PRATT Party and Free for All

Hi Rahvin. Thanks. That makes sense. Make that:
1) Doesn't the amount of atomic decay rates affect/change matter?2) Relative to carbon, wouldn't the amount of carbon 14 in the Buz-alleged preflood atmosphere have a determination in pre flood carbon dating?

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

Hi Coyote. Does it really take care of it?Logically, the amount of carbon 14 in an alleged Buz/Bible pre--flood atmosphere would affect pre-flood carbon dating whereas tree ring dating would would not be affected nearly as significantly by a changed atmosphere, being that there would be seasons in both atmospheres effecting tree rings, albeit less difference in global seasonal temperatures in a canopy atmosphere than we now have, post flood.Am I making sense here to you?

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

I think I understand this sufficiently for the purpose of this discussion. I am, for sure, alluding to the atom decay itself rather than the rate of decay. I used the wrong terminology a couple of posts back, throwing some into a tizzy. Anyhow, we need a little light and some spirited heckling and lively routiness here in the freeforall to hype it up a bit (as Bus sips his glass of cheap nevertheless good upstate NY red wine). Perhaps you misunderstood my reason for the flood/carbon dating connection. It was not the flood perse, but the pre-flood canopy atmosphere which, imo, should affect the dating methology. The vaporized water in the atmosphere relatively suddenly became condensed liquid, leaving relatively little in the atmosphere to protect the planet from direct sun rays, thus diminishing the quality of life on the planet and effecting the mother carbon 14/daughter nitrogen atom decay.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

Thanks, Coyote. This is getting interesting. I'll need some time to mull this over befoe responding.

Thanks to all recent respondents, especially Dr. Adequate. as I chew on the plate full. Off to Sabbath (7th Day) School and church this AM, in honor of Jehovah's rest (as per Lot2), resting from the 6 days of work, effecting a tad of equilibrium relative to the creator and the created, etc. Have a good'n, all.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

Hi Admin. You did'nt say no replies so I'll say it:That prospect makes me very nervous.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

Hi Apothecus.After reading this the ole man's mind's been mentaly immersed in more musings. If the Buz/Bible flood and preflood canopy hypothesis was correct, the low C14, high oxygen world where men lived centuries (and likely some animals such as dinos, etc) most likely the trees would have benefited by the ecosystem as well. The atmospheric H2O, having relatively little C14 and more oxygen, when condensed, falling to earth, perhaps resulted in a relatively high oxygen, relatively low salt consistency. Thus two (perhaps) factors relative to dendrochronology.1) More robust, healthier, and hardier plant life, including trees.2) More oxygenated seas which covered all trees which were not structurally destroyed in the flood for the duration of the submersion.Perhaps this would have allowed most of the super-hardy trees, especially the younger ones and saplings to survive the lengthy submerged state which the flood effected. If this were the case tree ring continuity would not have been abruptly interrupted and the pre-flood trees being low 14C they would date older than indicated.Perhaps, like men, etc, the life span and hardiness of trees began (I say began) to deterioriate after the waters abated.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

Thanks for weighing in here, Lyx2no. I think I got that wrong. Perhaps what I should have said is that the eco-system balance in the canopy which would have been so perfect for both animals and plants would become the condensed water which fell and covered the trees. Thus (perhaps) the best possible balance relative to the properties of the water covering the trees would have in the flood for survival of the trees so that the growth rings would show a continuous progression. I'm very sorry 2 put you 2 the trouble, lyx2, but would you mind xplaining 2 dumb laypeople who lyx 2 no what you said means?My position is that if many of the trees survived the flood there would be no gaps and Carbon dating would show older dates than tests would indicate.Further, consider this important factor relative to the unique Buzsaw Hypothesis. If you recall, my position is that since there was allegedly no Solar System until after plant life (including trees) were created (day 3). Consider also that having no Solar System, no sun and moon to determine length of days. Thus, all we would know is that the trees were older (perhaps significantly) than birds, fishes, animals and humans.Interestingly, the record does not mention insects. The implication is that they were created along with the plants since they would serve in the ecology of plant propagation.Further yet, I see RAZD, in his latest dendrocronolical science thread, emphasised the corroboration factor relative to dating. What's good for the goose should be good for the gander. I harp on corroboration incessantly, yet nobody pays any attention to the fact that there are numerous corroborating factors relative to the veracity of the Biblical record.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

Not at all, Apothecus. By corroboration I'm talking about stuff you appear to have no knowledge of. I'm talking about the extensive exploration and research by men and women who discovered the significant amount of evidence for the Exodus crossing of the Red Sea which was allegedely a miraculous Biblical event. You need to apprise yourself on that by viewing the Exodus Video and reading the book, The Exodus Case by Lennart Moller, Swedish marine biologist who did a major part of the research with his scientific vessel equipped with underwater photograpical equipment etc.Before pshawing the corroborating evidence you need to read up on the fulfilled prophecy that Buzsaw has cited in various threads here at EvC and become knowledgeable of the historical events which were the fulfillment of these prophecies, particularly relating to the restoration of the nation of Israel and other phenomena relative to the prophesied last days.You need to become apprised on much other corroborating observable data relative to the veracity of the Biblical record. I've been into this stuff for 60+ years and I know whereof I speak on some of this, just as RAZD and some of the rest of the mainline science folks think they know whereof they speak.Before throwing out the Bible baby with the flood bathwater (no pun intended) you need to become aware of and consider some of this corroborating evidence.My understanding of RAZD's point on corroboration is that where questionable dating is encountered he alleges that there's enough corroborating other dating methods to overlook some of the questional aspects of weaker methods. I'm saying what's good for the goose is good for the gander. That's why they don't last here. They have not done their homework on the prophecies and most are oblivious to the Exodus evidence etc. Furthermore most know more about the latest sports news than they do about this important stuff. I'm sorry to say most don't care. They think they will get raptured out of the world before the end time trouble hits them. All they are concerned is their salvation and winning the easy converts. One of my reasons for being here is that someone needs to show people like you that the flood event and other Biblical events like the Exodus crossing are not falacious fables. No, my friend. That's not what I do as I've tried to explain above. Click on my username and bring up my profile. Other than that, stay tuned. I do appreciate the good spirited manner in which you express your views and relate to people like me who's views you disagree with. I hope you find EvC a place to stay and bless us with your input, regardless of your ideology.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

OK, go for it, lyx2no. I've been in this debate for the long haul because I'm convinced of my position. Back in the ole days, the game wasn't over until Kate Smith (fat lady) sang and imo, she hasn't sang yet on the debate at hand. So long as by disregard you mean disbelieve, no I'll try not to waste your time. Quite often you type brief obscurities that sail right over the heads of simple folks like me. You're obviously a bright young chap who's learned a lot for your age and I respect that, having aspired to become a Biblical scholar as a youngster myself, though I'm just a sole proprieter of a small business and not a clergyman who's been run through the assembly line of the colleges and seminaries. The change would not be sudden and noticeable:1) As I have noted, likely, many of them would have survived the flood for the reasons I've stated.2) The level of 14C in the biosphere would gradually increase downline from the time of the flood.3) Many pre-flood trees likely lived for several thousand years after the flood, especially given that the current oldest tree (redwood) is over 4000 years old. . No more ad hoc than speculations like multiverses implicating space outside of a no outside of universe. It's in the English translation of the Bible. Whether you choose to ascribe to it is another matter. Ditto If you ignored my two contentions, how can you debunk my conclusions? How can you say so when you've ignored what preceeded? Youngun, you're studied and savvy on physics but cocky about your obvious ignorance relative to things you consider imaginary and trivial.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

Hi other Doc. Where were you back when the evidence was debated to debunk the imperical evidence cited? I don't remember of any significant imput on your part in those debates.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

Dock, Like I said, back then when that was the topic was when you should have supported your blind assertions above; not here. Likely you contributed to that debate about as little substantive input as you are contributing to this thread. Get a life, man.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

Hi Lyx2. I've had your message on my computer desktop since you posted it for a reminder. My glaring ignorance is causing me to devop pterygium, or something like that. I don't swear, but, unless I can say something I consider sensible I am mum........anyhow, this is so far the best I can bring up for a response. I suggest you look the whole page over and go at countering specific problems you may see in it.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

Hey, bud, I already offered my 2 cents worth on that some place in this thread. Have you been following along?

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

I provided the NDT Resource Center link from which I got it. Did you read the whole page, as I suggested, Coyote? Er, I am trying to learn. I'm not lying down and acting dead. The NDT Resource Center appeared to me to be a scientific professional source that should immensely impress eminent members.

---

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.