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Author Topic:   EVOLUTION'S FRAUD HAS CONTRIBUTED TO ITS PUBLIC ACCEPTANCE:
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2106 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 151 of 323 (525291)
09-22-2009 8:30 PM
Reply to: Message 135 by Archangel
09-22-2009 2:19 PM


Re: "True" science and other evolution fantasies:
The trick is to find unbiased sources which are interested in pure science no matter where it takes them.
Creationists are interested in science; they are interested in destroying it.
The last thing they want is for science to come up with conclusions showing their religious beliefs are unsupported by empirical data.
Your false dichotomy of "true" science vs. "false" science is but one example of the anti-science attitude of many creationists.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 135 by Archangel, posted 09-22-2009 2:19 PM Archangel has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 153 by Archangel, posted 09-22-2009 8:58 PM Coyote has replied

  
Archangel
Member (Idle past 1358 days)
Posts: 134
Joined: 09-09-2009


Message 152 of 323 (525297)
09-22-2009 8:38 PM
Reply to: Message 150 by Dr Adequate
09-22-2009 8:18 PM


define reprobate, then think introspectively
DA writes:
Are you two having a competition to see who can be the most flagrantly wrong?
Evolution is supported by the evidence, as has been proved by a century and a half of biological research, and of course anyone here will discuss this proposition with you.
Why you wish to pretend otherwise is mystifying.
More judgmental criticisms and drivel from the peanut gallery as he offers no evidence at all to the debate. If incessant insistence that you are right was worth anything, you would have won this debate long ago. But alas, all we have is empty lip service...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 150 by Dr Adequate, posted 09-22-2009 8:18 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 154 by RAZD, posted 09-22-2009 8:58 PM Archangel has not replied
 Message 156 by Dr Adequate, posted 09-22-2009 9:25 PM Archangel has not replied

  
Archangel
Member (Idle past 1358 days)
Posts: 134
Joined: 09-09-2009


Message 153 of 323 (525302)
09-22-2009 8:58 PM
Reply to: Message 151 by Coyote
09-22-2009 8:30 PM


Re: "True" science and other evolution fantasies:
Coyote writes:
Creationists are interested in science; they are interested in destroying it.
The last thing they want is for science to come up with conclusions showing their religious beliefs are unsupported by empirical data.
Your false dichotomy of "true" science vs. "false" science is but one example of the anti-science attitude of many creationists.
Once again you generalize my rejection of evolution science as a rejection of all science so I must again preempt my response by correcting your misrepresentation of my views. With that said, here's a reality check which goes against everything you believe, but is true anyway. IF EVOLUTION WAS A TRUE SCIENCE THAT WAS TRULY SUPPORTED BY SCIENTIFIC FACT, THEN IT WOULDN'T CONFLICT WITH THE GENESIS ACCOUNT. AND IF IT DIDN'T CONFLICT WITH THE GENESIS ACCOUNT, WE WOULDN'T BE ON OPPOSING SIDES AT ALL.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 151 by Coyote, posted 09-22-2009 8:30 PM Coyote has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 155 by Dr Adequate, posted 09-22-2009 9:22 PM Archangel has not replied
 Message 157 by hooah212002, posted 09-22-2009 9:28 PM Archangel has not replied
 Message 159 by Coyote, posted 09-22-2009 9:42 PM Archangel has not replied
 Message 161 by obvious Child, posted 09-22-2009 9:56 PM Archangel has not replied
 Message 163 by Tanndarr, posted 09-22-2009 11:14 PM Archangel has replied
 Message 170 by PaulK, posted 09-23-2009 1:42 AM Archangel has not replied
 Message 171 by Huntard, posted 09-23-2009 1:51 AM Archangel has not replied
 Message 172 by Parasomnium, posted 09-23-2009 3:14 AM Archangel has not replied
 Message 173 by greyseal, posted 09-23-2009 5:25 AM Archangel has not replied
 Message 176 by dokukaeru, posted 09-23-2009 8:38 AM Archangel has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 154 of 323 (525303)
09-22-2009 8:58 PM
Reply to: Message 152 by Archangel
09-22-2009 8:38 PM


Re: define reprobate, then think introspectively
Hi Archangel,
More judgmental criticisms and drivel from the peanut gallery as he offers no evidence at all to the debate. If incessant insistence that you are right was worth anything, you would have won this debate long ago. But alas, all we have is empty lip service...
ROFLOL. The irony is killing me.
Curiously, you have failed to answer:
Message 64 which deconstructs your opening post with factual evidence, showing that your website was an example of creationist fraud rather than documenting any fraud by evolutionary scientists.
Message 96 which deals with your continued failure to acknowledge that this website does not support your thesis because it is false. Rather than demonstrate that evolutionary scientists have committed frauds and hoaxes, you have demonstrated that creationist websites post false information. You can't use a falsehood to prove a truth.
Message 124 which deals with your false analogy of science and engineering, and your false assertions of how good science is done.
These are just the posts on this one thread where you have posted judgmental criticisms and drivel instead of replies, and offer no evidence at all to back up you position once refuted.
I can document more, but you are not interested in reality, as you have ignored all evidence contrary to your pet beliefs. Your absolute failure to deal with foraminifera or age correlations show you are not interested in understanding reality.
If incessant insistence that you are right was worth anything, you would have won this debate long ago. But alas, all we have is empty lip service...
Indeed, and that is why I find it worthless to read your posts or debate with you further. There is no value added.
Enjoy.

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel American Zen Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


• • • Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click) • • •

This message is a reply to:
 Message 152 by Archangel, posted 09-22-2009 8:38 PM Archangel has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 285 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 155 of 323 (525306)
09-22-2009 9:22 PM
Reply to: Message 153 by Archangel
09-22-2009 8:58 PM


Re: "True" science and other creationist drivel
IF EVOLUTION WAS A TRUE SCIENCE THAT WAS TRULY SUPPORTED BY SCIENTIFIC FACT, THEN IT WOULDN'T CONFLICT WITH THE GENESIS ACCOUNT.
Ah, so you identify "true science" by checking to see if it's in accordance with your religious beliefs.
See, I identify true science by checking to see if it's in accordance with the evidence.
These two very different epistemological methods are why we will never be in agreement, since, of course, your chosen religious beliefs are not in accordance with the evidence.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 153 by Archangel, posted 09-22-2009 8:58 PM Archangel has not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 285 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 156 of 323 (525307)
09-22-2009 9:25 PM
Reply to: Message 152 by Archangel
09-22-2009 8:38 PM


Re: define reprobate, then think introspectively
More judgmental criticisms and drivel from the peanut gallery as he offers no evidence at all to the debate. If incessant insistence that you are right was worth anything, you would have won this debate long ago. But alas, all we have is empty lip service...
Instead of whining about me, do you think you could produce a scrap of a shred of a scintilla of evidence to support the rubbish in your OP?
... I guess whining about me is easier.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 152 by Archangel, posted 09-22-2009 8:38 PM Archangel has not replied

  
hooah212002
Member (Idle past 802 days)
Posts: 3193
Joined: 08-12-2009


Message 157 of 323 (525309)
09-22-2009 9:28 PM
Reply to: Message 153 by Archangel
09-22-2009 8:58 PM


Re: "True" science and other evolution fantasies:
IF EVOLUTION WAS A TRUE SCIENCE THAT WAS TRULY SUPPORTED BY SCIENTIFIC FACT, THEN IT WOULDN'T CONFLICT WITH THE GENESIS ACCOUNT.
Glad we finally have your definition of "false science". Anything that does not agree with the genesis account, is not "real science.
Well, that's a solid foundation. I just hope you, or anyone you care about, is never involved in a trial where DNA is required for evidence. You would have to reject it, yes?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 153 by Archangel, posted 09-22-2009 8:58 PM Archangel has not replied

  
hooah212002
Member (Idle past 802 days)
Posts: 3193
Joined: 08-12-2009


Message 158 of 323 (525310)
09-22-2009 9:35 PM


Lets just point out here where paleogeneticists ADMITTED they had made some mistakes in the early stages of the field, where present day DNA were intermixed with DNA found. What did they do? Did they stick with the false positives and tell the public, while keeping secret the mistakes they made? No. They modified the science in order to maintain its integrity. Whereas, sites like creation.com continue to use finds that science itself has refuted and ADMITTED mistake.
It is you, and your ilk that are the fraudsters, dear sir.
Edited by hooah212002, : clarification

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2106 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 159 of 323 (525311)
09-22-2009 9:42 PM
Reply to: Message 153 by Archangel
09-22-2009 8:58 PM


Re: "True" science and other evolution fantasies:
IF EVOLUTION WAS A TRUE SCIENCE THAT WAS TRULY SUPPORTED BY SCIENTIFIC FACT, THEN IT WOULDN'T CONFLICT WITH THE GENESIS ACCOUNT.
Nonsense. Lots of things are "true" and conflict with genesis. The flood and an old earth are two examples. Just because you believe it doesn't make it true. Empirical evidence is not on your side.
AND IF IT DIDN'T CONFLICT WITH THE GENESIS ACCOUNT, WE WOULDN'T BE ON OPPOSING SIDES AT ALL.
That's the rub, right there. You are not looking at empirical evidence, you are accepting religious beliefs and seeking to justify them any way you can, even it it means destroying science to remove that pesky evidence and those inconvenient interpretations.
You choose "divine" revelation and scripture over empirical evidence and you don't want to be called anti-science? What a joke!
But this is off-topic. I'm still waiting for all those frauds you were going to round up for us. You're not doing very well there, now are you?

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 153 by Archangel, posted 09-22-2009 8:58 PM Archangel has not replied

  
obvious Child
Member (Idle past 4116 days)
Posts: 661
Joined: 08-17-2006


Message 160 of 323 (525314)
09-22-2009 9:54 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by Archangel
09-22-2009 2:26 PM


You do realize that people can click on your name and see just how many posts you haven't replied to? And your name has an exorbitantly long list of posts you've not replied to. It appears you are the one ignoring the claims, not the other way around.
You have yet to show how such alleged "frauds" prove your point. In fact, you haven't even cited a single instance of fraud yet.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Archangel, posted 09-22-2009 2:26 PM Archangel has not replied

  
obvious Child
Member (Idle past 4116 days)
Posts: 661
Joined: 08-17-2006


Message 161 of 323 (525315)
09-22-2009 9:56 PM
Reply to: Message 153 by Archangel
09-22-2009 8:58 PM


Re: "True" science and other evolution fantasies:
quote:
IF EVOLUTION WAS A TRUE SCIENCE THAT WAS TRULY SUPPORTED BY SCIENTIFIC FACT, THEN IT WOULDN'T CONFLICT WITH THE GENESIS ACCOUNT.
For what reason? Evolution is a fact due to the large number of tangible products derived from its sciences. We had this discussion before where you ended up throwing huge numbers of vile insults and refusing to address the point.
You have yet to prove that the Genesis account in your interpretation is true.
Btw, how can science gel with magic?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 153 by Archangel, posted 09-22-2009 8:58 PM Archangel has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 162 by dwise1, posted 09-22-2009 10:09 PM obvious Child has not replied

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


Message 162 of 323 (525317)
09-22-2009 10:09 PM
Reply to: Message 161 by obvious Child
09-22-2009 9:56 PM


Re: "True" science and other evolution fantasies:
quote:
IF EVOLUTION WAS A TRUE SCIENCE THAT WAS TRULY SUPPORTED BY SCIENTIFIC FACT, THEN IT WOULDN'T CONFLICT WITH THE GENESIS ACCOUNT.
  —ArchAngel
For what reason?
Turns out that "true science" is a fundamentalist buzzword whose contrived definition is "science that does not conflict with the Bible." Like their "creation science", it has nothing at all to do with science and only serves to deceive ... mainly themselves.
I first encountered it, with the exact same contrived definition, during my initial exposure to fundamentalism through the "Jesus Freak" movement back around 1970. So it might even predate 40 years ago.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 161 by obvious Child, posted 09-22-2009 9:56 PM obvious Child has not replied

  
Tanndarr
Member (Idle past 5183 days)
Posts: 68
Joined: 02-14-2008


Message 163 of 323 (525325)
09-22-2009 11:14 PM
Reply to: Message 153 by Archangel
09-22-2009 8:58 PM


Holy Mary mother of god in a sidecar with chocolate jimmies and a lobster bib!
With that said, here's a reality check which goes against everything you believe, but is true anyway. IF EVOLUTION WAS A TRUE SCIENCE THAT WAS TRULY SUPPORTED BY SCIENTIFIC FACT, THEN IT WOULDN'T CONFLICT WITH THE GENESIS ACCOUNT. AND IF IT DIDN'T CONFLICT WITH THE GENESIS ACCOUNT, WE WOULDN'T BE ON OPPOSING SIDES AT ALL.
To think that I actually wasted precious moments trying to reason with you and this is the best you can do in response. Face it, you're in flat-out denial of reality and hiding behind your interpretation of your personal holy book.
Let me remind you that you are the one that says scientists fraudulently deny reality and here you admit that your whole world-view only includes the things you read in your bible.
J'accuse!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 153 by Archangel, posted 09-22-2009 8:58 PM Archangel has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 165 by Archangel, posted 09-23-2009 12:01 AM Tanndarr has not replied

  
Archangel
Member (Idle past 1358 days)
Posts: 134
Joined: 09-09-2009


Message 164 of 323 (525329)
09-22-2009 11:57 PM


EVOLUTION'S FRAUD HAS CONTRIBUTED TO ITS PUBLIC ACCEPTANCE:
WOW, the sanctimony exhibited by you pseudo intellectuals as you repeatedly insist how right you are at a rate of your 116 combined posts to my 30. Here are all of my arguments in all of my posts which most have yet to be responded to with any substance at all, or rational evidence that anything you defend regarding evolution is based in a solid foundation of proven evidence. And if the foundation is faulty, then so is the house which is built upon it.
Unless you're ready to produce this overwhelming evidence that spontaneous life appeared magically around 3.5 billion years ago leading to common descent and all of the crap that follows that term. Also, no comment on the Miller video questions I asked? No interest in defending that experiment which is held up as the best evidence of spontaneous life appearing from non life? Even when I give you the experiment which your most fevered proponents hold up proudly as evidence, you refuse to comment in defense of it by answering my very valid and common sense questions.
All I get in response are 10 or 12 more angry and insulting posts which attempt to change the subject by insulting me, and more of your inane obfuscations. So here you go, I proudly repost the links to my posts in case anyone garners the nerve to actually respond to them ON POINT. EvC Forum: EVOLUTION'S FRAUD HAS CONTRIBUTED TO ITS PUBLIC ACCEPTANCE:
And here's the link to the evidence in my OP's post in case anyone wants to respond to any of the examples of fraud it documents and actually get back on topic. Take your pick from the many examples of fraud it outlines. Evolution Fraud and Myths

Replies to this message:
 Message 168 by Dr Adequate, posted 09-23-2009 12:46 AM Archangel has not replied
 Message 194 by Granny Magda, posted 09-23-2009 2:03 PM Archangel has not replied

  
Archangel
Member (Idle past 1358 days)
Posts: 134
Joined: 09-09-2009


Message 165 of 323 (525330)
09-23-2009 12:01 AM
Reply to: Message 163 by Tanndarr
09-22-2009 11:14 PM


Re: Holy Mary mother of god in a sidecar with chocolate jimmies and a lobster bib!
Tanndarr writes:
To think that I actually wasted precious moments trying to reason with you and this is the best you can do in response. Face it, you're in flat-out denial of reality and hiding behind your interpretation of your personal holy book.
Let me remind you that you are the one that says scientists fraudulently deny reality and here you admit that your whole world-view only includes the things you read in your bible.
But wont you and all of your secular humanist defenders of evolution be sorely and sadly shocked on that final day when you inevitably learn how right we were and how absolutely wrong you were as you believed evolutions lies just as I am warning you about.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 163 by Tanndarr, posted 09-22-2009 11:14 PM Tanndarr has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 166 by bluescat48, posted 09-23-2009 12:10 AM Archangel has not replied
 Message 167 by Dr Adequate, posted 09-23-2009 12:43 AM Archangel has not replied
 Message 169 by Coyote, posted 09-23-2009 12:53 AM Archangel has not replied
 Message 174 by dokukaeru, posted 09-23-2009 8:24 AM Archangel has not replied
 Message 175 by dokukaeru, posted 09-23-2009 8:34 AM Archangel has not replied

  
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