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Author | Topic: Fate of the Neanderthals | |||||||||||||||||||||||
Taq Member Posts: 9973 Joined: Member Rating: 5.7 |
I recently watched Neanderthal Code on the National Geographic Channel. Towards the end of the show they proposed that the neanderthals did not go extinct. Instead, neanderthals interbred with modern humans and were assimilated into the modern human population.
I just don't see how this could be given the genetic evidence that has thus far come to light. First, it appears that no human living today (or very, very few) carry mitochondrial DNA from neanderthals. The same can be said for the Y-chromosome. You would think that if interbreeding was common that either the maternal or paternal lineages would be seen in modern populations, especially in European populations where interbreeding would have been the most common. Admittedly, these conclusions are being drawn from incomplete information. Just last month scientists announced that the neanderthal genome has been completely sequenced. They are hoping to release the results of the neanderthal-human comparison later this year.
Link What I am wondering is this. Given the lack of neanderthal mitochondrial DNA and Y-chromosome lineages in modern populations, should we expect to see other neanderthal genes in modern populations? What do you guys predict will be found in the neanderthal genome?
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AdminNosy Administrator Posts: 4754 From: Vancouver, BC, Canada Joined: |
Thread moved here from the Proposed New Topics forum.
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Stagamancer Member (Idle past 4916 days) Posts: 174 From: Oregon Joined: |
What I am wondering is this. Given the lack of neanderthal mitochondrial DNA and Y-chromosome lineages in modern populations, should we expect to see other neanderthal genes in modern populations? What do you guys predict will be found in the neanderthal genome?/ Well, I would expect to find a lot of similarity between the genomes H. sapiens and H. neanderthalensis, since I would expect us to be even more related to them than chimpanzees/bonobos. However, this raises the question of how you determine which genes are shared because of a common ancestor, and which genes are shared because of interbreeding? "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics."
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ramoss Member (Idle past 612 days) Posts: 3228 Joined: |
There is at least one gene that deals with brain development that appears to be from neanderthal.
Human Brain Carries at Least One Neanderthal Gene
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Taq Member Posts: 9973 Joined: Member Rating: 5.7 |
However, this raises the question of how you determine which genes are shared because of a common ancestor, and which genes are shared because of interbreeding? I don't think that would be difficult. If the lineages split between 500,000 and 700,000 years ago then you would expect to see a certain amount of synonymous mutations (mutations that do not change the amino acid sequence of the protein being coded for). You would also expect a certain amount of divergence between introns. If there is a lack of synonymous mutations and differences in introns then I think this could point to interbreeding.
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Taq Member Posts: 9973 Joined: Member Rating: 5.7 |
There is at least one gene that deals with brain development that appears to be from neanderthal. Human Brain Carries at Least One Neanderthal Gene That is one of the important genes that they talked about in the article I linked to in the OP. Another interesting candidate is FOXP2.
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pandion Member (Idle past 3001 days) Posts: 166 From: Houston Joined: |
ramoss writes:
I don't know. Couldn't it be as plausible to conclude that the gene came from common ancestry?
There is at least one gene that deals with brain development that appears to be from neanderthal.
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Artemis Entreri  Suspended Member (Idle past 4229 days) Posts: 1194 From: Northern Virginia Joined: |
They probably had to take a guess, to conclude the show. Though the National Geographic Society is not even a scientific group.
All in all they are entertaining. Neadertals is an interesting subject to me. I would guess that they were part of the Ice Age Mega Fauna (well they had some big hominid features sorta) that could not adapt fast enough to the warming climate after the last Ice Age. They probably were in decline from the climate, and were out competeted by the more adaptable Homo sapiens sapiens. Had the world remained cool I think they would have survied in isolated populations, in areas where thier prey survived.
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ramoss Member (Idle past 612 days) Posts: 3228 Joined: |
There is substantial evidence it is an interpolition.. because of the degree it is different from other variations of that specific gene.
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Taq Member Posts: 9973 Joined: Member Rating: 5.7 |
There is substantial evidence it is an interpolition.. because of the degree it is different from other variations of that specific gene. I agree. The evidence is strongly in favor of a horizontal transfer from neanderthals to modern humans. It could still be the product of common ancestry, but those chances are pretty slim.
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Stagamancer Member (Idle past 4916 days) Posts: 174 From: Oregon Joined: |
Sorry, this is a bit off topic, but I couldn't resist putting it in the "Fate of Neanderthals" thread. New evidence has arisen that suggests that in some cases Homo sapiens maybe have killed and eaten Neanderthals.
quote: The evidence is by no means unequivocal or overwhelming. But it's an interesting thought. We have many intuitions in our life and the point is that many of these intuitions are wrong. The question is, are we going to test those intuitions? -Dan Ariely
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Dr Jack Member Posts: 3514 From: Immigrant in the land of Deutsch Joined: Member Rating: 8.7 |
I saw that too. Surely eating Neanderthals is not cannibalism?
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Stagamancer Member (Idle past 4916 days) Posts: 174 From: Oregon Joined: |
Well, I suppose it's all in how you define cannibalism. Is it only eating members of your own species, or could it include eating members of your genus? I think it's also important to consider the implications of eating another sentient being. From a public health perspective, though, I guess the most important thing is how would prions and viruses have passed between neanderthals and humans.
We have many intuitions in our life and the point is that many of these intuitions are wrong. The question is, are we going to test those intuitions? -Dan Ariely
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1.61803 Member (Idle past 1504 days) Posts: 2928 From: Lone Star State USA Joined: |
Neaderthal would more than likely kick cromag's ass and eat him.
I for one in a death match would have money on Mr. brow ridges.
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Perdition Member (Idle past 3238 days) Posts: 1593 From: Wisconsin Joined: |
I'd have to say, eating others in your genus would only be "genuside"
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