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Member (Idle past 4716 days) Posts: 1277 From: A vast, undifferentiated plane. Joined: |
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Author | Topic: People Don't Know What Creation Science Is | |||||||||||||||||||||||
Kelly Member (Idle past 5495 days) Posts: 217 Joined: |
if it makes you feel better. But I know that an honest look around at my posts reveals otherwise.
http://blogs.townonline.com/...oads/2008/03/head-in-sand.JPG
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Kelly Member (Idle past 5495 days) Posts: 217 Joined: |
You'll have to find it for yourself.
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subbie Member (Idle past 1254 days) Posts: 3509 Joined: |
Are you really that afraid of giving an honest, straightforward answer?
Either call all scientists liars or admit you might be wrong. For we know that our patchwork heritage is a strength, not a weakness. We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and non-believers. -- Barack Obama We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat
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Kelly Member (Idle past 5495 days) Posts: 217 Joined: |
First I am not giving enough information or answering enough questions, and now I have too many posts. Well, I have said all that there is to say. No need to keep pressing my points. If you want to know more, then read the book I recommended. I can see that I am really wasting my time anyway.
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lyx2no Member (Idle past 4716 days) Posts: 1277 From: A vast, undifferentiated plane. Joined: |
It's off topic.
Message 1: I do this to eliminate the reference to evolution. If "Creationist Science" is "¬ evolution" then this would be yet another stupid "Evolution-has-problems" thread. Anyone referring to flaws in evolution or evolutionists is off topic in this thread. Genesis 2 17 But of the ponderosa pine, thou shalt not eat of it; for in the day that thou shinniest thereof thou shalt sorely learn of thy nakedness. 18 And we all live happily ever after.
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Kelly Member (Idle past 5495 days) Posts: 217 Joined: |
as it could be. Read it again to see what I think about evolutionary scientists. I also don't like to call people liars. That seems to be something you all easily do in speaking about creationists, though.
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lyx2no Member (Idle past 4716 days) Posts: 1277 From: A vast, undifferentiated plane. Joined: |
Your avatar is supposed to go under you name.
Genesis 2 17 But of the ponderosa pine, thou shalt not eat of it; for in the day that thou shinniest thereof thou shalt sorely learn of thy nakedness. 18 And we all live happily ever after.
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Kelly Member (Idle past 5495 days) Posts: 217 Joined: |
I don't know who cares, but I am just responding to questions asked of me.
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Granny Magda Member Posts: 2462 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.0 |
There is only one way for you to win a debate such as this; provide compelling answers to the question that everyone has been asking since the get-go. Tell us about creation science's predictions, discoveries and practical accomplishments. It's that simple.
Or at least it would be, if creation science had ever accomplished anything. As it happens though, all it has to offer is a stock of bad arguments against evolution and a Bible hidden in its back pocket. Mutate and Survive "The Bible is like a person, and if you torture it long enough, you can get it to say almost anything you'd like it to say." -- Rev. Dr. Francis H. Wade
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lyx2no Member (Idle past 4716 days) Posts: 1277 From: A vast, undifferentiated plane. Joined: |
Please show me where I asked you where the flaws in evolution were.
Edited by lyx2no, : My heavy-handed typing scared the "h" out of Pete Townsend. Genesis 2 17 But of the ponderosa pine, thou shalt not eat of it; for in the day that thou shinniest thereof thou shalt sorely learn of thy nakedness. 18 And we all live happily ever after.
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subbie Member (Idle past 1254 days) Posts: 3509 Joined: |
But I didn't ask about "evolutionary scientists." If what you said is true, all biologists, all geologists, all physicists, all chemists, basically all scientists would be liars.
Either have the courage of your convictions or admit that you're spreading nonsense. For we know that our patchwork heritage is a strength, not a weakness. We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and non-believers. -- Barack Obama We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat
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onifre Member (Idle past 2950 days) Posts: 4854 From: Dark Side of the Moon Joined: |
But just to summerize, the first Law of Thermodynamics states that there can be no creation or annihilation of Mass/Energy. Since creation science doesn't seem to be your stong suit, we'll deal with the above quote. Quantum fluctuations violate your entire statement. Quantum fluctuations quote: Not only does the Second Law point back to creation; How on Earth can you justify that if the "creator" would violate every law also? First, you don't fully comprehend what you are talking about. Second, you contradict the very act that you claim nature couldn't do by implying that a "creator" is more than capable of doing it without explaining how. What gives here? Do you not see the error in what you're telling us? That's why these creationist talking points are so stupid, because the only people who believe it have no clue how to see the obvious contradictions in their own worldview, let alone in an argument against a subject they've never fully grasped. How do you expect any of what you're telling us to be comprehended if you are not making sense? Either give us a clear-cut description of creation science and explain how you get around the "creator" violating every law YOU mentioned, or admit to it's obvious flaw. - Oni Edited by onifre, : No reason given. Edited by onifre, : No reason given. Edited by onifre, : spelling "I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks "I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky
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Percy Member Posts: 22389 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
To Everyone,
There have been some concerns about topic. In Message 154 Lyx2no gathered Kelly's arguments that are on topic and that attempt to describe creation science. I suggest we focus on those. She claims that creation science's basic points are:
Kelly, a good place to register your criticisms of evolution is over at Evolutionary Biology as a Science where the last message is Message 28, hint, hint. You never replied to my message suggesting that you can click on your name to get a list of the threads your participating in, but I hope it was helpful and that you're having an easier time now navigating around the site. --Percy Edited by Percy, : Fix message link.
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Modulous Member Posts: 7801 From: Manchester, UK Joined: |
How could the existence of distinct species be justified by a theory (evolution) that proclaims ceaseless change as the most fundamental fact of nature? For you, why should there be species or "types" at all? If all life forms have been produced by gradual expansion through selected mutations from a small begining gene pool, organisms should really just grade into one another without distinct boundaries. You cannot take comfort in the fossil record since it is used so well at classifying species and types. I have asked myself that. I've also asked evolutionary biologists. And received an answer. Here is the wonderful thing: it isn't clear cut. There are many cases when it is difficult to say 'this is a different species', for instance in cases like ring species. I'm perfectly happy to explain it all to you in a thread that concentrates on evolution, but this isn't that thread. For an intro into the subject I refer you to this post - or, if you'd prefer it in video format you can view Part 1, Part 2, and Part 3. It's a little more than twenty minutes of time and you should have a good start to an answer. I provide this so that you cannot accuse me of avoiding even trying to answer your question. Note to moderators: The referenced videos even includes reference to "Typology", the method for determining 'types' that Kelly is probably trying to get across here.
Living things were created to multiply after type, and that these created types could be rationally grouped in a hierarchical pattern reflecting themes and variations of the designer was well understood by pre-Darwinian scientists such as Karl Von Linne'. You said that the Creation Model makes a prediction that has come true. I asked you to back that up, not repeat the claim. So, since you managed to evade my questions I'll simply repeat them and you can decide if you want to actually answer them. This is a topic all about creation science:
The creation model postulates that all the basic types of plants and animals were directly created and did not evolve from other types at all. Consequently the creationist predicts that no transitional sequences (except within each created type) will ever be found, either in the present array of organisms or in the fossil record. This prediction is borne out in the present assemblage of plants and animals and is obvious to all. So the creation model is capable of telling us what a 'type' is, how we can know one type from another? After all, how would you know if the prediction has borne out unless you could show us some method of determining a type, right? You of course understand that you cannot use the fossil record to make determinations about what a type is since that is the evidence of the successful prediction so you'd be caught in a circular argument. If you don't want to get into that level of detail, if you let us in on this secret model we can derive the predictions for ourselves.
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9076 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.7 |
You never even read what I posted and never thought of the things I asked you to think of did you?
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