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Who & what are the demons ?

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Author Topic:   Who & what are the demons ?
onifre
Member (Idle past 2971 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008

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Message 46 of 349 (493947)
01-11-2009 10:10 PM 		Reply to: Message 43 by John 10:10
01-11-2009 6:00 PM

Hi John,
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When Jesus cast them out, the demon possessed people became normal and in the right mind.
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Do you have any evidence of this happening outside of the Christian bible...?
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Just as the first healing step for an alcoholic or a drug addict is to admit that you are an alcoholic or a drug addict, the same is true for those who are afflicted by demons.
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We can see alcohol, drugs. We can physically hold them - trust me . The chemical effects can be visually seen. There is no need for someone to invoke faith, the proof of the effects can be observed, and the causing agents (drugs, alcohol) can be seen too.
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With demons, we again must take a persons word for it. We can't visually see them. So, not only would we first have to accept Christianity, the bible (which we are discussing in another thread) which a non-believer can't properly read, we have to accept a man telling me that the demon is in me and that he can cure me - has anyone heard of religious shaman before...?
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Our mental wards are full of people that have not been helped by drugs and years of counseling.
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Our mental wards are filled with people who have neurological disorders, these disorders are NOT cured by drugs or counseling; sadly they are often not curable at all.
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Yes, I'm in favor of following Jesus' example by casting out demons when nothing else man has tried has worked.
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Curiously, this was the only way to help people in the Dark Ages, until it was noticed that it did absolutely nothing, and thus medicine came to be known as the cure-all.
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Are you suggesting we reject medicine in favor of exorcisms...?
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Even Jesus would have to laugh at that one, lol.
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"I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks
​
"I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky
This message is a reply to:
 Message 43 by John 10:10, posted 01-11-2009 6:00 PM John 10:10 has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 49 by John 10:10, posted 01-16-2009 2:50 PM onifre has not replied
 Message 57 by Buzsaw, posted 01-16-2009 8:24 PM onifre has replied
  
onifre
Member (Idle past 2971 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008

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Message 58 of 349 (494552)
01-16-2009 8:49 PM 		Reply to: Message 57 by Buzsaw
01-16-2009 8:24 PM

Hi Buz,
​
1. Who else, as writers or historians, would be privy to this event?
2. What significance would this event have to anyone else?
3. What other ancient manuscripts relative to historical events do we have as near to the alleged ancient historical event in question than the NT?
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My point exactly. The alleged event took place without any witnesses that wrote any other books about the life of said individual.
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The only place it is found is in the questionable books of the NT. This is unsupported mythology as are most other stories of this nature that speak of "demons".
​
"I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks
​
"I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky
This message is a reply to:
 Message 57 by Buzsaw, posted 01-16-2009 8:24 PM Buzsaw has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 59 by Buzsaw, posted 01-16-2009 9:20 PM onifre has replied
  
onifre
Member (Idle past 2971 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008

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Message 61 of 349 (494567)
01-16-2009 9:58 PM 		Reply to: Message 59 by Buzsaw
01-16-2009 9:20 PM

By your allegation that this near to the event historical manuscript is mythology, woudn't that imply that all other (abe: unverified)ancient historical manuscripts further removed from the events claimed are even more likely mythology as well?
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Yes, I would agree, any manuscript claiming anything on demons is mythology.
​
"I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks
​
"I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky
This message is a reply to:
 Message 59 by Buzsaw, posted 01-16-2009 9:20 PM Buzsaw has not replied
  
onifre
Member (Idle past 2971 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008

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Message 98 of 349 (499792)
02-20-2009 12:32 PM 		Reply to: Message 97 by John 10:10
02-18-2009 1:31 PM

Re: added "as recorded in the Bible"
The evidence is that what Jesus said will happen to those who honor Him as Lord actually happens. I can't provide this evidence to you.
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If you can't provide evidence then that statment is just a baseless assertion and it's unverifiable.
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Only Jesus can provide this evidence to you if you are willing to honestly seek Him and let Him find you.
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We are ALL willing, there is just nothing there. That your brain managed to convince you says nothing about the veracity of the Jesus story, don't you get that?
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Furthermore, the same can be said to you about Allah, John.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 97 by John 10:10, posted 02-18-2009 1:31 PM John 10:10 has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 99 by John 10:10, posted 02-21-2009 6:21 PM onifre has replied
  
onifre
Member (Idle past 2971 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008

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Message 100 of 349 (500055)
02-22-2009 1:17 PM 		Reply to: Message 99 by John 10:10
02-21-2009 6:21 PM

Re: added "as recorded in the Bible"
Wrong again!!! ALL are not willing to seek the God of the Bible. The ones who are willing must do so the way the God of Bible prescribes in John 6.
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26 Jesus answered them and said, "Truly, truly, I say to you, you seek Me, not because you saw signs, but because you ate of the loaves and were filled.
27 "Do not work for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give to you, for on Him the Father, God, has set His seal."
28 Therefore they said to Him, "What shall we do, so that we may work the works of God?"
29 Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent."
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Are you willing to seek Him upon whom God has set His seal?
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Again, we are willing to seek him there's just nothing there...
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I have seeked him personally, there's just nothing there.
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The above quote was what John said Jesus said to a group of people. If that is where im suppose to find him, there's nothing there.
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If those words in that passage are the way to find him, there's nothing there.
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If your brain convinced you that there is something there that still doesn't confirm anything about the veracity of the bible.
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PS - Allah of the Quran is not Yahweh of the Bible, but you don't understand the difference.
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PS - oranges aren't apples but they are both fruits.
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You don't get to tell Muslims who is God and who is not God.
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"I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks
​
"I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky
This message is a reply to:
 Message 99 by John 10:10, posted 02-21-2009 6:21 PM John 10:10 has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 101 by John 10:10, posted 02-24-2009 12:34 PM onifre has replied
  
onifre
Member (Idle past 2971 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008

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Message 102 of 349 (500289)
02-24-2009 12:43 PM 		Reply to: Message 101 by John 10:10
02-24-2009 12:34 PM

Re: added "as recorded in the Bible"
"Lord, help my unbelief."
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You are showing a clear sign of condescension.
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I don't believe in "the Lord" for me to pray to him.
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My position on this is valid, I have not seen anything where as you have. I accept that you have, you must accept that I have NOT. Then we can view the objective evidence together and see if there is a rightfull cause for belief.
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If your only point is "I'm right and your worng" then we have nothing to talk about.
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Edited by onifre, : No reason given.
​
"I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks
​
"I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky
This message is a reply to:
 Message 101 by John 10:10, posted 02-24-2009 12:34 PM John 10:10 has not replied
  
onifre
Member (Idle past 2971 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008

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(1)
Message 105 of 349 (500359)
02-25-2009 2:09 AM 		Reply to: Message 104 by Coragyps
02-24-2009 8:25 PM

Re: added "as recorded in the Bible"
Tracey lord,
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Are you sure you don't want any help from Tracey Lords?
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She'll make say "Oh my God!"...for sure!
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Edited by onifre, : No reason given.
​
"I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks
​
"I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky
This message is a reply to:
 Message 104 by Coragyps, posted 02-24-2009 8:25 PM Coragyps has not replied
  
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