65 From: KY, USA Joined: |
quote: Some evolution experts think the raft from africa borders on ridiculous. The so-called "millions of years of rafting opportunity" never existed unless monkeys found a time machine. I like my flying monkey idea better than that. Perhaps you should be debating your views on this evolution forum: Cryptozoology.com Here's an opening post from someone considerably more expert than you are:
quote: Edited by Engineer, : No reason given. Edited by Engineer, : No reason given. Edited by Engineer, : added additional hypotheses
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9143 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.3 |
Ok maybe you don't understand this forum. This is under
Miscellaneous Topics in Creation/Evolution this is not cryptozoology. Do you know what Cryptozoology is?
Cryptozoology the study of evidence tending to substantiate the existence of, or the search for, creatures whose reported existence is unproved, as the Abominable Snowman or the Loch Ness monster. So to call this an evolution forum seems to not only a stretch but total misrepresentation. These are probably potential scenarios. I have never claimed to be an expert, but also have no reason to believe these are experts either.I can tell you that as of right now the scientific evidence points toward the rafting hypothesis. If someone else publishes something and goes through the peer reviewed process to change that, well that would be science in action. If you read further on that forum you would have seen where someone mentions this
Until Dr. Bloch's discoveries get published for peer review it is nothing more than heresay. Cryptozoology really? Wow!!! Edited by Theodoric, : spelling
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Engineer Member (Idle past 5538 days) Posts: 65 From: KY, USA Joined: |
Here's a recent press release:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/...ases/2005/03/050329134437.htm A lot of African animals came from North America. The raft went the other way. ;-)
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Engineer Member (Idle past 5538 days) Posts: 65 From: KY, USA Joined: |
quote: a Science Daily peer reviewed article. I guess you aren't interested in science. Oh well back to flying monkeys for you. Edited by Engineer, : No reason given. Edited by Engineer, : No reason given.
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9143 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.3 |
Interesting hypothesis. Amazing how science works, but I do not see anything definitive.
It is a viable hypothesis. But what does this say about your belief that that the raft theory is implausible.
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