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Author Topic:   How many churches are necessary?
slevesque
Member (Idle past 4641 days)
Posts: 1456
Joined: 05-14-2009


Message 3 of 65 (540377)
12-24-2009 2:33 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by hooah212002
12-22-2009 3:45 PM


Ok so since nobody is paying attention to your thread, I'll help you.
I'll start by saying that this is very impressive. That many churches in a town of 8000 ????
I live in a town of 25 000 and we have one church (+ a lot of empty catholic churches.) And there are maybe 7-8 churches overall in my region of 225 000 people.
What I am asking myself is is your situation the norm in america ?
And also, does it really change anything at all ? I mean, the muslims are all unified in their doctrinal beliefs and I don't think you give them any more or less possibility of having the truth then the christians ...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by hooah212002, posted 12-22-2009 3:45 PM hooah212002 has replied

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 Message 4 by hooah212002, posted 12-24-2009 2:41 PM slevesque has replied

  
slevesque
Member (Idle past 4641 days)
Posts: 1456
Joined: 05-14-2009


Message 5 of 65 (540391)
12-24-2009 3:57 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by hooah212002
12-24-2009 2:41 PM


What should it change?
Well, isn't the implied question of your OP ''If the Bible is true, why are their so many different denominations about what it says ?''
Hence my question; Does it change anything at all ? If the truth of the Bible (or any religious book)) relies on how many different doctrinal opinions about it, then I guess the Bible is near the very bottom, and the Quran at the very top.
But of course, my opinion is that it does not change anything. Their could be a gazillion different opinions about the Bible, and it could still be true. And their could be only one concensus and still be wrong.
Are you certain about that? I think you may want to brush up on your knowledge of Islam. Or are you saying ALL muslims are radical fanatics like the ones blowing themselves up for Allah?
That's why I specified doctrinal beliefs, and not solely beliefs. Muslims all have pretty much the same doctrinal beliefs, but they apply them differently.
It is a bit similar then the christians who say:''Yess the Bible teaches against homosexual practice, but it was in a different culture and since the culture changed, so should the Bible's teaching about homosexuality''. They agree on what the Bible doctrinally teaches, but decide not to apply it.
Same thing happens for liberal muslims, but on a bigger scale. They agree on what the Quran teaches doctrinally, but decide not to apply it because ''the society has evolved''.
Of course, this is a big generalization on my part, and there may be exceptions to this. Or I could be wrong about liberal muslims (I don't live in a muslim neighbourhood either).

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by hooah212002, posted 12-24-2009 2:41 PM hooah212002 has replied

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 Message 6 by hooah212002, posted 12-24-2009 4:12 PM slevesque has replied

  
slevesque
Member (Idle past 4641 days)
Posts: 1456
Joined: 05-14-2009


Message 7 of 65 (540398)
12-24-2009 4:31 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by hooah212002
12-24-2009 4:12 PM


If you say so. I am not very versed in the different readings of the Quran, but I don't think ALL muslims read it the same. Are you saying ALL muslims are extremists?
I think they all believe in the same doctrines, but they don't all apply them for diverse reasons (such as society has evolved, etc.)
But I can say that the muslim religion is much, much, much more unified then the christians. And even if their were 2 or 3 different iinterpretations of the Quran, I wouldn't consider that a lot considering they are over a billion believers if I remember correctly.
But each denomonation say there version is "the truth". Theydon't say "well, this is MY opinion on what the bible means".
...
This is pretty much my point. christianity does the same thing. All the while each group drilling home that what that particular group teaches is "THE truth".
Well I don't know to what extent you consider someone a christian. Are jehovah's witness part of it in your opinion ? Or Mormons ?
Because those two, for example, don't have the same Bible. They have a whole different traduction of it. So well it's normal that they don't interpret it the same way, since it isn't the same book.
But I think there is a bit of a bad suppositions about the Bible, which is that it should be easy to read, and that it's teaching should be ever so obvious to everyone. But it isn't really that easy.
I mean, the core message is pretty easy and straightforward, and I think many churches all interpret it the same way (I would hope all). I'm talking about the whole salvation, sin etc, and Jesus dying for us etc.
But some other thing are quite complicated. And although they are sometimes very minor things, this is where christians tend to gather with those who think the same.
If the bible is open for opinion, that opens the door to question god's meaning. Is that what you are implying?
There is one biblical truth, in other words, the author had one meaning in mind when writing it. But that doesn't stop people from having different opinions.
It a bit like a fossilized bone. One bone, but people can still have two, three or more theories about it's history. That doesn't hange the fact that there is only one actual history to the bone.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by hooah212002, posted 12-24-2009 4:12 PM hooah212002 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by hooah212002, posted 12-24-2009 4:51 PM slevesque has replied

  
slevesque
Member (Idle past 4641 days)
Posts: 1456
Joined: 05-14-2009


Message 12 of 65 (540568)
12-26-2009 11:36 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by hooah212002
12-24-2009 4:51 PM


Sorry couldn't answer earlier.
So who (besides this god fella, of course) gets to decide who are the real christians? You and iano both seem to be in this same crowd of deciding who gets to be a "real" christian and who's not.
That wasn't really what I wanted to say. I was just asking who you considered when using the word ''christian'' ... If you included jehovah's witness, then I would consider them in my answer. Same for Mormons, etc
but alot of the time, they are BIG details. Such as the trinity. It's kind of a big deal what forms YOUR god takes, isn't it? is jesus just a man? Is he god? is he god's son? Almost all of you say something different. ICANT has a different take on creationism than damn near the lot of you. Some say 6 literal days, some says 6 figurative days.
Well I said sometimes easy, sometimes minor. This doesn't mean there are big issues that are difficult to resolve. The trinity is one such thing.
And of course, on creation, there are a gazillion new interpretation since the last 100 years. BUt before that, there was one interpretation (the literal day one) and pretty much everyone interpreted it this way. (Even St-Augustine which was a bit excentric in his view of genesis still did believe in 24-hour days)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by hooah212002, posted 12-24-2009 4:51 PM hooah212002 has seen this message but not replied

  
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