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Author Topic:   Smelling The Coffee: 2010
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 147 of 270 (542681)
01-11-2010 8:43 PM
Reply to: Message 145 by Granny Magda
01-10-2010 11:33 PM


Re: Christian Nation?
Hi Granny. I was going by memory and if my memory serves me will we all, back there, my ole buds Washington, Adams and Jefferson all had the Bible and Watts Hymnal in our schools.
Seriously, I believe the schools had those two books from the colonial days. The New England Primer was a standard as well from the times of the colonies. It was the book which taught the primary children the alphabet, the Ten Commandments and all. It was totally Biblical based; all of it.
I'll do some research and get back to you as to whether I have it all correct, with some specifics.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by Granny Magda, posted 01-10-2010 11:33 PM Granny Magda has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 148 by Granny Magda, posted 01-11-2010 9:25 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 149 by Coyote, posted 01-11-2010 9:28 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 153 of 270 (543173)
01-15-2010 9:03 PM
Reply to: Message 151 by Hyroglyphx
01-14-2010 9:38 PM


Re: Its Education, Stupid
Hyroglyphx writes:
Buzsaw, there is no religious connotation in mathematics or language. There is no pertinent need to introduce such. Anything less is a direct infringement on the Separation of church and State.
What exactly are you calling for? Prayer in school? Creationism to be mandatory reading material? Compulsory attendence to bible classes?
Hi Hyroglyphx.
I'm calling for whatever the local elected school boards decide upon for their schools. If they decide that the New England Primer, having religious connotations would be good for their school, there should be no laws from the state or feds forbidding that. If they decide that prayer is allowed before classes so be it. If they decide that the Koran, the Bible or even the Communist Manifesto is to be curriculum, so be it. If they decide that nothing religious is to be in their local school, so be it. Let the voters via their representatives determine what their children are taught. That's the way a republic is suppose to work.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 151 by Hyroglyphx, posted 01-14-2010 9:38 PM Hyroglyphx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 154 by Coyote, posted 01-15-2010 9:15 PM Buzsaw has replied
 Message 155 by anglagard, posted 01-15-2010 9:41 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 158 by Hyroglyphx, posted 01-16-2010 10:19 PM Buzsaw has replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 170 of 270 (543403)
01-17-2010 7:17 PM
Reply to: Message 158 by Hyroglyphx
01-16-2010 10:19 PM


Re: Its Education, Stupid
Hyroglyphx writes:
Votes don't usurp the Constitution. If you want to discuss God in school, that's why private schools exist.
Hi Hyro.
It wasn't exclusively for private schools in the days of the founders, in whose public schools prayer and Bible were everyday events. Why? Why didn't the founders rise up in protest as you people would rather than supporting it?

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 158 by Hyroglyphx, posted 01-16-2010 10:19 PM Hyroglyphx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 172 by Granny Magda, posted 01-17-2010 7:35 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 181 by Hyroglyphx, posted 01-17-2010 8:56 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 182 by dwise1, posted 01-18-2010 3:40 AM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 187 by Blue Jay, posted 01-18-2010 11:30 AM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 175 of 270 (543410)
01-17-2010 8:10 PM
Reply to: Message 154 by Coyote
01-15-2010 9:15 PM


Re: Its Education, Stupid
Coyote writes:
You'd be sore annoyed under a muslim theocracy. I suspect your attitude would change real quick.
How about we keep all religious indoctrination out of the public schools, eh? That's what churches et al. are for anyway, isn't it?
1. Islam law is outside the parameters of the Constitution. It mandates prayer five times daily, violent subjection to it's repressive laws and punishment when any other than their god Allah and their prophet Mohammed is venerated, worshipped or advocated. It's rigid agenda is to establish a state religion as was that of the popes and bishops of the RCC in the Dark Ages.
When a specific religion becomes established by law contrary to the Bill of Rights there no longer the freedom to vote for or against it.
2. When the Bible, The New England Primer and Watts Hymnal were in the schools there was no religious denomination or specific doctrine taught. By representation from the republic majority of the voters, these books were used. Today the republic majority have elected leaders who have disallowed these books. That's how the republic is suppose to function.
Unfortunately, the more secular the schools become, the more delinquency, crime, suicide, drug abuse, civil unrest etc we have. Interestingly, that's what the Bible predicted would happen, that things would get worse when the precepts were not applied. History attests to that.
The majority of the curriculum in the early schools was the three Rs, reading, writing and arithmetic as well as hygien, science, history and social studies. In the colleges and universities (most of the great ones like Harvard, Yale and Princeton originating as Christian, being founded by clergymen) the higher maths, sciences and skills etc were taught. I understand that most had chapel services.
But my, oh my, didn't that produce just terrible and oppressive graduates who wrecked the republic, reduced it to third world welfare and insurmountable impoverishment!

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 154 by Coyote, posted 01-15-2010 9:15 PM Coyote has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 178 by Coyote, posted 01-17-2010 8:32 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 179 by Rahvin, posted 01-17-2010 8:44 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 186 by Dr Adequate, posted 01-18-2010 9:13 AM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 201 by ZenMonkey, posted 01-19-2010 2:28 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 195 of 270 (543522)
01-18-2010 8:28 PM
Reply to: Message 161 by Asgara
01-17-2010 2:58 PM


Re: It's a Republic Stupid
Asgara writes:
The "mob rule" discussed here isn't the fear of an actual physical "mob" of a large gathering of people. Mob rule refers to a large group of people voting away the inherent rights of a smaller group of people. It wouldn't matter if they were physically congregating at a voting place or voting from a distance using technology.
Like the first 2 centuries of our republic when gays were homosexuals in closets and considered, like adultery, as devient from the norm or decent by the majority of voters; when wedlock was something not to be outside of and when aids was a roll of digestion helps or folks who helped others?
Like when the mob American voters, including the founders who considered the right to pray in government or schools to be ok with the Constitution?
Like when the mob American voters considered the living soul and body, including eyes ears legs, hands with fingers and having the ability to sense pain in the mother's womb to be an unborn baby person?
Like the mob American voters who elected representatives who figured that if the owner of a house wanted to rent it, he/she who had the money and work invested could determine who rented the house.
Like the mob American voters who figured that the one owning a business could hire or fire an employee who received pay from the owner for work in the business which the owner/invester had built up?
Like the mob American voters who thought that if a person of age refused to work that person should not have a right to receive food, clothes, cars, TVs, casinoes, cigarettes, soda pop and movies, all at the expense of the workers?
Like the mob American voters who figure that a worker and business owner should not be obligated to unuionize in order to receive special treatment by law.
If a majority of people in your district thought it was a good idea to stone you you would be ok with that? That would be direct democracy and an example of "mob rule."
If punishment was for selfishly snuffing out the life of a fellow citizen, I might want to move into that district so as for me and my family to live in peace and quiet.
If it was for adultery, I'd likely move to a different district where the voters dealt with the situation like Jesus did. "Let him who is without guilt throw the first stone."

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 161 by Asgara, posted 01-17-2010 2:58 PM Asgara has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 196 by Asgara, posted 01-18-2010 8:59 PM Buzsaw has replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 260 of 270 (544110)
01-23-2010 8:04 PM
Reply to: Message 196 by Asgara
01-18-2010 8:59 PM


Re: It's a Republic Stupid
Asgaral writes:
You see Buz, ma dear, this is exactly what I"m talking about. The majority does not have the "right" to legislate away the "rights" of others. A right is a right, whether you're part of the majority or a minority of one.
But dear heart, many laws legislate rights from some and to others. That's how a representative Republic of the people works. Are you advocating disolution of the republic? Every law, for example, which entitles benefits from the public treasury to non-producers revolks the rights of workers to keep their hard earned $$ mandated to non-producers.
Conversely, every law which revolks entitlements to non-producers from the public treasury restores entitlements to workers allowing them to keep their earnings.
Asgara writes:
Show me one spot in American government or public education where one's right to pray has been taken away. I advise you to make a call immediately to the ACLU.
I stand corrected on this count. I'm not sure about the teachers, however. From what I'm understanding they are not allowed to lead the class in prayer, which may be a good prohibition, given the diversity of beliefs in our times.
Asgara writes:
You obviously missed the part where I specified stoning "YOU." You and your family are going about your business, breaking no laws that you are aware of. A majority of your peers decide that, for whatever reason, they don't like something you do. They vote to stone you. I take it you'd be ok with that? It is the majority making a decision. Who cares about your rights? Those don't matter.
Perhaps you missed my point which included me if I had committed murder.
During the last century over a hundred million citizens, the majority of who minded their own business were executed by secular, mostly athiestic dictator communist regimes because there was no republic majority vote allowed to repudiate the carnage.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 196 by Asgara, posted 01-18-2010 8:59 PM Asgara has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 262 by Rrhain, posted 01-23-2010 10:28 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 261 of 270 (544111)
01-23-2010 8:33 PM
Reply to: Message 258 by Rrhain
01-22-2010 9:44 PM


Re: Low turnout
Rrhain writes:
In the last special election, there was only a 28% voter turnout.
You'd be turning over the government to a tiny fraction of people with no accountability to anyone.
Hi Rrhain. All who bothered to turn out and vote were accountable to the public at large whom the government represented. That voter apathy counted for the low turnout in no way diminishes the accountability of citizens who exercised their lawful right to vote their preference.
Were you, your family and like minded friends included in the 28% turnout? If not, why not?

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 258 by Rrhain, posted 01-22-2010 9:44 PM Rrhain has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 263 by Rrhain, posted 01-23-2010 10:30 PM Buzsaw has replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 264 of 270 (544127)
01-23-2010 11:35 PM
Reply to: Message 263 by Rrhain
01-23-2010 10:30 PM


RE: Messes Of Things
Rrhain writes:
If the government is based upon my neighbors and they make a mess of things, I can't vote them out. Thus, there is no accountability.
Sure you can, Rrhain. All you need do is to stop whining, muster up your likeminded citizens and convince a majority of voters to get out and vote your own mess of things into law.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 263 by Rrhain, posted 01-23-2010 10:30 PM Rrhain has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 265 by Shield, posted 01-24-2010 1:21 AM Buzsaw has not replied

  
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