'Some still living' disproves literal truth of the bible

Calypsis says:
"It was fulfilled, in part, in the experience of the apostle John who saw the kingdom come in Revelation. Some of the other disciples got a glimpse of it also. Check out Pauls words in II Corinthians 12:2. The 'man in Christ above 14 years ago' was actually himself. But even if one doesn't take that as Paul himself, whoever it was saw the kingdom."Stat: This kind of response seems to be endemic among believers. Here he equates a vision, dream or hallucination with actual seeing of an event. So if I dream about Caesar crossing the Rubicon, I have SEEN him cross it? Not even close!

Peeple,It certainly IS a challenge and one I've never seen a believer give a good response to. Here's another. In Ezekiel 26, it says that when Tyre is destroyed it will never be rebuilt. And I was taught in parochial school exactly that - that it was never rebuilt. The teachers and preachers were parroting what they'd heard and never bothered to check out the facts.In reading history, I found that it had been rebuilt multiple times. Then I read the Lebanese tourist site and found it was a thriving city. Finally, (somewhat later), I got on Google Maps and looked at it from the satellite view. Sure enough, the island, the causeway and the mainland are covered with a thriving city!

Do I? I've already heard that silly response and others.

First, that's no indication of superhuman powers if you just make a statement about a future even and then go stage the fulfillment.Second, we have no external confirmation the 'fulfillment' ever happened.Third, that's really stretching it to say he was a king and that was a 'coming into his kingdom'. He was an itinerate preacher who may or may not have made a not all that impressive an entrance into the city. Further, there is no kingdom involved.

Icant,Excuse me but why are you posting this material to me? I am likely much more familiar with it than you are - unless you have a theology degree.

Icant,One more thing, you say: Thanks for that admission. You are making my point. Since this did not happen, the prophecy (assuming it was ever made by Jesus) was NOT fulfilled.

I’ve been slow to respond because I’ve been thinking about what you said from time to time since you said it. This msg will be somewhat peripheral to the topic. I may post a more direct response later. What I said was based on your lengthy response in msg 69. It was stuff I am well aware of and which anyone could have posted after going to an apologetics site. In looking at some of your other msgs, I notice you comment on greek words. These also could be looked up. Alternatively, you may have formal course work in the language. In your latest response, I see mention of your first year students, so I presume you are a teacher of religious classes. However, I also note that you did not mention having a theology degree. Could you clarify what your education and occupation are?My statement was also based on the reasonable assumption that you were an average American. In my view, the average American knows very little about the Bible and has had no formal instruction in it. I on the other hand, have had such instruction in 4 years of parochial boarding school where we were immersed in the matter as well as 4 years of parochial college. In addition, I’ve done far more reading than the average American on the subject. I suppose so. More advanced students have generally either accepted the answer they were given (gullibly in my view), rejected it but do not wish to belabor the point, (a few) or dropped out of school entirely (a few). In my case I once accepted one of the three apologetic answers I am aware of but later rejected it. I have no grade at risk from a teacher and I am not bogging the class down on a point. I initially was rather annoyed by your statement for not one but two reasons. I have made absolutely no claim in any post on this board to any degree. And I find your questioning of my veracity is annoying too. I have no reason to lie. I’m here to have a civil and mature discussion. For the record, I do have a bachelor’s degree in math with a minor in physics.Finally, you ask me several question. The answer is no, I am not a believer. Edited by AdminPD, : Off Topic

Duh! Ya think? I’m getting the impression you’re none to bright when you tell the blindingly obvious to an intelligent 68 year old. Save it for a third grader - it MIGHT be appropriate for them. Do you know how many times I’ve heard that a person must be a believer before they get the secret decoder ring? Does it occur to you that if a msg cannot be understood by the audience then the author of the msg is a poor communicator?I do appreciate your responses on your education and experience. Edited by AdminPD, : Off Topic

I do appreciate that there is a board moderator. But in my view, your remarks would be better directed at Icant. I was simply expressing my displeasure at him talking down to me (repeatedly), questioning my veracity and my ability to understand the Bible. I had hoped to get back on topic when these issues were resolved.

1. I agree this is a claim about an event that has not happened.
2. ‘bema seat judgement’? I heard the phrase more than once about 50 years ago in parochial HS & college. If it means God’s judgement seat, fine. If it means something else, you need to clarify. 1. You claim these 2 verses refer to two different events. That is not evident from the context. You’d have to substantiate that.
2. You are claiming this refers to the Triumphal Entry’. You’d have to substantiate that too.
3. Regarding your definition of basileia, Several sources said it was the name of a female or a festival. I did find this also and it does not support what you say:http://www.kypros.org/cgi-bin/lexicon
Basileia - kingdom4. You make some other claims which I won’t comment on.
5. I find it absurd that anyone would take Matthew 16:2, Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. to be equivalent to Some of you will see me stage a big entrance into Jerusalem.
6. I’ve seen 3 different explanations for how this verse was fulfilled. I find all of them disingenuous.

Icant says: Please try to present a convincing argument. A msg that boils down to 'trust me' is unacceptable. It also gives me nothing I could use if I were convinced by you and found myself in your shoes.