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Author Topic:   The timeline of the Bible
Peg
Member (Idle past 4929 days)
Posts: 2703
From: melbourne, australia
Joined: 11-22-2008


Message 274 of 316 (508750)
05-15-2009 11:35 PM
Reply to: Message 270 by Rrhain
05-15-2009 7:53 PM


Rrhain writes:
Incorrect. It is the timeline since "the beginning."
Or are you saying that when the text says, "the beginning," it doesn't actually mean, you know, the "beginning" but is rather referring to "later"?
If it didn't mean the beginning, why did it say, "the beginning"?
the beginning of the creation of the universe includes when God made the earth... the 6 creative days, where he worked on the earth to prepare it for habitation, is NOT the beginning of the universe.
Rrhain writes:
Why can't we include those six, literal, 24-hour days?
you say they are literal days, but Genesis does not. At Gen 2:4 Moses refers to all six creative days as ONE day. "This is the history of the heavens and the earth in the "DAY" of their being created"
There is further evidence of this on the first creative day, "God began calling the light Day, but the darkness he called Night." So only a portion of the 24-hour period was being defined by the term "day."
There is no basis in Scripture for arbitrarily stating that each creative day was 24 hours long.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 270 by Rrhain, posted 05-15-2009 7:53 PM Rrhain has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 275 by bluescat48, posted 05-16-2009 1:24 AM Peg has replied
 Message 284 by Rrhain, posted 05-17-2009 6:28 AM Peg has replied

Peg
Member (Idle past 4929 days)
Posts: 2703
From: melbourne, australia
Joined: 11-22-2008


Message 276 of 316 (508778)
05-16-2009 5:45 AM
Reply to: Message 275 by bluescat48
05-16-2009 1:24 AM


bluescat48 writes:
And no evidence that it doesn't and what does Moses have to do with Genesis?
not good enough.
I present evidence to show why 'day' is not a literal 24 hours and you ignore it and continue on your merry way with "there is no evidence"
I see your eyes are closed on this one because you know the earth was not created in 6 literal days and you are glad to hear some bible folk persist in this teaching...it reinforces to you that the bible is wrong and unscientific and therefore God did not inspire it because God does not exist.
If its not to challenge such ideas, what is the purpose of the debate???

This message is a reply to:
 Message 275 by bluescat48, posted 05-16-2009 1:24 AM bluescat48 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 277 by bluescat48, posted 05-16-2009 8:28 AM Peg has replied

Peg
Member (Idle past 4929 days)
Posts: 2703
From: melbourne, australia
Joined: 11-22-2008


Message 280 of 316 (508883)
05-17-2009 2:12 AM
Reply to: Message 277 by bluescat48
05-16-2009 8:28 AM


bluescat48 writes:
You seem to want it both ways, the earth is 6000 years old but yet it is not 6000 years old.
that just goes to show that you havnt understood what i've been trying to say.
I dont believe the earth is 6,000 years old...i believe MANKIND is 6,000 years old
The earth of Genesis 1:1 was a product created by God when he created the Universe....the creation of the universe incl the earth was complete before Gen 1:2 says that God began to work on the planet earth to prepare it for habitation.
Kberscht just pointed out that Genesis 1:1 and the beginning of the 'Days' of Genesis 1:3 are not one in the same. He makes a very fine point and one that everyone seems to keep missing.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 277 by bluescat48, posted 05-16-2009 8:28 AM bluescat48 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 281 by Otto Tellick, posted 05-17-2009 3:15 AM Peg has not replied
 Message 285 by Percy, posted 05-17-2009 9:28 AM Peg has replied
 Message 292 by Rrhain, posted 05-17-2009 8:32 PM Peg has not replied

Peg
Member (Idle past 4929 days)
Posts: 2703
From: melbourne, australia
Joined: 11-22-2008


Message 293 of 316 (509029)
05-18-2009 5:52 AM
Reply to: Message 285 by Percy
05-17-2009 9:28 AM


Percy writes:
Certainly there are scholars on the other side of the issue, but they're in the minority. Being in the minority in a debate doesn't mean you're wrong, but you seem not to comprehend the minority status of your view. You propose it as if it's the most obvious thing, as if no one reasonable would ever think otherwise.
Yes perhaps i'm taking it for granted...it just makes so much more sense to me (and others of the minority) and it surprises me that others dont accept it as a basis of evidence for an erroneous teaching
here are a few examples of how 'Yohm' or 'Day' can be used...
1. the 12 hour period of 'light' is called day (yohm) at Gen 1:5 "God began calling the light Day, but the darkness he called Night"
This is obviously not 24 hours in length...or are we to beleive that it is 24 hours in length because of the word 'day'???
2. at Genesis 2:4 ALL the creative periods are called one 'day'(yohm)
does this mean that chapter 1 is a complete mistake???
3. William Wilson's Old Testament Word Studies says "A day; it is frequently put for time in general, or for a long time; a whole period under consideration...Day is also put for a particular season or time when any extraordinary event happens"
here is one of the minority scholars who believe 'day' is of any length of time
4. The word Yohm/day is used at Zechariah 14:18 with reference to the "Day of Harvest" which includes several days.
again are we to assume that the harvest was completed in 1 literal day...we KNOW thats not the case
5. In Ps 90:4 A thousand years are likened to one 'day'
with so much evidence for the minority view it makes me wonder if there is another agenda for the majority view. If we let the bible speak by taking it all into consideration, then we have to conclude that the 'minority' view is correct.
Edited by Peg, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 285 by Percy, posted 05-17-2009 9:28 AM Percy has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 299 by Rrhain, posted 05-19-2009 3:24 AM Peg has not replied

Peg
Member (Idle past 4929 days)
Posts: 2703
From: melbourne, australia
Joined: 11-22-2008


Message 294 of 316 (509030)
05-18-2009 6:03 AM
Reply to: Message 284 by Rrhain
05-17-2009 6:28 AM


Rrhain writes:
You're seemingly hung up over the fact that words can have more than one meaning and you determine that meaning by the context. "Day" means both the period in which the sun is in the sky as well as 24-hour as well as long periods of time.
and this itself is a very interesting point
You know that Day 1 is where it is said "let light come to be and there came to be light and the came to be morning and evening a first day"
and yet the sun and moon did not appear until DAY 4
why is that?
how could a day and night be complete without the sun and moon?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 284 by Rrhain, posted 05-17-2009 6:28 AM Rrhain has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 295 by bluescat48, posted 05-18-2009 10:19 AM Peg has not replied
 Message 296 by Rrhain, posted 05-18-2009 9:46 PM Peg has not replied

Peg
Member (Idle past 4929 days)
Posts: 2703
From: melbourne, australia
Joined: 11-22-2008


Message 297 of 316 (509132)
05-18-2009 10:34 PM
Reply to: Message 288 by Rrhain
05-17-2009 8:09 PM


Rrhain writes:
In Genesis 1, the phrasing is what is used for literal, 24-hour days: "And there was evening and there was morning, one/a second/third/fourth/fifth/the sixth day." That phrasing is not indicative of long periods of vaguely defined time. It is indicative of literal, 24-hour days.
The sun doesnt appear until day 4, not day 1, so how can there be an 'evening and morning' without the sun on each of these 'days'?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 288 by Rrhain, posted 05-17-2009 8:09 PM Rrhain has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 300 by Rrhain, posted 05-19-2009 3:31 AM Peg has not replied

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