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Author Topic:   A Modern Day Miracle Man - Establishes the Supernatural Realm
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 19 of 297 (525711)
09-24-2009 11:00 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Cedre
09-24-2009 5:09 AM


I can heal people just by touching them and speaking the name of their affliction 15 times. 100s of people have seen me do this, and if you just ask them, they will tell you it's true. One such person was Bill Bardum of Madison, WI. He had an inoperable brain tumor, and doctors had given him less than a week. In desperation, his daughter told me to come see him, and despite Bill's scepticism, I was able to heal him. His next medical appointment surprised all of the doctors, they couldn't explain his miraculous healing, ascribing it to some type of spontaneous remission, but he called me that day to thank me, he knew what had really happened.
I can also make predictions. Just last week, I asked everyone who knows me to try and help me stem the tide of a massive dust storm I knew was going to hit Sydney. I got a group of 132 people together and we all chanted "Sydney, dust storm" 15 times. The dust storm happened just as I predicted, but we were able to amke sure no one died in it.
Now, to prove to you doubters out there, I will give you a new prediction I received this morning. On Saturday, many will die as the result of a large natural disaster, this time by water instead of dust. I will do all I can to prevent it, but I fear it's too strong even for me, but if you can send me a small donation so I can rent out the local convention center so I can try and get as many people together as I can to chant, perhaps we can save these people!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Cedre, posted 09-24-2009 5:09 AM Cedre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by Cedre, posted 09-24-2009 11:06 AM Perdition has replied
 Message 32 by Larni, posted 09-24-2009 12:07 PM Perdition has replied

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 21 of 297 (525713)
09-24-2009 11:11 AM
Reply to: Message 20 by Cedre
09-24-2009 11:06 AM


Re: Quit messing around and deal with my points
such trusted sources as Wikipedia.
In general I trust Wikipedia, but you do realize that all it takes for someone to change a Wikipedia entry is...internet access, right? What makes Wikipedia a potentially good source is that people who actually know can gop in and fix things that are wrong, and that it asks for links to original sources. So, as have been asked for many times, what are the original sources? Otherwise, all you have is hearsay.
So, disprove my mystical abilities, I dare you. As I said, I've had hundreds of eye witnesses, do you think they're all lying?
{AbE} Besides, I said specifically, dust storm and Sydney. Do you know how often severe dust storms ravage Sydney? Not very often, especially one as bad as this. It's been 70 years since one was this bad, so the odds of me just picking it are slight.
Edited by Perdition, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by Cedre, posted 09-24-2009 11:06 AM Cedre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 22 by Cedre, posted 09-24-2009 11:17 AM Perdition has replied

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 25 of 297 (525721)
09-24-2009 11:38 AM
Reply to: Message 22 by Cedre
09-24-2009 11:17 AM


Re: Quit messing around and deal with my points
Oh, so if I got people together, filmed them chanting, and had each of them say they had seen me do these things, then you'd believe me? Give me about a week and I can have that for you. I can also make a Wikipedia entry on myself and have it claim all that I've said and more. Again, if you wait about a week, I can have it for you. If I have that, will you suddenly believe me?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 22 by Cedre, posted 09-24-2009 11:17 AM Cedre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 26 by Cedre, posted 09-24-2009 11:43 AM Perdition has replied

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 28 of 297 (525725)
09-24-2009 11:50 AM
Reply to: Message 26 by Cedre
09-24-2009 11:43 AM


Re: Quit messing around and deal with my points
Not necessarily. I'm suggesting that a core group of fraudsters can very easily make people believe what they want them to believe. It's happened before, it will happen again. In fact, many people make a living doing just that, both legally and illegally.
This si why eye-witness testimony is considered one of the worst forms of evidence. People misremember, they can be manipulated, they can be deceived. For me to believe this, I would need scientific evidence, such as a doctor going with an unhealthy patient, standing there watching the procedure, and then examining the patient. Preferrably, I would like the doctor to be picked by myself, or at leats by someone I trust to find an impartial doctor.
Once that happens, I would expect the doctor to write up the amazing evidence she/he has just witnessed and documented, publish in a peer-reviewed article, and get a Nobel Prize...probably shared with the "prophet" since he did the work.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 26 by Cedre, posted 09-24-2009 11:43 AM Cedre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 30 by Cedre, posted 09-24-2009 11:59 AM Perdition has replied

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 33 of 297 (525732)
09-24-2009 12:11 PM
Reply to: Message 30 by Cedre
09-24-2009 11:59 AM


Re: Quit messing around and deal with my points
but so far all are failed missions.
So? There are many who want to see Christianity's downfall. There are many others who want to see Islam's downfall. Since at least one of these religions has to be wrong, the fact that someone hasn't "brought them down" cannot be proof that they're right, now can it?
Since I've never heard of this guy or this church, it hasn't received very much media over here, thus I'm sure there aren't too many concerted, scientific investigations of it. I wonder if the "prophet" would let an impartial scientist investigate his claims...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 30 by Cedre, posted 09-24-2009 11:59 AM Cedre has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 47 by Theodoric, posted 09-24-2009 2:13 PM Perdition has not replied

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 34 of 297 (525733)
09-24-2009 12:13 PM
Reply to: Message 32 by Larni
09-24-2009 12:07 PM


Well, for obvious reasons, I don't want to be inundated with sick people, I'd not have time to do all my other important, mystical things. Why don't you just tell me your bank account and password, and let me know how much you want to donate, and I'll take care of it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by Larni, posted 09-24-2009 12:07 PM Larni has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 36 by Larni, posted 09-24-2009 12:23 PM Perdition has not replied

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 40 of 297 (525747)
09-24-2009 1:17 PM
Reply to: Message 39 by Cedre
09-24-2009 1:09 PM


Re: An honest look at the evidence
But you have to admit that, at best, he was vague on the when, where and who. He could be fairly certain that on some Friday, a plane with a family on it will crash. Once it happens, he can claim it as a verified prophecy.
If he knew precisely who it would be, why would he not try to warn the family to save them from crashing? It seems incredibly heartless to see something like that and do nothing to try and stop it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 39 by Cedre, posted 09-24-2009 1:09 PM Cedre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 41 by Cedre, posted 09-24-2009 1:22 PM Perdition has not replied

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 128 of 297 (526021)
09-25-2009 2:25 PM
Reply to: Message 78 by Cedre
09-25-2009 6:27 AM


Had anyone that heard his prophecy been scheduled to be on any of those flights, and did they get bumped for some reason? Were any of the people who were in the crashes aware of the prophecy? If not, then it seems like all he did was make a vague prediction that an air crash would occur during the end of the month. Do you know how many air crashes occur during a month? Do you know how many occur during the last half of the month of January?
If I say, "Be careful if you're flying during the beginning of the month of October, between 1, 5, 16, any of the days from 1 to 16, for if you shall be on a flight during that time and it crashes, if you be righteous, you shall not be hurt."
Does that sound specific enough for you to match what he said? Would you like to place a wager on whether an air accident will happen, or maybe even many, during that time?
Both of these prophecies you have copied have been vague to the point of uselessness. One says a jet will crash on a Friday with a family on board. What do YOU think are the odds of that happening? I think they're very high, you seem to disagree with that. Why?
The second says an air accident will occur during the last half of the month of January, and it even allows a military helicopter crash to count as fulfillment. It doesn't say where, it doesn't say what type of air craft. Do you know how many craft are in the air at one time? So, again, what do you think are the odds that at least one accident involving an aircraft will occur during the last half of a month are? I think they're very high, you seem to disagree with that. Why?
What he is doing is making a prophecy that is incredibly likely to happen, and then claiming fulfillment of that prophecy when that very likely thing happens, even if the implications of his prophecy are not met. In the firts oine, as PaulK is arguing, it was implied that the incident would be on the 24th, they weren't. In this one, it implied that someone who was at his little get-together (or at least someone who was aware of the prophecy) would be on the plane, or would be scheduled to be on it but get bumped for some reason. I didn't see any reason to think this is so, so it seems another implication of his prophecy failed, but he will ignore that since he can claim he never actually said that.
You're a very credulous person when it comes to things that already agree with your beliefs. I'm a very incredulous person, even if it seems to agree with my beliefs. That's where we differ.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 78 by Cedre, posted 09-25-2009 6:27 AM Cedre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 136 by Cedre, posted 09-26-2009 6:37 AM Perdition has replied

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 196 of 297 (526603)
09-28-2009 3:01 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by Cedre
09-26-2009 6:37 AM


Not a lot, plane crashes do not happen every month end or even every month, your argument is a desperate attempt to keep your Godless world view alive. This man gave exact dates, exact dates, that impossible. He did something humanely impossible.
Plane crashes happen every month, in fact, if you include helicopters and military vehicles (as TB does) then they happen close to every week. My cousin is in Iraq, so his mother, my Aunt, pays very close attention to news of mimlitary deaths over there. I also get the news on the TV, internet, and radio. I hear of helicopter crashes in Iraq all the time.
Come on, this is poles apart from your prediction that leaves a huge vacuum for accidents to happen, but what would make your prediction incredible is if successive accidents suddenly starts to occur exactly on the 17th and abruptly ends on the 28th, that would be a real prophecy. And that's what TB Joshua has done. You need to deal with this matters instead of brushing it off, in fact its impossible to brush it off due to the accuracy of the prophecies and its mentioning of exact dates.
I gave exact dates as well. Let's just wait and see what happens when October starts, shall we? If I can show you aircraft crashes on the dates I mentioned, will you agree that this type of prophecy is easy to fake?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Cedre, posted 09-26-2009 6:37 AM Cedre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 200 by Cedre, posted 09-29-2009 6:11 AM Perdition has not replied

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 203 of 297 (526784)
09-29-2009 9:55 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Cedre
09-24-2009 5:09 AM


Proof of my powers
As you'll recall, I replied to your first post with a prediction stating:
Perdition writes:
On Saturday, many will die as the result of a large natural disaster, this time by water instead of dust.
And lo and behold, what happens?
The AP writes:
Ketsana, which scythed across the northern Philippines on Saturday, dumped more than a month's worth of rain in just 12 hours, causing the country's worst flooding in 40 years...
The homes of nearly 1.9 million people in the capital and surrounding areas were inundated by flooding unleashed by Ketsana at the weekend, the National Disaster Coordinating Council said. Nearly 380,000 people have sought shelter in schools, churches and other evacuation centers.
The council said 246 were confirmed dead late Tuesday, with 38 missing.
Linky
How's that for my predictive abilities?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Cedre, posted 09-24-2009 5:09 AM Cedre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 204 by Huntard, posted 09-29-2009 9:58 AM Perdition has not replied
 Message 206 by Cedre, posted 09-29-2009 10:04 AM Perdition has replied
 Message 211 by Modulous, posted 09-29-2009 10:58 AM Perdition has not replied
 Message 215 by Larni, posted 09-29-2009 1:14 PM Perdition has replied

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 213 of 297 (526861)
09-29-2009 12:52 PM
Reply to: Message 206 by Cedre
09-29-2009 10:04 AM


Re: Proof of my powers
To be perfectly candid, I did no such thing. I hadn't heard or seen any meteorological things at all, I merely picked a date and made it vague enough that if nothing happened this Saturday, I would just have to wait until a Saturday came along where it did. The fact that it ended up happening this Saturday is just a coincidence...one of those things that happens every minute of every day despite being incredibly improbable in that exact sequence.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 206 by Cedre, posted 09-29-2009 10:04 AM Cedre has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 216 by Huntard, posted 09-29-2009 1:19 PM Perdition has replied

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 217 of 297 (526898)
09-29-2009 2:59 PM
Reply to: Message 215 by Larni
09-29-2009 1:14 PM


Re: Proof of my powers
The man wearing white will pick the winner. Listen as he speaks and do as he does and ye shall be victorious.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 215 by Larni, posted 09-29-2009 1:14 PM Larni has not replied

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 218 of 297 (526899)
09-29-2009 3:01 PM
Reply to: Message 216 by Huntard
09-29-2009 1:19 PM


Re: Proof of my powers
I'm not being modest at all, I'm merely letting Cedre know that I neither looked at the meteorlogical data, nor did I care about it. My prophecy was a slam dunk and no amount of data need sway my predicitve capabilities.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 216 by Huntard, posted 09-29-2009 1:19 PM Huntard has not replied

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 270 of 297 (527157)
09-30-2009 11:48 AM
Reply to: Message 239 by Cedre
09-30-2009 6:26 AM


Re: Desperate atheist resorting to desperate measures
Perditions prediction is based on a weather forecast.
You keep claiming this, and in all honesty, I DID NOT LOOK AT A WEATHER FORECAST! I DIDN'T NEED TO! I made a vague prediction that had no possibility of being wrong...just as TB Joshua does. He made a vague prediction: a plane crash with a family on a Friday. He didn't say what plane, he didn't say what family, he didn't even say exactly when. Just as I said, water, many deaths and Saturday. It was pure happenstance that the very next Saturday, a typhoon hits the Phillipines and people died. I DIDN'T PREDICT THE TYPHOON, I PREDICTED A "WATERY DEATH". This could have been a typhoon, a hurricane, a tidal wave, flash flooding, a public swimming pool accident, etc.
I have also made a prediction like TB Joshua's multiple plane crash one, complete with specific dates. If I'm right, I'll start tomorrow (or Friday) by telling you of the first of the aircraft disasters I "predicted."
TB Joshua is a charlatan, making vague but somehow specific-sounding predictions, then when something that fits his prediction happens, claiming it as proof of his prediction. What we're all doing here is showing that it doesn't take prophetic powers to make those predictions, all it takes is a knowledge of the probability of things happening, a gullible audience and a charismatic speaker. People will fill in the blanks on their own and viola, we have people proclaiming a new prophet.
What would convice me is a detail for detail prediction: place, time, names, complete circumstances, and a minute-by-minute play-by-play account of the actions...and I would like those to be made at a time obviously before the actual event. For example, write down the events, mail them to yourself (to get the date stamp), then open them live, completely naked, in a gymanasium filled with skeptics, magicians, illusionists and camers covering every angle.
At that point, I might give it a 55% probability of being genuine. Until then, it's just way too easy to fake.
Edited by Perdition, : clarity
Edited by Perdition, : clarity, again
Edited by Perdition, : last time

This message is a reply to:
 Message 239 by Cedre, posted 09-30-2009 6:26 AM Cedre has not replied

  
Perdition
Member (Idle past 3238 days)
Posts: 1593
From: Wisconsin
Joined: 05-15-2003


Message 271 of 297 (527161)
09-30-2009 12:04 PM
Reply to: Message 266 by Modulous
09-30-2009 10:40 AM


Re: common tricks or genuine miracles?
Did you ever see Derren Brown's work?
A couple of the shows he's done have made it across the pond (or he may have come and done some here, not sure which) but it's freaky what he can do. I would love to know what he does,with that kind of POWER I COULD TAKE OV...um, I mean, yeah, it's very impressive {cough}
Seriously, though, I'm in total awe of him...even Kris Angel can do some weird, freaky things, and he's a douche.
Edited by Perdition, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 266 by Modulous, posted 09-30-2009 10:40 AM Modulous has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 278 by Larni, posted 10-01-2009 5:44 AM Perdition has not replied

  
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