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Junior Member (Idle past 5153 days) Posts: 24 From: Chorley, Lancs, UK Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Speed of Light | |||||||||||||||||||||||
Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
Hi Bolder-dash,
You and Viv are going to be hearing from me more and more frequently if you cannot refrain from editorializing about the people you're discussing with. There is a Peanut Gallery thread and a Coffee House forum where that would be more appropriate. I believe that this thread would be much more productive if Viv could resist the urge to take shots at everyone else, for example, about how frightened they are to consider anything new. We all love the novelty of new ideas, and Nobel prizes spring from new ideas. Viv's task is to muster the evidence and arguments for successfully promoting his views, and that definitely is not about "giving 'em hell". Give 'em evidence, and if the evidence supports the views then they'll think it's hell. What I see from Viv is a great deal of self-praise combined with pompous denigration of anyone who disagrees with him, and his explanations almost always fall far short of anything useful. My criteria for a successful explanation is one that I could use to convince someone else. So far all Viv has provided here that I understand and could explain to others is how mistreated he is, and that's not the topic of this thread. Viv has the additional problem of exhibiting the grandiose behavior of the delusional, such as claiming his ideas solve some of the most stubborn problems in physics today, like harmonizing relativity and quantum theory. Let me conclude by providing the specific guidelines that Viv has been having significant problems with, just so there's no confusion. Notice that they have nothing to do with anyone's personal position on any issue:
You ran afoul of rule 10. Digressions are inevitable in any thread, but digressions to engage in attaboys for someone already violating three guidelines, and combined with yet more discussion of the participants rather than the topic, was a bit over the top. See you in a few hours.
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Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
Hi Viv,
I'm not a participant in the discussion, so you shouldn't be directing replies to me. If you have issues or problems regarding discussion or moderation then please take them to the Report discussion problems here: No.2 thread. Long experience has taught us that discussion of moderation issues isn't very often productive. EvC Forum's position on such issues is that those with viable positions or ideas will keep their attention focused on evidence and rational arguments, so my suggestion is that you do that. If you would like to discuss the meta-issues you keep trying to introduce into the discussion, such as hostility or fears you think are being exhibited by your co-participants, then begin a new thread over at the Coffee House forum and discuss them there to your heart's content. Raising them again in this thread will bring 24 hour suspensions every time you do so (not this time, however, since you've just returned from suspension). In case this isn't clear, you are not being told you can't discuss such issues, because you most certainly can. But you can't discuss them anywhere you please, because in most threads it would be off-topic. You should take such issues to a thread where they would be on-topic, and the easiest way to do that would be to initiate this thread yourself. Many here would love to better understand your ideas. If you'd like to discuss them then this is a great place to do that. If you only want to refer people to what you've written at other websites then you've already done that.
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Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
Hi Viv,
You seem to be having remarkable difficulty getting the hang of things around here.
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Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
Viv Pope writes: It looks as though I won't be allowed on this thread for long since the conclusion I was coming to on this question of ‘Lightspeed’ seems close to being disallowed. Just to clarify once again, nothing related to what is necessary for you to communicate your ideas in physics is being ruled off topic. What's off topic is discussion like this:
Viv Pope in Message 191 writes: Some people I’ve discussed this with are sceptical about the use of these forums altogether. They’re only playing games, says one , They’ll never understand you, says one colleague, They’ll make every excuse to ban you, says another. Another says: The only response you’ll get will be silly ‘Yah Boo!’ replies. and yet another colleague says: It will frighten them shirtless — or, at least, that’s what it sounded like. This is an example of one of the meta-topics that you keep trying to introduce into this discussion thread, and I will continue suspending you for 24 hours each time you attempt to do so. Take such issues to the Report discussion problems here: No.2 thread, or if you'd like to more tightly focus on your issues then open a new thread over at Suggestions and Questions. This isn't rocket science, Viv. This thread is for discussing ideas in physics related to the speed of light. If you'd like to discuss other things, take them to the appropriate threads. I happened to find this over at the Bad Astronomy Forum from a couple years ago. This is precisely the kind of thing we never want to see here:
Viv Pope at Bad Astronomy writes: But your wriggling is all too predictable, and this one was almost an epileptic fit! EvC Forum was founded as a place where contributions like these would not be allowed, and so we don't tolerate this kind of thing here. Clear? Please, no replies to this message in this thread.
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Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
To all,
Viv Pope is permitted to discuss any and all aspects of his ideas about the speed of light and their impact on physics as a science in this thread. If he decides to discontinue his participation here at EvC Forum then that is his choice.
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Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
Viv,
I don't understand what you're doing. You just said you were leaving, now you post again? To a message that specifically requests you not reply to it? The proper place for these kinds of discussions, as I keep telling you over and over and over again, is Report discussion problems here: No.2. To give you the necessary time for figuring this out I'm suspending you for 24 hours. If when your suspension expires tomorrow morning you decide you would like to continue discussion then be sure your posts are in the proper thread and focus on the topic. It's that simple.
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Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
Hi Viv,
Viv Pope writes: It's remarkable that you are allowed to get away with such personal insults to which I'm not allowed to respond. Of course you're allowed to respond. The place to do that is over at Report discussion problems here: No.2. I keep telling you to take your complaints there, but instead you keep complaining here. Such complaints are off-topic in this thread. Because you continue to be off-topic, and because you continue to fail to follow moderator requests (rule 1 in the Forum Guidelines, check 'em out some time), and because you became personal (rule 10), and because your violations are persistent, I'm suspending you for 48 hours this time. See you Wednesday.
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Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
No worries, Viv. I hope you have a long and productive stay here. We just have a few rules is all, guidelines for helping things run smoothly.
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Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
Hi Viv,
If you would like to discuss how opinions and attitudes are influenced by senior or authority figures then please propose a new thread over at Proposed New Topics.
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Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
Hi Viv,
You are not being asked to leave this thread. You are being asked to confine your discussion to the topic. You are not restricted to participation in a single thread. You can participate in as many threads simultaneously as you wish. You can discuss as many different topics at the same time as you like, but in each thread in which you choose to participate you will be requested to direct the majority of your attention to the topic of that thread. When discussing issues related to the speed of light, this is the correct thread for that topic. Other issues, such as how opinions and attitudes are influenced by senior or authority figures, or such as some of the issues you tried to bring up previously, such as that your ideas are rejected out of fear or lack of imagination, should be taken to threads where they would be on topic. If you cannot find a thread for topics you want to discuss, then propose a new topic over at Proposed New Topics. The Forum Guidelines at EvC Forum have been in place for many years. These are the first two rules, and the last one:
I cannot pretend that I have not had to repeat the request to stay on topic to you many times. Simple rules like these should be no problem for someone who understands quantum physics and cosmology, and so your apparent ongoing inability to understand and conform yourself to these rules can only be considered willful and purposeful. For me to simply continue repeating these rules to you would be to fail to recognize that something other than a lack of comprehension is behind your behavior, that you're doing it on purpose, and that you're apparently not going to stop. The bottom line is that you can either focus your attention in this thread on the topic, or you can be suspended every time you fail to do so. Any members who think they can make all this clear to Viv are invited to try to help me out by posting advice to him over at the Report discussion problems here: No.2 thread, but please keep it positive and impersonal. Please, no replies to this message in this thread.
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Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
Hi Viv,
It's still the Christmas/New Year's holiday break, so be patient when you're expecting replies. Don't let boredom prompt you to behavior that will force me to suspend you again. If you have a problem with Onifre's message from over 6 months ago then the proper place to report this problem is over at (and let me use larger text this time):
But I suspect you're referring not to the content of Onifre's message but to his signature, which has nothing to do with the topic of this discussion. People are given considerable latitude in their signatures, and there's nothing in the Forum Guidelines about language, but if you want to argue that it is too offensive then the place to take that complaint is (once again):
Please, no replies to this message in this thread. If you are having problems with discussion that you need to discuss with a moderator then please take them to (one more time):
In the spirit of the holiday season I'm not suspending you this time.
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Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
Hi Viv,
I'm seriously beginning to question your sincerity:
Viv Pope writes: However, there have been some journals which have taken the risk, such as GED (Galilean Electrodynamics), Physics Essays, the Journal of Theoretics, Hadronic Press, Journal of New Energy, the Proceedings of numerous international conferences, and others listed on the website which I am not allowed to mention on this forum. Where have I or any other moderator told you that there are some things you're not allowed to mention here at EvC Forum? You have swerved off-topic on many occasions and so have been requested many times to confine your discussion in each thread to the topic of that thread. You have never been told that there are things you can't mention or discuss at EvC Forum. I now require that you post a response to this message at Report discussion problems here: No.2 within 24 hours or be suspended for a week. In that thread you will post a message indicating precisely the message or messages where you were told which things you can't mention or discuss at EvC Forum, or you will post that you misspoke or were mistaken. Anything else and I will suspend you for a week. Please, no replies to this message in this thread.
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Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
Viv Pope writes: I've been racking my brains as to why it is that in 2009 a simple, serious and straightforward suggestion of the non-velocity of light evoked so much reflexive hostility. Viv, I don't know why this is proving so difficult for you to understand. This thread is not about your perceptions of how you're being treated. It's about issues related to the speed of light. If you feel you're being met with undue hostility then the proper thread for even mentioning the possibility is Report discussion problems here: No.2. See you in a week. Edited by Admin, : Typo.
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Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
Hi JustATruthSeeker,
Instead of posting off-topic messages here and elsewhere, could you please take your electric universe discussion to the thread you were using last year: The cosmic conspiracy. Thanks. To everyone else: please, no responses to JustATruthSeeker in this thread.
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Admin Director Posts: 13029 From: EvC Forum Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
Hi JustATruthSeeker,
I'm not a participant in the discussion. I don't have a position on the topic. I'm moderating, not discussing. It is the practice here at EvC Forum to request that members who have one answer for everything to confine their advocacy for that answer to a single thread. You appear to be a member who has one answer for everything, namely the electric universe. Therefore I'm asking you to confine your participation to the The cosmic conspiracy. thread. Or you can propose a new thread over at Proposed New Topics and I will review your proposal as quickly as practical.
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