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Author Topic:   Why creationist definitions of evolution are wrong, terribly wrong.
Taz
Member (Idle past 3310 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 11 of 205 (545895)
02-06-2010 12:40 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by ICANT
02-05-2010 11:46 PM


Re: why use a wrong definition?
ICANT writes:
When creationists talk about evolution this is included in their argument.
And is the part that they can not accept as having happened.
There is no first hand evidence only musings and assumptions.
Which makes the last paragraph a huge assumption.
I never understood why creationists like to make such a distinction between "micro"evolution and "macro"evolution.
Let's look at other things that have evolved through time. Have you ever seen a society macroevolve? Have you any evidence at all that a society macroevolved from sword fighting in the battlefield to fighter jets?
Have you ever seen a language evolve into other languages? Can you connect all the dots, every little change that happened to ancient latin that resulted in modern day spanish?
Your attempts at desperately trying to draw distinctions between macro and micro evolution is like drawing distinctions between different expressions in latin in different regions and it's eventual evolution into the modern day romance languages.
Edit.
Did you miss my thread about the power of accumulation?
Edited by Taz, : No reason given.
Edited by Taz, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by ICANT, posted 02-05-2010 11:46 PM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by ICANT, posted 02-06-2010 9:55 AM Taz has replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3310 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


(1)
Message 20 of 205 (545927)
02-06-2010 11:53 AM
Reply to: Message 15 by ICANT
02-06-2010 9:55 AM


Re: why use a wrong definition?
ICANT writes:
"Micro"evolution is a fact.
"Macro"evolution is an assumption.
It was not observed and no experiment can be run to reproduce the claimed results. Thus there is no empirical evidence.
Then give us the definition of these words and we'll go from there.
You got a good example there if the sword evolved into the fighter jet. Instead of the jet being created by mankind.
Are you seriously this dense or you're lying for jesus here?
The analogy wasn't about who created what. It was about lots of small changes that accumulated into large changes over time.
Do you or do you not agree that the romance languages started out as Latin? Do you or do you not agree that it took thousands of years through very small accumulated changes in those languages in different regions to result in the romance languages today? Do you or do you not agree that we don't have documentation of all the small changes that took place between Latin and modern day Spanish? Do you or do you not agree that no controlled experiment has ever been performed to "prove" that a language can indeed change by thousands of years of small accumulated changes to become another completely different language?
The analogy is about your objection that we have never seen macroevolution happen. I'm simply using your objection to show that we don't have to see or prove in the lab of something that will logically happen from things that we can already prove. Small changes can and do happen from one generation to the next in biological populations just like small changes can and do happen in the spoken language of a population. Through time (lots and lots of time), these small changes accumulate that result in a population with completely different genetic make up just like through lots of time small changes accumulate in a language that result in a completely different language in a population?
Edited by Taz, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by ICANT, posted 02-06-2010 9:55 AM ICANT has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 39 by ZenMonkey, posted 02-08-2010 2:47 AM Taz has not replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3310 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 21 of 205 (545929)
02-06-2010 11:57 AM
Reply to: Message 17 by marc9000
02-06-2010 10:39 AM


Re: why use a wrong definition?
marc9000 writes:
Why is it okay for militant atheists like Dawkins and Stenger to use the words simple and complex in describing evolution, and it’s not okay for creationists to simply repeat it/agree with it?
Because the militant atheists use those words in a completely different context than what creationists use them for. Simply repeating the word in a sentence does not make it a quotation in context.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by marc9000, posted 02-06-2010 10:39 AM marc9000 has not replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3310 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 47 of 205 (546166)
02-09-2010 1:14 AM
Reply to: Message 42 by ICANT
02-08-2010 8:59 PM


Re: why use ANY wrong definition?
ICANT writes:
Macro evolution is defined by Berekely as the changes above speciation. I have said and continue to say this has never been observed to happen. There is no first hand accounts. It can not be reproduced.
Therefore my conclusion it never happened.
There is no first hand account of Latin evolving into Spanish and other modern day romance languages. None. A language has never been directly observed to evolve into a completely different language.
Based on your logic, every criminal activity should be dismissed from the courtroom if there are no first hand accounts and that they were not directly observed. Never mind all the finger prints. Never mind all the motives. Never mind all the forensic evidence.
Actually, there is no first hand account of the 6 day creation of the universe either. And it has never been observed to happen. Ever. It can not be reproduced. At all.
I see you've fallen back to defending a ridiculous position.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by ICANT, posted 02-08-2010 8:59 PM ICANT has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 48 by ZenMonkey, posted 02-09-2010 1:22 AM Taz has not replied

  
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